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Rel JOH192'* L. LEWIS, ET N.-
IFTEPfJIETT Y1-1-1»: at the Elks Club. Some of the miners at Iéine A 9 told me that there was to be a meeting at the Elk!
continued Club in Sept 1941 to decide if the PEA local should
change to U151 . I cannot remember much about the
meeting. A non the name of whom I do not know made e. statement at the
meeting, that the minors at Hino "A" would have to change to UH? or the
mine would be closed. A vote was taken end I voted to change to U35-I as
I um ole and I thought I would have been out of c job ii I had not votefor U1-PI, -
"4'z.ftcr the vote, Ednonsen of J1-ii? made e taiic at the mooting,
but I do not remember 92'-'h:..t ho said. I do not know of any UL ? organizers
being present at the Elks Club, so for as I know those present were
members of PILA.
"I worked at Tiinc "A" about one day in Sept. 1941 as a member
of U25? ct which time I 92<':~.s forced to stop working in the mine because of
11$? health. I know nothing about the activities at Mine '¥." since Sept.
1941.
I prcfor P1-Lu over and only joined UH-.' in order to keep
rgr job at Mine "b".
"I have bed this statement consisting of three pages read to
me and it is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
c
ritncwod:
, Special Agent - F.B.I.
peoiol iigcnt, F.B.I."
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Re: JOHN L. mos, or u.
INTERVIEW WITH at his resi-
I Winfield-
AgentsQ @-' emp eye was born in the
United States. _He speaks and but he israther slow mentally and would make only a fair uitnoss.LQ
ndvised he has never been arrested. He furnished the £0 on
signed statement.
"Springfield, Ill.
Scpt. 13, 1943
EM»
make the followwing vo un ax I_':hom I kno-.1 to be Special ngcnts esti-_-go. ion. I make it without fear of threat, force, or promise of any kind.
I 1'.-as born I I first
started working in coil mir joined
the United Iiine Korkers of America Union. I work: at theLiino ma." Springfield in ooowoq In 1932 I joined the Progressive
Liinc Workers of inerice union. joined the PM,-1 because I did not like
the actions of John L. Lewis, especially when the ballots were stolen and
he declared an emergency contract.
-- -A-92-. .L -o.-.1-| _,_ _a _1.-__-_.._ ;92_.2_ 4.4.... 1'I01-Ill: J. "I remained till i'1"0m .L9!¢ to 1.91.; ufl during uu.s
thought the Pill. was an honest and good union. I never noticed any unfair
or unusual assessments.
"I noticed no efforts by UH? to organize at Kine "I." before
19&l and I was satisfied with PLIL.
"I do not remember where I was in 191.1, but I read about
Elshoff buying Lline "1." from Ryan. its soon as I read that I knew if I
wanted my job I would have to join II!-SJ. N0 one told me so, but I knew
that because of what Elshoff had done at Mine "B"-.
"I Haber attending about two PHI. meetings right after IE3 T1315»
learned that Elshofi had bought liinc ".1". I was a Pit Committee Jan for
rhi h the FLA local #51, and at one of the meetings, I do not remember - c ,
members asked mo to go to see Elshofi about whether he was going to open
' " " - ther two committee men were not at the meeting, so I toldMine J. .. The 0the men I srogd not go to see Elshofi alone. __5o three men were elected tosee Elshoff. These men we:-e
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Re: JOHN L. mas, ET at
"I heard there were some fights after these
meetings, but I dd not see any. I did not see
any HEW men at these meetings and I do not remember
whether any one talked about going over to DIM.IN'IERii'I WITH
" I hoard that Elshoff might operate Mine "A" thru Nine "B"
by hauling the coal out that way, but I do not remember where I
this. '
"I did not attend the meetings held at !t8d.n1¬~n'B Hall or
the Elks Club because I thought these meetings should have been hold at
th PLUL
"I joined UK? after Mine "A" reopened in the fall of 1941.
No one forced or threatened me in any way at any time. I joined UHW to
get my job back at Mine "A". I would have Ercfercd to stay in FHA
and go back to work, but because I could not work in Nine "A" as a FHA, I
had to change to UIZi'i.
"I believe most of the men at Kine "A" felt the may I
did, that if they did not go over to IEHH they could not work at Nine "A"
and this was the reason they changed.
"I have not held any UH? office and was not on an of the
committees appointed by PEA to see Elshoff.
"I stopped working at Mine "A" three weeks ago because of
my health. I an presently not working.
"I have noticed no difference in working at Nine "A" under
either U2-IT or Ph2...
"I have read this statement of three pages and it is true
and correct to the best oi my I-Cn.o.'.'lCCIge.
<s1gne>i
Cifll L.{_'6nt, FeBvIo
Special £.gont F.B.I."
- 571 -
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Re: JOHN L. LE-US, ET AL
works as
14, 1943
was oorn
He is
sa.tis:Eactor;; witness. 'where he
mentally. He would make an un-
_urnished the following signed statement:
"Springfield, Ill.
Sept. 14, 1943
IIImake the,!o!ior1ng vo!untary statement to
whom I know to be Special Agents of
nv-astigo ion. I make it without fear oi throat, force or promise of
"I was born
»~- i"- "- tlv 0 "od a
SP
"I first started -.:orl:i.ng in coal mines in aboutq in
Illinois. I joined the United I-Iino Forkers of America Union in 932.
I was not forced in any my to change from Uni? to PEA. I wanted to get
buck to work so I joined FHA boo-wuss most of the men had.
"In the smmer of 19-£1 I read that Elshoff had bought Mine
"A" from Ryan and I was not happy. I thought conditions would not be
good, b.=ca.us;. of the trouble the.-ro brad been at "B".
"I did not talk
attend any meetings between
tin: I *1-ant back to -cor!-: at
Li:Ln..» "I." op-med in the fallwith.-any onc about the matter and I did not
the time Elshoff bought Mine "A" and the
Ein: "A", which was about a month after
of 1941.
"I know that-c wore some nzatingjs during this time, but I
did not go to any, and I hoard and road that most of the mo-n who had
worked at 115,11; A nan voted to go over to 3156.. But I did not go back
to work at Min. "A" until about 1 month after it opened, in about Oct.
1941, and when I diri I wont down to UR. headquarters and joined UHW.
12:» one forced or throat-2n'3d mo in any way, and I joined WSW so I could
work in Him; "A". I would haw; pr".-forred to stay with PLEA bz-cause I
thought it was a better union.
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Re: JOHN L. LE".'."'IS, ET AL
§§:f°T;§1'];:§ "I worked at Kine "A" as UH3 for about three
weeks and then I quit because of my health.
contlnuec
I have had this statement of two pages read
tome and it is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
e <s1e@d>i
"fitntiss
s;>.=¢1-.-1 ,¢_g@m, F.B.I.
_ Special A-ient F.B.I."
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ns= JOHN L. ustzs, er st. f1
WES92;iE1RVIE?i HITH
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interviewed at his residence up
eld, Illinois, on the afternoono
by Special Agen
a hen dvised that h wor e or
was closed in the spring of 1941-Durin mo that the mine was closed, _ obtained emplvyment tt lune 1: and at that time Joined the united iiine ?ierkers.
er "me 4 was reopened, he was rotrnnsferred to Kine L. He is difficult
to under t " t. Ho statement was obtained. He was F11 i11 nd is an emeriosn citizen»
ERVIETI *.i1TH was interviewed at his residence at
n the afternoon
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Sue cial szent
i*-= ~*=~ Pom of "ewe in"
- ' - ' - oldaverage wetness. At the time that I-line -F» was s ,
to return to work there, but when he heard thatr18 5
DI!
exp-e eted
purchased Mine
1., he immediately loft 5pringfie1d, and went to_where a relative
of his had a small mine which he was going to operate. He advised that he
left Springfield, because ho did not want to get mixed up in the trouble
that he expected would follow the change of
1-line B. He has u strong hatred for John L-
an nan n member Q-F Tie:-kers in r "s {Q . Ahe is empl0 He wasI No statement was 0 aineu.
-374-ownership, as had happened at
Lewis, but joined the United Mine
the L'£:1'=? in 5pIi21"'.fi91d, where
born in
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- ma. JOHN L. Lewis, or 4.1..
INTERVIW T11 TH
interviewed at
old , I111-
nois, by Special gents
Saotember 14, 1943.
lI' l'lsle|e.|n!s English well, but his memory is bed and he would not mukc e satia-He is empl as u
He stated he has never been arrested. factory witness.
Springeld, Ill.
Supt. 14, 1945
"I, S ringfield,
Ill. make the o ow ng vo on ury stn. emcnt to und¢hom I know to be Special ngentg o odors-l Bureau
c vos igc. on. I make it without fear of threat, force, or premise
of any kind.
"I was born in I um employed
es 0. digger at the Mine "1; , A .
"I first started working in eoul mines in ubouty I
joined the United Mine Workers of nnoriou Union in Sprin fie inabout P I started to work at the Hind "AL" in about min
1932 I. oined to Progressive Mine Workers of ihmeriel. Union. entire
loonl of U}-5'1 ehnged to PM; and that is wiry I did. I eunnot remember
Ihy_-we ehunged.
"In the early full of 1941 I reed that ELSI-{OFF bought Mine '2.
frczn REZIH end I thought we would have trouble at "4." like there hnd
been t Mine "B". I didn't attend Phi. meetings and the only meeting
I went to after EISHOFF bought Mine "4." we one Sunday at the Elks Club.
The men told me I would have to join URN if I wanted to keep my job. I
do not renenber who told no this but they were men I worked with. I
went to this neoting at the Elk's Club of rqr own free will and no one
forced or threatened no in my way. I voted to go over to UM beoeuse
I did not wunt to lose my job st Mine "I." eml because I was afraid we
would have the some trouble at ".1." as they h-d Qt "B", end I was tee
old to went to fight or get beat up. I hoard nnors thut the oenpn-mr
eculd 92.PCl'Ob9 Mine "A" by hauling eoul thru 1-lino "B". I don't renenbcr
very nueh that took plsooz this Elk: Club meeting.
"1 was satisfied with Pitt and would have preferred to stay
P.-Li, but I joined IMF! to keep my job und ovoid trouble. Conditions ere
-375-
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PW New it doesn't nuke 0. great deal of
continue difference to me that we nro Ill-I, but when we changed
I di" not like it, because I wanted bu ntny PHI...
"No cm frcn mm und no one from the ompluq avar tuld mo
ta Oi {H53 'j n ¢ I joined voluntarily by signing at the Elk: Club that
Sunday afternoon.
"I an years of ago, and cannot ronenbor as wall as I
used ta. This is 11 I can remember and this statement or two pcgoa
is true and on-root to the best of my knowledge. I have rand this
statcn-.-ntu
'*_'Jitne as: I I
Spooir.-1 zlggent, FBI.
Special gent-F|B-I."
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A... _ _._. _._ .,_.,i...:RE: JOHN L. LFFIS, ET AL
s interviewed ct his residenceold, Illinois, on
by Special igentcis considered as e. got! a943
en e cool miner for years-
He is not difficult to understand, has a keen memory, and an intell enee
ebove that of the average miner. It is not believed that he would be easily
confused on cross exmninatiozz. He gave information set forth in the follow-
ing stnturnent : 1 -
"Springfield , I11
CE.-,-92-I-.-.--921-new» 1"! YOIJY-vkJ'92¢¬3-l92U5l J-U J-JA
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no e e o o- ing st tenant
who have identified themselves co me
oeu of Investigation. Mo Eromi_e§_e_, threats, or con-
siderction of any kind 1:.-we been made to me to get me to make this ctetment.
"1 worked 0.: Mine A from about -until February, 1941. I was =1
member of the Progressive iiinc '~r'-.-rkere of lmuric until September 1941- Be-
fore I read the announce/nent the paper that Mine A had been purchased by
RSHUFF, I had heard oi no dissension mnong the P.EvI members. All of the men
were satisfied, except I; very few, and I think they were strong Pl-ii? members.
"When ELSHOFI bought I-lino A, there was no contract with any operator.
It was my undcrstslndirg that because there was no contract that the operator
could hire or deal with anyone that he wanted to. We thought, end it was my
opinion too, that ELSEIOFF would not cgaerote mine A unless he could operate it
with UL?-'-Y men. I thought this, and I think most of the men thought this, be-
cause of the things that they 11¢. heard about what had happened at Kine B dur-
ing the trouble there. From what we I1-d heard, ELSI-DFF favored the Ulr, and
we all thought that we would have to join the UI-$3 in order to get our jobs
beck. That was the idea most of the men had at the Progressive meeting-e that
I attended. Thnt wet m idem. fit the meetin s of the Progressives, we dis-cussed thet, erud told us cll that Ia would have
to join the IJIJFI in rrder c go our ocs e .
"Lt the first meeting held at the Progressive Hall, the men did not
know what to do. They did not decide much. it the second meeting they were
pretty discouraged, and did not get much done either. At the meeting in the
Elk: club, the men had ccmc to the conclusion that there was not much that
they could do to get their jobs buck, and that it I!-.5 the best chance for them
to join the {rm and maybe we could get our jobs back. That was my idea. Io
joined the Um! that night, not because we vented to, but because we had to in
order to keep our jzb. At least, that was my reason.
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as: JOHN L. Lens, ET AL
*" YT H Edmunson came to the meeting after it had been going
for 9. while. He talked to us, and told us that if Ia
continued joined the URN that he would go to bat for us an that
we would get our jobs back. He did not exactly Qggf
inetelx say s;, but he left it pretty plain to us that he thcu5ht_thnt he could
make ELSHOFF do anything that he wanted him to do, and he almost promised us
our jrbs back. That is the reason that I joined_the United Kine Workers.
"nthing unusuelz happened after the mine reopened, but things were
not as good as before, and loft the mine as soon as I hnd a chance to get
back into 0. Pro-rrressive Nine, because I liked the Progressive Union better.
ow a Progressive Nine. 1=-M =-
I have read the abnve Btntemnt on this and one other page. It is
llall true and accurate.
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RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, E71 AL
"" PI H * "Emunson came to the meeting after it had been going
for a. while. He talked to us, and told ua that if we
continued jeined the UEW that he would go to bat for us an that
- we would get our jebs back. Be did not exactly ig-
inetelx my s. , but he left it pretty plain to us that he thrsughtthnt he could
make EILSHOFF do anything; that he wantei him to do, and he almost premised us
-T3111 jrbg b=_=,¢1;, That is the ronscn that I jcinedlthe United Mine -Yerkers.
"liething unusually happened after the nine reopened, but things were
nzt as good as bef:-re, and left the mine as soc-n as I had a chance to get
back into a Prerressive Nine, because I liked the Progressive Union better.
ow t L» Progressive nine. I W *1 '5
I have read the abuve statement on this and one other page. It is
all true and accurate."
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RE= JOHN 1,, 1,;;".'1.<, er AL
INTERVI was interviewed at his residenoe_ l -
pringfield, Illinois, on the afternoon 0
by Spggigl Aggggtgwould not be considered as a goofmugwitness ue no understand and speak Eiglish well.
He gave information set forth in the following statement:
. "springfiela, 111
- " September 13, 191:.
~ -I make the following state-
who have identified them-
ureeu of Investigation. Ho selves to n .
promiese, threats, or consideration of any kind has been made to me to make
this statement.
"I worked at lline A frcm until about Ha:-ch 1943. I belonged
to the Progressive Fine Wlrkcrs of American until $eptember 1941 when Kine A
opened up. Before that time I was well satisfied with the Progressive line
wgrkgf of America. I preferred then to work under the FEM, and do now! be-
cause it is a better union, end they treat us better. I was not at any of
the meetings when the matter of chaning unions was discussed because I was in
the hospital at that time. I was told that they were goin to take the coalout of Mine A through Mine B if we did not join the UMW. told
me that. I joined at the 'JI5v~';_ building, in order to go to worn. .1. eiu not
lik it under the Ulfin out there because of the way they were treating the emen and would not let them talk-or anything. I quit and went to the arsenal,
A e Pro rossive Mine. I do not want to go and em now working t g
back to a UMW mine-
"The above statement on this page has been read to mo by-
It is all true and accurate. Hy name
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Re: some 1.. LIIHIS, ETAL.
ntheafroonof rl 1 *..5 interviewed n his .e.n..=ei
wm be easily unders oo , u appearsbe ow- e of the average miner. He gave information set forth in the
following statement: ~ _ .
' "Springfield, Ill.
September 15, 1943 _
E I was born-in
.1ne . make the following s a men o. who have identified themselves to me as
u of Investigation. No promises, threats,
or consideration of am; kind has been made to me to make this statement-lbnameis
"I have worked at Mine A for about six years. I was working there
when the mine was sold by R1 AN. I remember that the men at the mine changed
unions when the new company took over, but I do not remember wiry. There had
been no talk before then about changing unions that I know oi. I was
satisfied to work minder the Progressive Mine Workers, but it did not make
much difference to me which union I belonged to. I went to some of the '
meetings at the Progressive Hall when this matter was discussed. I also
went to the meeting at the Elk's hall when the men voted to go to the Ulif.
I sat in the back that night and cannot recall what happened or what was
said. EDLIUTJSON talked that night, but _I do not know what he said because I
could not hear him. I joined the Ulfl that afternoon because the rest of themen were signing up. After the mine re-opened, I saw F:-ound
the mine once. I do not know what he was doing out th e.
"I was always satisfied, and I think most of the men were ~
satisfied with the PLZW.
signed! I o
W 1:" . - _
13.1. _
F.B.I."
-380-
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" _.__ 1
Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, no AL
interviewed at his residence,
Springeld, Illinois on the _
1945 b S eoial Agents
1.-as born in
wee very difficult
d that he could not read. He did not attend
any meetings of the local and joined the UH? only Ihen he Vent bulk
to work and they asked him to sign before he could work. He did
not know what he had signed. E had always been setiefied with the
union before but did not really know much about whet the union was
or whet the difference wee. Due to his inability to read, no signed
statement nae obtained.II92"IERVIE"'*' WITH
-r 381-
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RE: JOHN 1.. Lens, st AL
located
oldINT ERVIEIJ WI TH
Epringti ,
. I H7
Spec 11:1 Agents
e nut considered as s gr, very
gave infommtion sot forth in the following statement which he refused to sign,
hut which he stated was true and scour-atet
' ='Bpr1n;,r-isid, I11__
September 13, 19439
"Hy name is I was born in
I make the following stutement to
- ' P f the Fedora have identified themselves to me to e p:.C2...z gents o
of Investigation. Hr; promises, throats, or consideration of any ki d
has been made to no to make this statement.
I have worked at Bins A for about I years. i an working there now,
and wrrkod there at the time that the local of Mine A changed from the Pro-
' " ~ f bne ice. I grossive Mine Hm-kers of America tc the United lone -furkors o r .
do nct kzncw much nbcut what h1".ppCI'1Cd at that ti 0. I know that L. new company
took over, and they changed tho maions. I did not attend any of the aeetings,
or know anything, about what happened at the meetings. I did not go anywhere
until tho mine was reopened, and went beck tc go to work. Lt that tiae I
' t 1- that time I was satisfied with the operation of the joined the Ulm, Prior r
PIJIJ, and would have been just as satisfied to work under that union. I zink
most of tho men felt the sen-1e_l_ wuy, but it did not make much difference to mo.
"I have reed the above statement cn this page and it is all true
and accurate.
- unsigned!
-582-
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HiEIVIEI -IITB "1 " under
m in under-
s on qu ons pr is not believed that
he "would make n good witnoss- His stntomcnt is as follows: He mi-
mitted ono an-ost rs: violation of the Notional Prhhibition mt.!
. t .,
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"Springfield, Illinois
Septombor 18, 1943»
-ahcxn I know to be Spec
gotions Ho throats or prcmisos of any kind have boon made to me; I
have been told I nood not nuke any st:-tement and that this statement
can be used in court.
" I onne to I M "° Mnd tur 12¢ p 1n ois on._ -smorice. i.n w:.s no 1 r g o ,G I have boon employed at Ilino "ab" since about! I was o
member 0 the United Iline liorkors Union I-t that time. I um s ill on-
oloyod at Mine '4. us o digger-
"1 re:-1-amber joining, tho Progressive Hine Uorkors union
in 1932 and joining the Unitod Lino Workers in 1941 but I have no
preference for either union. I loo:-nod about the solo of H1110 "u"
through u luttor from 1»ir._BILL 1:1.-dis This didn't norm anything to
mo. I attended o neoting of tho minors at the Elks Club at which
tho non voted to join the United Mine Workorss I voted to go ovor to
the United Mine Iorkors so I could keep my job and beoc.use all the
other non voted to go ever. I voted to go over because I lmdorstood
that ELSHOL-F wouldn't operate Mina "A" with tho Progroasivo Iiinora.
"I hove no profersnoo for either union, I only Itmt to
W"J1'k0
"I have been road the within statement consisting of one and
a hlf pogos and it is all tr-uo¢
P-' B3 -
Spr '1, I11»
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Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, ETAL.
.. w H was interviewed at his residence, Q
ield, Illinois, on ternoon o _pecial Agentst ndg id sake s good witness. DE has an
miner. He makes a good appearance, ave
and can express himself well. _!-le gave information set forth in the following
statement: -intellige
"Springfield, Ill. .
September 15, 1943
__ ____ll;Iy name is__ I was born in
I am now workin at ma e
who_ _ . __ 7 '_
ve ' tified themselves to me o 0 e e eral Bureau ha iden
of Investigation. No promises, threats, or consideration of any kind has been
made to me to make this statement.
nI worked at Mine A off and on four about years, ending in
November 1941. I worked at the mine at the ti_e that i o osed for the summer
of 191.1. At that time , and up until the mine was sold, there had been no tall-:
about changing unions. I had heard of none at all. Although the men were not
entirely satisfied with the way the Progressive Kine Workers were taking care
of them, they would have gone back to work as Progressives, and continued to
work that way if nothing had happened. I am not sure what happened there to
cause the men to change over, I was not seeing the men much in those days.
were close friends of mine, and they came to my house on__
mg , and a e to me about the situation. I did not go to any meetings
except the meeting at the Elks Club when the vote was taken to go over to the
UB3. As I understand, the men were told that they would have a better chance
of getting the mine opened if they joined the Um. Host of them wanted to get
back to work pretty badly, and I think that is the reason that they changed.
"I personally did not care much which union I belonged to. I was a
little disgusted with the Progressives at that time, and was willing to go over
to the U151 if there was a chance that the mine would open arnr sooner. That is
the reason that I joined the Uldi. I do not know that there was any talk made
to the men that ELSE-{OPT would close the mine down, or that he would not
operate with PLW men. I do not know that the men thought that EISHOFF had
anything to do with unions or preferred one over the other-
"The night that the vote was taken to change unions, EDLZUNSON '
talked. I cannot remember what it was that was said. I was not interested,
and wanted to get home. I RTIEI that they were going U155 and so I did not
pay much attention to the details.
"I had ridden to the meeting with Thar were
- 384-
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Re: JOHN 1.. I.E»'¬L'5, ant.
1;:':e1=zv1r:.. KEITH andsince I had ridden with them,W I stayed with them when _1_,_rie went over to the me buildingcon inue and EDEUND6ON's office. I do not recall what was said over
there then. EDHUNSON swore them into the UEQ. EISHOFF and
some other man came to the meeting there, and there was some talk about the
mine . I do not recall that ELSHOFF said anything about what he planned to do Iwith the mine, or said anything about the unionse I was at his office when the
' ' de ilscontract was signed.e I~do not kno or remember many of the ta .
u-ere out at the mine for a while after
it reopened. I did not know at that time that they were UB5 organizers. I
did not know what they were doing out there,
I worked for a while, and quit at line A when they changed the work
around, and put a lot more work on me. There was nothing about the union
involved in my quitting.
"I am now a member of the UHF. I would have stayed in the PEN if the
mine had reopened, hiring Pun men, but it did not make too much difference to
lB¢
"There was no compulsion that I know of put on the men by either
union either to keep them from joining the UMW or to get them to join the
T Ti-'-7U111" I
"I have read the above statement on this and two other pages. It
is all true and accurate.
<e1e@d>l
"u'ITbTE.S5ES :
B.I
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an e understood. He gave information setI ' D _P M 1 ' """' "~- ~-~----- -- > < 1 I e_ of» ~~ -- _::?e-.-_-
C, J H if
RE: JOHN 1.. Lens, er AL
INTERVIEW WITH
15 1943, by Spec
in the
statement : .0 .signed
Springfield, I11
Septanber 13, 1915.
">1; me 1= g ms onI am now an mericen c ezo rou h my father. I make the following s e-
ment to who have identified them-
-re ' . selves to uroeu of Investigation Ho-
promises, threats, or consideration of any kind has been made to me to make
this statement. It is all true and accurate. *-
"I wont to work st Kine A in 1935 or 1936. I worked there untillbout February of 1943. I an now employed at Q When I went to iline
A I was o member of the Progressive iliino Workers o erica. I joined the
Unites lino Workers in 1941 when ELSHDFF bought the mine and it was reopened,
because I wanted to work. _.
- "Until the time that 1 heard that stem?!- had bought line A, I heard
no talk about changing unions, or any disntisfnction with the Progressive Kine
Y-Torkors oi America. There were some meetings about the change of ownership
and what we would have to do about it. I went to e. couple of meetings at tho
Progressive Hell, but did not go to any other meetings. As I understand end
remember, we were told that they were going to take the coal out oi line A
through I-lino B. They told us that the would close lino A and not open itunless we would join the UIIW. s tho one who did most of the
talking end said this at the meetings attended.
"I did not go to the meeting when they voted to join the URI. I
did not went to become :1 member of the U18-Y, and did not go book to work at
the Mine for about two weeks after it was reopened because I did not want to
join the UMW. However, I finally joined the URN because I wanted to work.
"hfter the-mine reopened there was 21 lot of things that wont on '
out there. They tried to get those of us who were still strongly PIN to quit,and gave us poor rooms, docked us, and had different weights. They alsothrentondod us, and fined us -111 the time or threatened to fine us for every-
thing. ' . '
"I stayed at dine is until}! could get another job at a Progressive
0386::
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E, U
RE: JOHN L. LE-IIS, ET AL
1 "ma-w"|"n_".' 92'.1"'|' mu Bin . T 4 YUM A +Jlo In 6- 0- JV v uuvi 3?. 3-3;w -could work, and changed as soon u
er-ntinuud have changed from the FEW unless
' - I hr-.vc read the above statement on this page and one other. It
is all true and accurate. _ '
/vithat I
I would never
o keep my job.
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RE: JOHN L- LEVIS, ELY LL
I 31" iiViE'I WITH
15 n_,t considered as 1: go
undersmnding and speaking EJ511511. He gave informa-
ti-'-n set forth in the fnllmving signed. statement:
Springfield, I11
Beptcnber 15, 1933. V
-- I 'maka% the f<=11f -'-"ing atqtmwent to g who hive idwtified themselves to me to "
be P0011 .5 of Invesizigation. Us promises, threats;
or c-x=nsi=ler.'.ti:n -I-.f any kind have been made to :10. '
I wmrkcd at Mine is about -years. I wn 1941 whenthe u .i'"n at 3:! A * - H c PISA to Um"?-
I do mt speak cr unucre u -
15 well. I wont to srmo moo ings a e Prcgre,-sive Hall E the cmnpany
changed OWT1CL"Ship of A. I :1-6 nct rmumbur haw mmy meatings I want to.
As I I"G'1'lL=1'l'1bbl the pit ccmtttee made 0. report that the new company vmuld not
. adhi nybod but United H1118 wrracers, and I did not want to jcin itho Unit re 0. y
Eino ficrkars, so I quit work at Mine A. I did not go to any meetings at any
zther place.
"I was satisfied with the r-per:-.ti.on cf the Progressive liine Workers
cf America and did mt want tr, change uni-".=na-
!- - 1 l ~1 H L11- -__ u__i -i._ ____ _ .__ _nine above snrmelncnt on unis page mus Ewan ruud e mu ?ay
nd accurate. _ It is 0.11 true rs.
I Mi
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I ' -O F I
am JOHN L. LE2-IS, er AL
ITERVIE'-" WITE
Cf Se tcmbor 13, 1945, by 'h ' L} ' ' - cu 1s c IlSldCI'6d as "n good poten ss. He is no
tv underst.-.r-:1, he can express himself fairly well, and -he would be difficult
to confuse on cross examination. He gr-.'92re infornmtion set forth in the follow-
ing signed stntnent:
"5pring£iold, I1l__
September ls, 194:.
"My me 15 h I B We sq
I Lm a citezen throughny father. I en nww marking at Panther Creek no 4.I make the following stetement to qndA 4» .92 ur_ who have identified themselves co mo to be peels Agents o e e ere
ecu of Inrestigeticn. I-Io promises threats or consideration sf any kind his
been made to :10 to make this statement. It is true en-.1 accurate.
""1 wont to Lline I1 in 1953 or 1934. I was employed at liine A in 1941,
and stayed there until January 1943. During all of the time that I was un-
ployed at Mine A, I was e. member of the Progressive iline Workers of America
up until September 1941, when I joined the United I-line Workers. I jbined the
Uh? in order to keep my jab. £11 the time before that I hnd been satisfied
with the PLEI, and would preferred to stay in that union. It was a strong
PHI--' mine. I think all Pi the men were satisfied with the PHJ, and I did not
heer any talk about changing unions until the ennrnncernent in the paper that
ELSHOFF was going to operate Kine A.
Sven after th:-.t I get u. card from He asked me to
come to c. meeting. I did n;t go. I did go to e couple 0 meetings at the
Progressive H-all. I do not recall exactly what happened at those meetings.
There was a lot of talk. I-s I recall the talk was that they were going toclose down the mine, and t;92kC the coal out through Bins B, q and the
men told us that they would close-the nine down and not wnrk it i we stayed
FM. They said that we would have to join the U".IW in order to work at Mine A.
I did not want to jrin the UIIJ, and did not go tothe meeting when they 1ml;Bd
about changing unions. hon the rest of the men had joined the U12- Y, I decided
to go back to work, and to work about three days later. I would rather have
stayed in the PIN. After the nine became IJli.'1', they would not let us talk at
ell abrut things at the nine. The old men were not allowed to speak their
c-In languages. Those of us who they thought were still strongly PHW, were
given pen! rooms, and treated poorly. They were trying to get us to quit.
They kept an armed guard at the mine shaft for Quit n while after the change
and the opening as UM-J. There never he-.d been an armed guard there before.
- 389-
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RE: JOHN L. LE-1'18, ET LL
They tried tr: keep us frr-m saying anthin about working
canditisns, and threatened those of us 0 were strongly
P291. They put :2. lot of "docks" on us, and them In-I 8- fcontinuzchange in the weights of the coal-
"G110 day I he-atrdq and aoveral >1 the ccmpuny men, yrho worestrongly far the UH? talking, t t pretty aocn they wsuld have 01¢ Test, and
s".r.e cf the athur P;-E1 minet in u short time-
' Thoy cl an fined us if we did not buy zfur coal at Mine A.
I wh is He stayed in the mine '~fi'5.ce every,:now c . -
tar rning fwr alwng time after the mine reopened. I do not know what he waa
suppose-'2. tr be zloing there.
"As soon as 0 enei um, and I could get anather job,
I quit Ilinc. A, and won ' w<r so that I would nst have to con-
tinuu ta waric under tho U11-£4.
I have read this stutcnnent :n this and one other page. It is all
true and accurate.
/B/ _L
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J- 0, *'
u-no
E1 by Special isgents -
- speaks very poor English I -
and I cooperative, he apparently
does not have much pertinent information relative to instant case. It isbelieved ho would be a Boer witness. There is set forth below the signed
statement executed oy
"Sept 15, 1943LE .
m"r2;2v1e;; 1.1111 -
Springfield, Ill.
"I make tho following voluntary statement to -
special Agents of the Federal Bureau of Investi- _
gation. .-o '-.61 s or promises have been made to induce me to make any ' .
statement. ,
"I was born and become a U.S. citizen
in - I work at Kine new an my o. rose is
I have been .- 4. r . '.I - 1 1 .92 _-.. _ v- '_ 1_ __ -a rorber of tho U L ' . since and have
my life, stortco vroz-ring, et Line A in r-.oooo=o.nd 1'"-36
In 1932 when the rest of the men joined Progressive I also
signed up for that union. I thought the PLIA was a good union. I remember
t-hot liine n woe shut down in the spring, of 1941 and some time in the late
summer I heard that Ryan sold Lino A to -E15hOffs
"I hoard that the P1413. had some meetings in the fall .01 1941after the mine was sold, but the only one I attended was the one at tho e
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u_-» _.;drr~'a- -r 1>'"'T'T Fm IYon! "l'L&I bli 0-n-nu.-4 us. --an 92
Agent: IITERVIEI WITH by Special
I an
' 19A at pring ie d,
but it was difficult to make him
stated that he knew little of the facts
t that he would not :.'.-eke s sat-isiactory.!itness= I-Ie furnished it is
the following-signed statement.
Sept_ 14, 1943
Soringfield, I1l_
ke the following voluntary'statementto pecial Agents of the Federal Bureauof Investigation. No threats or promises have been made to induce
me to make any statement.
n was born ir. and presently reside
at esentl em loye y a contractor by the
"I started work as a miner in Line A in about-and Joined
ive union in about the U.E.£. at that time. I joined the progress
1932 when the rest of the men Joined that union. I did not have _
anything to do with the starting of progressive. As far as I am
concerned everything was going along fine in the mine in the spri
of 1941. I have never held any office in any uion and was never
interested in union affairs. _
"I remember that somebody told me in the fall of 194,1 that
h -Elshoff had bought Line A. I never attended any of t e pro
gressive meetings that were held at that'time. I didn't go to
any meeting at the Plks. I went-up pith a bunch of men to the
United hine office and signed up with United, I joined to keep
king and because the rest joined. Nobody ever threatened me or
1 any union. I was in poor heal
so I didn'tHOT
to poor
I have read this statement of 2 pages and it is true to the
best of my memory. * I _
' Q /?/ IIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
"Hitnesses " .
/S/ ! pecial agents, FBI
! U. st, Dep_t__ of Justice"
-i-$929
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Q? _ 9292
Re: JDH L. LEMIS, srit
92
F 3 A 92iITH was interviewed Special Agents
S ' - left Mine A when it close
down in 194 and states that he has no knowledge of what
1éE¥! happened subsequent to this. He is not, therefore, being recommended as a
S " witness. He furnished the following statement:
.,
A .
.1
'*-#5
-an. -, 17'3-I'- x.' "Springfield, Illinois
_ _ ' September 15, 1943
voluntary sta
Special Agents in thethe following
knowing them to be
threats or promisest to
have been made to me to induce me to make a statement.
1L _ - ployedI .i.--__,_'E p OJ
;e;;.i time and I have never belonged to U.H.W.
§
"-1; _ .4SpringI am now em-
1933 to the
ive Kine Korkers during all of that
"I left Kine A in the Spring of 1941. At that time the ndne was"'7:; strongly Progressive. I do not know anthing concerning the switch over to
.,,,-,
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_" NITNESSED:
Special Agents, F.B.I.,"E,?s;;§ United Kine Workers.
"I have rend the above statement and declare it to be true and
signed! _
U. S. Dept. of Justice"
- 393 -
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RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL
iEl"ERVIEW WITHwas int orviowed Special Agents
does endnor 5 Engl s , on s preoen y
suffering from eye trouble. Due to his inability to understand English well,
he knows little of whet happened at Mine It and is not recommended as e wit-
ness. Bis statement is as fellows:
n _ e "Sept. 17, 1943
Springfield, I11.
, make the following volun-
tary statement to o ol Agents of the Federal
Bureau of Im-est' threats or have boon node to induce as
to make o statement-
"1 we we no we e the 11- 8- in Q
and on not o U. S. citizen. I have been e miner all my life end started we -ing ot Kine A in about end em still working there. I first joined the
U. II. W. end in about 195.. joined Progressive. As for es I knew there is-
n't any difference between the two unions." I have never paid much attention.
t o union not ivities .
In the early fell I heard that Ryan sold Liino A to Elshoff. I
didn't fool good obcut it, because I was afraid I would lose my job. I heard
o lot of talk, but didn't understand much of it us I don't understand much
English. Somebody said they might work Mine A through llino B and somebody
else seid maybe no work at ell.
"I didn't go to any of the Progressive meetings that I remember of.
I know that I wont to some hell end signed up for the U. M. W. after every-
body else signed up.
"Nobody ever threatened no or beet me up. I joined U. Li. '1-T. because
I wanted to keep my job. Since I om getting old I wanted to be sure I had e
301'-H
This statement has been reed to ms la and it is true
to tho but oi my memory.
/=/ l
Witnesses
Special Agents, FBI u
U. S. Dept of Justice
- 394 -
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re; J01-IH L. LFTIS, m AL
IIHEWIET TIT}-1 1"'a:s in erviered on So ember 9 19 '
by SPOCIL nqents
r- xno B, I iv»-in-: A.-.= -. nrnnn n
_ J.tJI3J.492-5|-3 u up-¢-u ------ -P------Eic T-'ou1d make a goo! 92"1!ness as he cleaz1; and wtould be
-_1iiiicult to confuse on cross examination. i-[is intelligence is above that
of the aver.~._~;c r.1iner._ He furnished the follcming information as contatned -
in a signed stateueznt. Q!
_ Springfield, I11w S0ptcnbul" 9;
I '8'-B hm in
foll ng stetment to iQ Tho have identified therzsclvos to no 5 of
Fe em]. Bureau oi Investigation. 1'10 proniese, threats, or consideration
of my kind has been nnde to no to 11:;T:T'¬TT:'Cs-'stato::.ent. I an lling if
necessary to"fg'5 to court and repeat any part of this statement."l1 '-I. DQIWC 1511 J1. l._,,L l'1<".KB HG
"I Yorked Pt Iiinc from 1921, until 1941. I have always been
actlve in the locals at nine A, 921hQn it ras UM. and also Then it was
V'J.11C8 cormittce of both locals. P3}, I vr.-as on th
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an JOHN L. mzxs, ET AL.
1? Ir, ITH
OD l1'11lE3
"ilinc J. was closed C11J.1"i}§ the sunuor of 1941. The non at the
:.1:Lnc rare mostly roll satised with the way the local was being operated,
and were satisfied vith being PIE. nonbcr. In 1932 than Iiinc A 1;:-cal
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ne= JOHN 1.. Lo;1s, er AL.
F ' 1' was formed there were 28 men who voted to take the -
cut that John L. Lewis Wanted. I118 rest of us voted
continue to take the cut. That was when the P1"°8I955iVe 15-"9 .
Tiorkers of America was formed. These 28 men at "
i-iizae A more or less stuck together during all the years, and I think they all
1" anted to go back to the U}_[:. some of them Kent to the IN? meetings, I 88'
them. Aside from these men, the rest of the men were satisfied to belong t°
the P1-L of A. Bill Evan, who had been running Mine I. had been hard to get
along; with for a long time, and had always wanted to have the mine go back .
to the UEL. I know, because I heard him any so.
"Along in the sunmer of 1941, rumors started going around that liven
was going to sell Mine I. and that the coal would be taken out through
Lfine B. I know that that could be done. I1; Y-as well known that 2-tine 3
and Mine B were connected. They used the ame air shaft, and there
Vere several places v-here the entries from I; and B went to within 20 feet
of each other. Then there were some old vorlclngs that ran straight across
from A. to B. Host of us imevr that beceuesc once we had to go out from
Hine A through I-line B.
"Soon after the announcement come out in the paper that
Elshoff was going to operate Hine I-., 1 got a letter from the
Uniteed Inc Rorkors. It was a form letter, printed, and was signed by
Féy Frzunson. It con: through the mziil. its near as I can remember, ,
the letter said that Elshoff was going to operate Mine L, and that he
1";;s going to take coal out of mine 1. through Mine B, and that we would
not be able to Work unless we joined the UNITED T{INE-F-OFKEIEL. The 1011-Br
stated that if fro joined the United Mine Tickers that Iiine It would be '
opened, and we vould be able to T 0IK.- He invited us all to join the
. United Mine Tforllceru. I think all of the men at Mine A got such alettcr.
I do not rencznber what happened to my copy.
"Following the ennommeemont in the paper that Elshoff 92a5 going to
operate Mine 1., and the receipt _of this letter the Special Meeting of
local #51 "res held. I think that the committee which was elected that
night could not find Eilshoff, md cane beck and reported that. The men
on that comittee that I can remember are deed nor. 1.1; the Second meeting,
these men reported that fact, and a new committee Y-as appointed to see Elshoff.
This new cornittee res undo up of men from the 28 who had not ranted to fem
the P15; in 1932. I think that they got zihold of Ljlshoff, but I do not knov.
"ht the first meeting not nuehr-es done but talk about the situation,
the possibility of not being able to tork Mine A then they were takint
coal out from B, etc. The committee being appointed was about the only
business taken place.-_--.-nu-- .
-397-
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H2: JOHN L. LE7IS, El LL.
"ht the econd meotin the committee which is
named uasINTEEYIHF EIITH
Lyontinueu
others talked. They solthe Eli. -thr-er-' his hot on the floor, and said that we were goingoen to a nee mg, an
the mzme would be worked if we would Join
aver to the U1-5'. then. That is vhen I decided that they union would prob-
ably go over, so I got uptend left right then.
' "Another meeting was hold at H;>dn:m's hall a couple of days later.
I did not go to that meeting, but I saw: announcements and advertisements
in the paper about this meeting. Edmunson was supposed to have talked to
the men at that eeting. _-n
"I have read the above statement on this and four other pages;
it is all true and accurate.
/S-
/s/ no.1.
181 fQ3Q1'1'L FBI
#398-
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RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ETAL
1
w wrra Agents
does not under- "
in not in
possession of much pertinent information. Due to his inability to clearly
understand, he is not recommended as a witness. Ha statement is as follows:
" Springfield, Illinois
1 Septamb 18, l%3
"I nuke the following voluntary statement
to n knowing them to be Special Agents in ~
s s have been the Fedora ureeu oi Investigation. Ne threats or premi emade to me to induoe me to mliko e statement. I presently reside at _
-111-1 em employed at liino A.
"I was born linW1 W *° "W
U. S. in I am not e. U. S. oitizon eltoug I've my first papers.
I have been e miner most all of my life and joined Ul when I came to Spring-field. 1 started at liine A about -and when Progressive started in 1932
I also joined. I hed nothing to do with forming P.2=-IJ1. and I an not sure why
P.H.£». started; there was some trouble with JOHN L. LEWIS.
. "In the fall of I941, I get o letter from RYAN telling tht
he had sold Mine A to ELSHOFF. Everybody said if we didn't join UJLW. the
mine weuidrt open, others said that if we joined U.1%.. are would go beer to
work. I don't understand English too well and am not sure as to everything
that was said. _
"I wont to o. meeting on Monroe Street between 4th and 6th
and there ms e let of discussion as to whet the men would do. Most of the
men said we would have to join U.H.; . if we wont beck to work. There was
about eighty men nt this meeting. I didn't see arur fights", no one threaten-
ed or beet me. I next went to 0. meeting at the El1c'e Club. EDHIHTDSOII
talked there. I don't understand ell of the English words But he said if
we wanted to join U.!=l.W. we could, but we didn't have to. Ho oeid they
didn't went any trouble. Everybody signed up for U.ll.'il'. then, I did tee.
What else eould I do - I minted to keep my job and ell the rest of the
follows Joined U.}.!.W. The unions ere about the some anyway.
"This §tD.'be1'n0r.t ms been reed to me by and it is ti"!-lu
and eorreet to the best of my memory. I II2I- " i itneesed: I J
Special Agents, FBI
U. 8. Dept. of Justice
= -see- - .,
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rm. Jam: 1.. L="~'1=I. BI L
vms interviewed bv
Special Agents an
barely understands English and
speaks in e very broken dialect, s believed that he would be a peer
witness inasmuch as it was very difficult to make him understand the an-
ing cf questions put to him b A ants. There is set forth below the signed
statement executedT'l.1'1"17"C_I'UT§'T'I T'l'T".|"'D'
Sept. 17;
Sinwi n-Pi I-:13 T11 s-3 - b..--.----, ----v
"I, make the fe11o':ri.n; voluntary statement to
poeial agents cf the Federal Bureau of Inves-
tiga. lea. Ne threats cr promises have been made to induce me to make any
statement .
"' o U S I was burn i :.me t the . . in
-and have been r. citizen since Sept. er ct. 0 I gave been u.niici all my life anr. an still workiilgj, at Liine A. Lfy address is=
"I started worl/:in{; at I-line A in 1927 & jeinoci the PHI; in 1932-
1Thcn I heard thzt Ryan had sold Mine J. to Elshoff I was afraid I would lose
my job. Everybody said Elelzeff might net open the nine-
I don't um'.orst'1nd much English so I have never gene to may
union meetings. I went to the zoeting at the Elks Club in the fell of
1941 and joined the U. E. LI. when all the rest did. Iiobcy ever beat Tue
up and I joined U11. because I though I wouldn't be able to work if I didn't
sign.
"This statement has been row. to mo by _a.nd Irish to
state it is true to the best of my :nczmory-
/=/ j
"'.1'itncssed: -
/8/ $pO .-10.1 h6Cnt5| F0 BO IO]
/s/ U, s. D0p't_, of Justice."
-400-
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92 t 92. 1 :_, K: - a
JOHN L. LEWIS, ETAL
TE red by Special Agents
I He knows but little
' . not recommended ls
a witness. His statement is as follows:
' Springfield, 171111.01:
. September 16, 1945
I
mek the following voluntary stateme and1, knowing them to be Special Agent in of Investi-
gation. No threats or promises have been made tome to induce me to make a
-J iv _ _A_ST-5'GBIFBI1'Gs
and am
J. sixau ova; uuug lino 4;. Prior to that
Then I started at Mine I. I joined the .
as I know, the unionw as all right and the"I was born on
now employed
5 n Qhnlifi -5;; -.-1».---1
time I had
Progressive Union
men were satisfied.
The mine was closed in the summer of 1941 and some-
time during late summer I learned that the mine had boon sold to ELSIDFF.
It didn't moon anything to me when I heard of it. I know 17-hBIB_I6I8
some meetings held by the Progressive men from Mine A, but the only one
I attended was at the Elks Club. t&lked at this meeting. I re-
member that at this meeting someone said that unless we joined U.ll.'H.
ELSHOFF would not open Mine 4., or else he would hoist coal from line 1.
through Mine B. _
The men voted to join U.M.W. at this time, it seems
to me the men stood up. fie signed curds to join U.!l.1'I. EDMUNDSON talked
" dn"tto us at this meeting but I do not remember what ho talked about. I di
p9.}' much et-tention to when one going on, I was just tooling around. I
t threatened or beaten but joined U.ll.W. freely, to keep my job, it was no
didn't mike any difference to mo. When we wont book to work under UJIJI.
things were about the same, I didn't see any difference. I quit line I. in
January, 1943 because I wanted to got another job. The mines were not good.
£01 $0 -
"I have road tho above statement and declare it to be
t""° and °°*"'°°t . 1
w11=T1°"°° /V _
Special hgonts , FBI
U. S. Dept. of Justine
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es. JOHN 1.. 1.1:.-ms, mt
"I as interviewed by em. =~ 1» -1===»~ =~== M» -==
ment that he had no in ormation of "value to instant ease.
It is believed he would make e. oar witness. There is set forth below thlsigned statement executed by h
" S t 16 19459P s
i Springfield, I11.
I, make the following voluntary stats-
ment to Speoiel Agents of the Federal Bureau '01
Investiget on. o hreete or promises have been mde to induce me to mks
any statement.
_ "I was born on d became s U. B.
oitizen in I reside at en ve eon employed at line
A since
"I was working at Mine A in 1932 when the progressive union
was started and I joined the PMA then. I never have gone to may union meet-
ings and never paid much attention to union business, so I do not know nuoh
about the union activity at Mine A. I don't like trouble and it doesn't
-make any differenoe to me which union I belong to as long as I work.
I resell that Mine A shut down in the spring oi 1941 and
sometime in the early fall I saw in the paper that RYAN had sold Mine A to
E151-IOFF. I didn't feel bad about it and had no feeling or opinion that the
mine would be operated by united men. _
<.
I know that the P.ll..e. held some meetings in the month of
Sept. as the other men told me about it. I didn't attend aw of the meetings
at the P.M.A. hell or Redmn $.11. I also remember going to e meeting on o
Sunday and at that time the men decided to join the United. I don't know
for sure whore this meeting was held, but I remember EDHONDSOM talked. I
know the meeting was not at the U.M.W. or the P.H..:1. hull. I joined the
UJLW. at this meeting, but do not remember any of the names of the speakers
or what they talked about.
This statement has been reod to me b_and it is true to the best of my memory. p
W tn sees: ' i e
Mi
U. S. Dept. of Justice"
- 402 -
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~' 92.
'7 0
RBI JOHN L. LEWI$, ET-BL
mrenvmw mm was int - ed s eoial Jsgent-e i
and is friendly and eo-
operetive, but appears to have little information ooneernin;
the deteile of the eeitoh in unions at liine .f.. If neoeeeery, however, he
could be used as e witness to testify to those matters set out in the follow-
ing statement:
" _ _ Sept. 16, 1943
- -" Springfield, I11.
ment to , Special agents oi the Federal Bureaumake the following voluntary etate-
oi Inves?i oi trF5¬ts or promises have been mode to induoe me to
make any statement.
"I W8-s born on &nd presently 1at '-"-""""""' I started ln|"01£1il-§ at Mine .. in 1933 e .'in etill
ployed there. I hnd been e miner for some time before I went to work at
Mine J». I think e. lot of the men were in favor of the P.llJ.. beeeuee they
wanted to get rid of 1E¢.'IS. Host of the men liked PM. J: everything went
along good until ne ll. ores sold by Rlnli to EI.4S.H,QFF!
"I reonll that in the early fell Of 1941 I heard that RUN
had sold Mine A to ELSHOH. I don't recall how I exactly heard about it,
but remember I thought at the time that I might not have my job.
"1 remember that some time in the first week of Sept. 1941,,
I went to a meeting at the P.li.1.. This meeting was oolled for the purpose
of finding out whether or not the men would join the U.l|I.l'.'. I think it
was settled that ELSHOFF intended to o erute the mine only with United men.This meeting was presided over by # and I believe e conrnit-tee was
appointed to go see ELSHOFF about t e opening of the mine. e»
"I eleo tent to e eeeond meeting at the P.!.£=. hell e. ehort
time after the first and I believe that at that time the oommittee reported
that if 200 progressive men joined U.ll.W., then ELSHOFF would open the mine.
I don't remember any other details of this meeting.
.11 also went to Ii meeting at Redmtm Hall and qzeported
that ELSHOFF had said that if the men joined U.!l. £. he would open e mine.
I do not know of any fighting that took pleoe at any of these meetings I:
I don't know any further details about these meetings. -,
-405-
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RE: JOHN 1.. mus, am.
INTERVIEW WITH "I next went to a meeting at the Elks Club and I recall thatF it was at this meeting that we were told that unless we
CQNTIIFJED! joined U.M.W. we wouldn't be able to go to work. I recall
that a standing vote was to-ken to join the United 6: everyone
indicated they wanted to~join U.1l..I. I Signed a UJl.Y.'. oard that nite. I
remember that EDMONDSON come to the meeting but I can't remember what he
talked about.
"I had been out of work onoo before for over two years and
the only thing I was interested in was in keeping my job. I didn't euro
which union I belonged to ea long as I hold my job. I was never beaten up
or foroed to join-any union. Other than as sot out above, I do not have my
information as to wl-qr the men all joined United.
"1 have road over this statement of 3 pages end it is true
to the best of my memory.
/s/_ i
.'?itnessod=
Special Agents, FBI _
U0 so Dept: Of Ju5ti.QQ
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Be: JOHN 1.. z.n:1s, mar.
as interviewed by Special Agents
- is above the average miner
telligence and although riendly, expressed his preference for U.lL.h. over
P.L'-.A. I-Ls furnished no information of particular value and his value as e
witness for the Government is doubtful. His statement is as follows:
"Springfield, I11.
Sept. l5, I943
L Agents of the Federal ureau o ves g
tion. c eats or "* been made to induce me to make ar.';{ state
"I was born o and became a U. 5. citizenthrough my fathi. I have been a If.1I1EI' all my life and was foreman for Pea-body for about _- years and other mines. I presently reside at
I have been employed by the line A Coal Company for e pas _ . _ . E . E Jears and presentl" work n1 hts at the mine I joined the .-T. 3 .1 s
when I first started in as a miner.
"I was at Kine A in 1932 when the state went progressive and joined
the P.L.A. at that time. I was satisfied with the U.K.h. and didn't approve of
the formation of the P.I.A., but I didn't take any active part in the opposition
The truth of the matter is that although I paid dues in the P.I.A. I never
actually signed a card for the P.E.A. I have never paid much attention to any
of the union activities, but have always been more in favor of U.E.H. I always
felt there should be only one union in the mines and there wasnt any need for
P.K.A. For a majority of the time I have been at Kine A I have been working
nights, and in view of that fact I have never had much contact with the men at
the mine.
"I cannot recall dates at all, but we shut down at Kine A every
spring that HAN owned Kine A so I imagine we also shut down in the spring of
196.1. I believe that I received a notice from to the effect that he had
sold Lfine A to ELSHOFF.make the following voluntary statement toB 1 In tia-Q
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Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, ETAL.
'- ' "be employed at Liine A. I believe there was a. group 0!
5 or 6 progressives who were members of another local,
continued! who came to that meeting. It was supposed to be only' 7 ofa meeting of the local at Mine A and I think some
the men resented the fact that these men were coming over to our meeting. when
it was apparent that an argument might arise and maybe a little trouble, I do-
cided to leave the meeting. I didn't attend any other P ILA. meetings during
this period and did not go. to the meeting at the Elk
"During this entire period I was working as a company employee on a
salary basis so naturally I 2 didn't pay push attention to the activity of the
men at the mine during the days»
"I am quite sure no vote was actually taken at the meeting I
b t I heard at a later date that all of the men - attended as described above, u .
n 'th United about a week or had signed up with United. I believe I signed u_ W1
two before the mine opened that fall. I was the last engineer to sign up and
to the best of 1:5; men.or;.' I signed up at the U.l.;..:. hall. No threats were ever
made against me .
"I have read over this statement o 4 pages and 1: -
true to the best of my memory.
signec;;"Trvr_c¢w.=:Q Special Agents, F.B.I.U. 5. Dept. of Justice."
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RE: JOHN L. IEWIS, ETAL
W Ev; WITH was interviewed by Speoial Agents
s s very excitable perso".'».. » .._
and it was diffiou o o tain a coherent story from him
relative to his knowledge of instant case. It is believed he would &e =-
poor witness. executed the following signed statement:
I! Springfield, I11.
September 16, 1945
"I make the following voluntary statement
to Special Agents of the Federal Bureau of In-
vesti gation. Ho threats or promises have been made to induce me to make
any statement.
"I am presontl em lo ed at Mine A and reside s.t_I was born on and became a U. S. citizen
I have been mining coal most of my life and have been a
member of the U.M.W. since about - 1 started working at Kine A in
1940 and had previously joined P.1»I.A» in 1932. Host of the men were not
satisfied with the U.M.Y§. and I felt that the PJl-A- should be started so
the men would be satisfi ed.
".1l1en I started working at Kine A it didn't seem to no that
the men were satised. The
office longer than they were
made to the men in P.H.A. I
way the P.lE.A. officers were
"I resell
and later on in the early
to ELSHOFF. When I heard
that ELSHOFF was going toofficers in the PJIA. wanted to hold their
supposed to and were not keeping their promises
donit belie-we the men were satisfied with the
acting.
that the mine shut down in the spring of 1941
fall I got a letter that RYAN had sold mus A
that ELSEOFT had bought the mine I also heard
close tho mine. I heard that the P-ILA. men
had several meetings in the fall of 1941, but I never attended any of
those meetings. I heard that all of our men had turned over to United
at the meeting at the Elks Club, but I don't know any of the details ofthose meetings. I don't care what union I belong to as long as I have aJob. After I heard all the men had joined U.ll.W- I went up to the UJJ.
hall and signed up iinited just a short tiie before I started tack to
work at line A in the fall of 1941- I do not know why the men all joined
U.il.W. but I was not beaten up or threatened.
I have read over this statement of 2 pages and Irish to
state it is true to the best of my memory.
Witnesses' / /l ae§2=ae;§e s-azsoz» i
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as: JOHN L. ums, er .11..
INTERVIEW TITH Springfield, Illinois, was into mecm Se tembe 1945 bu Special -I4-gents
was fairly intelligen
but it is believed beeause of his appearance and demeanor in answering
questions that he will be only a fair witness. K0 has been arrested an
charges of investigation» His statement is as follows:
Springfield, Illinois
September 18, 1945
"1. Q S en eld- a e £ollov.'in;: voluntary statenen eh
wh I know to Jo S ee'al 4 ents 1' om p 1 ug 0
the Federal Bureau of Investig;ation¢ Ho threats or premises of any
kind have been made to me. I have been told I need not mt-he any
statement and that this statement sun be used in OOl1I'to
"1 we 1-we in
I um new employed at Mine if es n driver and I have been working at
this mine since about 192' that tine I was a nonber of the U.H.TI-
which union treated me 0.K. I booune dissatisfied in 1952 with the
U.H.'='J. und was in favor of the ehenge to the Progressive Mine Workers-
I was e member of PAW until 1941 and I was satisfied with this union
all the time I belonged to its I would be a member yet if the local
hi1dn't O}W~I3{;9d0
"I first hoard about the sale of Mine "It" to EIBHOFF when I
received e. letter from BILL RYIAI in which he stated that he It-d sold the
mine and that I was no longer en employee of Mine "1-. . when I got this
letter I thought I ms out of a job and that I would huve to find another
Jilbl
"I did not attend any er the special meetings held by the
employees of 1-line £5 to decide what to do» I first fem out thatthe local bud swung over to U11? when I got o letter onhte11ing; no that if I wanted rw job I had better cone out there
and sign up with YLII that it wouldn't cost no anything» I we
one of the lest non to sign up which I did at the United Hine Workers
B-all. If I ha-d my own way I'd still be u member of the PJIJUQ bee:-.1150
the PJIJI has more respect for the wishes of the rank and file and beeeuse
Hz is a more donooretie organization. P-H-"lb also provides better . '
working eonditionss
-408-
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RE: JOHN L- 1-3T15- ET "I"
ll; Z oun- % - thin swtmmt.. 1 111 Hwo rend is '3 is an 1:31.1001;nv11=I'1 11TH gisting of we pl;°5 °° °!! j
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ERVIWIWITH I -
Boringfield, Illinois, was nterviewo on e18 1945 Seooit-11 gent md
ed difficulty with the language nd
1 1s - mve .at e wi 1 make on y a fair witness. Be has no oriminl
92record but the fi 0 S ri field Field Office disclose that he
His statement is us
1'0.L1U92"v'Bl
"Springfield, Illinois
September 18, 1943 .
"I, S ringeld,
Illinois do muke the £'e11owin»- velu1rbu:'y statement too who I M tc be spew-1*~»=@» 5 ~r
the Federe Bureau o Investigation. No threats or pranisos of 0-mr
kind hove boon made to me; I ha-we been told I need not make any
statement and that this stetement eon be used in court.
"1 W» or I Mr WUnited States in - I become :1 no urn :.r.e ea. 12.011 of the UnitedStates at Springfield, Illinois in
"I began working in the mines in - joining the United
Mine Workers. I raver held any office in any union. I um presently
employed at line "A" as e Troek layer. I was first employed at Iiine
"A" in-, I joined the Progressive Workers Union in 1952 boeuuso
the majority joined. I wee satisfied with conditions under and in
both the United Mine Workers and the Progressive Mine workers Unions.
It doesn't nuke um! difference to no which union I belong to.
"11." by receiving c.
the nine. I thought"I first he-.~.rd about the solo of Hine
letter fret: Hr. BILL RY..N telling, me he hud sold
n'ly1'.92e I would lose my job beeousc I knew ELSHOFF fvored the United
Mine Workers. I did not hour any rumors that EISHOPF was going toshut down klino '5." er v-ms going; to hoist ooul out through Mine "B".
I don't remember attending any of the meetings of the employees of
line "M at which it was decided ta join tho mm. 1 signed up with
UM--J at the United Mine Workers Building. I um not in fU.Vu2' uf one
union over the other.
"I have been reed this stutenent consisting of two pngos and
i.1C'n_ _192 1.U1--l "UT
'T1tne
,, Bpringfield, 111. Speoiul gents
g L
92.: '92_
RE: JOHN L, IEZIS, ET AL.
seem -one i e
1rn:.s nun Fluwvi-5 »..-e 1.2-. ....¢.._. by pucial
I_-------I---I-I .
t e 1-on make a good was eotperative it s no no iove ' -
much as he was away from Liine '5" during, the period when the men switched
from P..A to bl-EA. has no known criminal record. _ _
veluntc 1'11 raThe fe11OWing'aigned statement was obtained from_
"Springfield, I11-
September 14, 1943. .
I, , Bpringfield Ill. do I-~. . ' kc the c owing; str.ter~.ent to pecial Agents
f 0: the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
no tnreets er prernsee :1 any .:ini uuvu been none UU new L """'= J k A *" C" C W2 $9 $hi5
statement .
"I v.-as born in and emigrated to 11.3-
in - I c1aiJn_eiti zenship threugh my step father who was naturalizedthan I 1r:asnbeut-Pyenrs old: I first started working in the nines about
- I.jcining Uiif at that time. 1 started at Kine A in 1940» when I
started at lline A i was already a member of P.ll.a. having joined at Panther
Crock in 1932. I was in favcr cf the new Progressive Union and stuck
G O t of il I am out of work fer four years on a c en ' t.
I fcuncl out about the sale of Iiino A when I got. a letter from
ll;-. ' -'- that he had sold the nine and that I was released. Lt theRyan sayin__,time I get this letter 1 was wtrking et Panther Greek #2 se 1 didn't worry
a lot about my jnb at liino A. Befcre 1lr.Ryr.n sold the mine I felt that Hr.
Ryan and Pill; were getting along B711uOth.1Yo About the time of the sale of
llino A I don't recall any organizers 0cntaetin[_'. me and trying to get me to
join I.I'.d;- I recall hearing that ii the liine is men cli:1n't join Ul.".'?iA that
Kr. Elshrff was going to heist Lline it coal thrcugh Nine B.
"I -ii:ln't attend any of the meetings where the FHA cr its Bins
A miners discussed the sale of liinc J; or talked about switching Union
affiliations. T was I"-.:rl:in,_; at Rnther fires-it #2 and building my present
hone at the time and didn't have time to attend. the meetings-
Tha dny Mine 3 reopened Jack Keurs the Supt. came after me to
re to work. I went out there and bee te join !I!_f.'i_I; before I ooalzl. ge 1:-e
work. I would rather have remained Progressive but I needed the job IO I
joined UIJ-IA.-
"I have reed the above 1%; pages of voluntary statements made by
-411-
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RE: JOHN L. LETTIS, ET AL-
I ERVIE"; III!-I me, They are true and correct.
tinuci! __.____..___.. <=> _
..itn0ss<,;l:
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Be: JOIN L. lflo, ET AL,
DETERVIIIY RITE
1943
t He was entirely cooperative andSeptember 17,
j
hIllinois, by SW2
him concerning this investigation. ne appeared to be more intelligent
than the average miner and an honest and reliable person. It is believed
+1 h t it 1 1 1t hi test ny will be of value that he will t..a.t ir t---e even- __ _s _e,_ ,_,s , imo .
befound to be a good andiwilling Witness. _
!_pr1ngi'iel!, Ill.
Dept, l7, l?l13
J "1 , give the following information to _
, who are known to me to be Spec. Agts. of the F.B.I. No
threats or promises have been rode me to procure this statement. I an
=m ved at n-line A and have been there for the past s. I was born
I came to U.S. in nd became a
citizen about in opring__, Ll. In 1932 when the local at I-line A went
to
as
be
was taking over nine 'A,__ I
heard this that I -Jould have
1932 to 1941 I was satisfied
pretty fair. No one came towith thenza now I would rather be with U.ll.iI.
mince and if I had to get another job it would
In 1941 I read in the papers that Elshoff
also hoard this from the men. I felt when I
to go to U.l£.-I. or I would have no job. From
with the Progressives _|_ they always treated me
see me about going back to U.1{.n'. they werethe P.L.¢= _ want;-d to go
there are very fen P.}..',A.
hard if I was with P.}7.A.
going some places but they never came to mine. -t the time Elshoff bought
Mine A I heard they might take coal from Mine A through Eine B this wasjust talk I felt ii that happened I nould be out of a job. There were
some guys in the P.H.a. who worked at Mine A who said that if we dont
go to U..1'.-1.". the mine will not reopen. I figgered that if I didn't Fain
the U.}{,H. I would loose my Job forever. - _
"I attended meetings at P.M.A. Hall where some men wanted to go
to U.il.a92'. and some wanted to stay. I saw trouble was coming so I left-__
I saw a fight in the street but Inns across the street then. Some
iellorr in our mine narr-ed -got beat up; they tore his shirt off. They
elected a coxnnittoe i:l'1l.19?;'1_5 there and they went down to make a phone
call and thats when the fight started; I dong know who caused the trouble.
"I also went to a meeting at Hedmams Hall__ I heard of this from
the other men. fhe purpose was to see if we were going back to TJ'.1E.'Ji.
The majority at this meeting voted to go back. This was an ognn vote. _
bdnundson did not talk at that meeting. This pras not a regular P.l!.A. -
meeting__t_he local officers were not there. V
-415-
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E -" A1 92 .r~ E.n ' 92 E
Re: JOIN L. IEWIS, ET AL.
ontinue before Edmunson came doIn_| As I recall the vote was toINTERV Eh JITH I went to the meeting at the Elks Club a tmnch
of fellows asked m to go down and I went. *6 voted
decide whether or not we wanted Edmmdson to come down to talk to us. _
"as in charge of this meeting. Ldmundson nade a speech and ago! o! questions were asked he told us if we came back we would not havet = an fee and there would be no discrimination against us. I voted to 0 Fey Y
go back, because I needed my job and felt I had to to keep it. I was
not a member of any committee and did not go from the Elks meeting to
Edmudson or Elshoffs office nor did I go to'the Leland Hotel. There
did not seem to be any divided groups at these meetings__it just seemed
like a bunch of men trying to ficge; what to do.
"Since 1941 when the U.E.". came back things have been a little
better but I think this is because of the shortage of men, otherwise
things are about the same.
"I have had Agent _ read to me this statement which is
written on this and tto other p3RuSL It is all true to the best of
my knowledge and belief. I am signing this of my own free will as it is
all true.
e=.m= L
"nitnesses:
/=/ Qpecia Agent, . .1.
St. gm.
special ngent F.B.I.
Springfield, Ill.
Sept. 17, l9L3"
- 414 ~
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RE! In ET M-In
Springfield, Illinois, lows! hishome by Special -Iigor and
was cooperative but it isunot believed
tnnt he voul no e 2. goo witness because oi his lack of knowledge of im-portant events in the Mine Loose. _has no known criminal record.
He furnished the following signed statement:
"Springfield, Ill.
September 14, 1943. _
"I. . Bprinsi em I11-do vo *1 eke the fellov.-in statement to Special Agents c£ the Foderc-.1 Bureau of Investigation.
Ne threats or promises »vo con made to cause mo to make this statement.
start d vex-kin in the runes e. eu einin Ul.I |'Js at that time. I have =1 -' S ' J 5 "'
never held an office in any union. I mu presently unemployed having quit
out at Kine A Sept. 7, 1943.
"I started to work at Mine L Sept. 1, 1935, changing over to the
PEA at that time. I had been out of work for 3 your-s and 8 months and
wanted n job. I didn't core which union I belonged to. I was working at
Peabody #575 when P23. was formed. I took no active part in either union
and hnrdly over attended s. union meeting. During the above mentioned
period that I was out of work I stayed away from the mines because I did.n'
wont to get into any trouble.
"I was emoloyod at Mine 13- as o maintenance man at the time llr.
Elshoff bought it. '..e were not working at that time however. I just
heard about the sole from the ncW5p:".pe1. Tlhen I road about the sole I
figured that I'd have to change over to Ul!-ed to hold my job as Hr.
Elshoffs Mine B was U15-Ia.
"Se for as I know the PLLE. and Er. By:-.n were getting along fine
at the time of sale.
"I was never approached by any organizers and asked to join T.If92iA.
I never heard any rumors that Lir..E1shofI' was going to operate
iiine A through l5.ne=B oz-that he would openjiine A on the condition that
Mine A employees join Ulfli.
I have no knowledge of any BIA. meetings where the sale of Mine
A was discussed, and I never attended any meeting at the Elks Club where
Pm. voted to join IRMA. The first timed! knew about line A going to open
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T V E1 I TH UHHL was when I got n =-¢» Ln -om b&¢k $0
work. I did return to my sumo Job; but had 11°
continued! join uum. 1 did:-1'1; care which union i belonged
to so long as I was working again.
I have road the above 1 3/Z pages of volutary statements made
by me. The same are true and corrcci. _
/ /
witnessed:
Special Agents, F.B.I '
- 416 -
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RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ETLL
INTERVIER. WI I1 linei nt owed by
S eeial A ents an onP E.. September 18, 1943. us intelligent but not overlycooperative. It is not believed the he weu nuke a good witness because of
» t is ashis attitude. Ho diselaimed any criminal rooord. His stateraen
follows.-
" qlllinoilSoptom or 18, 1943
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ing voluntary statement to when
" ' 1 A" nts of theI knew tc be Speeie bethreats er premises of any kind have been made to me; I have been told I need
tat t and that this statement eon be used in Court.nct make any s ener. ,
t Mine "A" in 1937 and am still cmpleyod
belonged to
I hive been
s er local #18-go."I was e
there
the Progress ve
elected to my position
A "I was a merloer of the Progressive Line Workers union from
941 d I was satisfied with the union. 1937 until Septombr 1 O13
"I first heard of the sale of Fine '1. to ELSHOFF by reading
b a in about it in the newspaper. I thought that I was probably out of a je ga .
"I didn't attend any of the meetings at which the miners
eonsidored whether or not they should go over to the United Mine Workers.
ihen I read in tho paper that the men had decided to go ever, I wont book tc
the mine and joined the UIIJ there.
"I have observed that both the Progressive Mine Yierkerrs and
the United Mine Workers unions are about the some and I have no preference
for either.
1 one and e half "I have road the within statement oonsisting e
pages and it is all true.
/=/
, FBI
Illinois
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RE| JOHN L. LETZIS, ET AL-
41? K -I L sP»1=~==-eld, Illinois, was interviewed at his emespecie menmmd j iwns very cooperative an appears e have s. a r
~.-- - -~ I situation, es ecielly of the meeting at the Elks
941. make I_.c.;ee£the inch p
Club en 5ep"ee"s..»er 14, 1
gate witness because
when he is t;.l1-zing. no known criminal record.
the fellenring sign
"Springfield, I11.
. September 14, 1943. '
r 1a, I11. do
vs-1untt.r'i n::kc~ - e fellewinj; statement to
Speci:-.1 Agents of the Feds en-
rests cr premises ti my kind have been made to cause me to make this
statement.
"I was born in
in - uni was neturelizei ir _ tn the mines in
Lnerica in -bringing my interns. ienel union curd with me and jc-ining
UlI92J.. I have never held an office in any unicn. I em presently employedat liine 1. Check #1225, starting C.b92';92lC~I cs1n_ to America
I felt that the new Progressive Union was a berm fide union as
yau could. vctu fer yc-ur chcice which you couldn't do in 'EIt.IJi£a..
"I recall getting notice in the nail cf a release from Ryan:
employment since he he-.1 5:111 the Liine A to Llr. Elsheff. kuhen I get that
netice 1 realized that my breed s butter" was at stake and lcnew that I
muld have to join 1356,. to keep my job. Before 11:. Ryan sold liine A to Hr.
Elsheff we were getting along fine under the PEA union. _'rie all lesteeur ,
vacation pay ancunting te $20.00 because of the salo-
"I was never sppreached by any organizers and asked to join UETEA.
Ky changing frem F513 to IIJ-IA was done cf my own free will, but I k!'l<3i . that
I had to change er lose my job. '
There were nmers going around at this time to the effect that
2.1:". HBHDFF u-r.s going to mark lilne A through Kine B, and also the Lline is
wouldn't open unless all cf the men joined UEFCIA. These rumors did not
cause me to change unions as I lmsw it would be hard to work line A through
1-{inc B because the cars were ' different sizes. - _
"1 attended 0. meeting, at Redm.".n's Hall in Springfield. _
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RE: JOHN L. LETIIS, ET AL.
r.RV T qwcs in charge and he said that because there was
a lo of old miners ct Mine A we would lose our jobs
ccntinued! unless we joined IILMA. ht this meeting s. committee
was selected to talk to l.'lr.E1Bhoff. lehen the .
Coznmittct saw I-ir. Elshcfi he said that if they would affiliate with Uln""-71;
we cculci all ;;<_- back tc wcrk with no discrimination. -dc had the meeting
at Relrhcms 1-1:11 bccsusciit was a neutral pl&OE-92 and we wouldn't have any
trtublc.
had a meeting at the Elks Club and I remember pitch-
ing; in s dime, each, to pay for the hall. was also in charge
of that meeting. at this meeting we all Signed 11 vcuchcr which made us 9.
member of U}.l1.'4'.. Ray Edncniscn of U..I.<.f; spoke before we signed tho vouchers.
saying there would be no discrimination and thct we would have all the
rights 6: pri92'il_i;___es of the crgcmizntion Ul."u1§!. Ivfter Lir. Edmcndson left
we turned in these v.1uch<;rs to Lee Ensell, Atty. for TILT.-Q, and another man,
whom I believe was E1mcndscns private Secretary. Ho was I1 notary public.
The above meeting was on Sm'~d:.y e.r92.d we went buck to work the next day
under Uhe."Later we
"I recall Kr. Eincnclscn saying in his talk that ii we would -
join E1511 he would secure autherizntion from Hr. Elshoff for us to go back
to wcrk bef. re sunrise, that is he would get permission for us to return
to work before sunrise although we W-".u1 .:1't return until the regular time-
"I have had the above statement consisting cf 2 3/4 pages readto me by Agent The same is true and correct. '"
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Uitnesscd: _
' Sp;-019.1 Lgent, FBI. "
- 419 -
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was interviewed at hit residence,
Springfield, Illinois on
ialIN'l'ERVIE."3 WITH
..-!fl!65 !born in
became a
en accent understands English well and can
is slow and methodical, but it is believed he make a satisfactorywitness. - is new employed at I-lino "A" and advises he has mvcr boon
arrested.He speaks with
If well. Ho
..
The following statement nos obtained £rom
"Springfield, Ill.
Sept. 12, 1945 f
"x, | s rin field, 111.. make tho followingvoluntary stitenent to whom I know to be
Special agents of the of Invcs ige on. make it without
fear of threot,force or promise of ozy kind.
"I " and came to the U. S. in - mas born in ,
U. S. citizen in Springfield in
tho U. S. in Springfield, Il1.,
in - at which time I was e member of the United Kine Workers of AmericaUnion. I started working~o.t the Min: "A" in Springfield, in about Q
In 1932 our entire UEW local wont over to the Progressive Mine Workers o
America Union, and 1 became c member of FHA. I joined FHA because they
obtained ; contract with the company operating Fine "A" and I wanted to go
beck to work. I was not forced in ony way to join FHA.I became a
I started working in coal nines in
"I remained a FHA until Mine "A" was sold in 1941. From 1932 to
1941 I thought FHA was operated as an honest union and I thought the officials
were honest. I never noticed any unusual assessments and no one in any way
tried to get me to join UEW. There were no labor disputes, strikes, close
downs or pioketing during this period of time. 1
"In the Spring of.l94l Hino "A" closed down due to the usual slack
period of that time of your. In about August of 1941 we road that Elshoff
had purchased Fine "A" from Ryan. The feeling among the men then become
that they would have the some trouble which the men ct Mine "B" had, with
the URN. We thought the company could pull the coil from Mine "A" thru
Mine "B" and mo thought the company would do this. Therefore, if we wuntod
to work at Hino "B" which would really be operating Kine "A" we would have
to join UHW..;I '¬g-:5 0 .. d.
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Re: JOHN L. LEKIS, ET AL
PT'?VIEW WITH The first time this entire matter was discussed by PIA
was the night we found out that the Mine "A" had been
cont inuo s old , and this was on the some night as the regular PEA
A special PLEA meeting was then held at PIA hall
to hear the Pit Committee's report, and I was present. The committee reported
only one or two men working at Mine "A". At this meeting e comittee of
six was elected to so: Elshoff but they could not reach him by telephone and
another committee of six was elected to see Faloetti, about three or fourof this ooztmittoe being the some as the first committee. !
I was present when we tried to locate Elshoff and couldn' , an we wen ack
to the meeting and reported we couldn't locate Elshoff. We had intended
to discuss the intentions of his to open the mine and how he was going to
ope-reto it. Th: next morning tho committee, only five going, went to
liino "B" to see Fclcotti, and we went to ask hin what they were going to
do about operating Mine "A". Falcetti said there were only two choices,
that ii the men didn't go back to Kine "A", they would have to pull the coal
thru Liino "B".meeting.
"I had been reading Tho Progressive Miner, the P3-Hi paper, and
hoe reed about s. Situation in Kentucky where the Notional Labor Relations
Beard handcd down a decision that if a company is operating c mine under a
certain union and that company purchases other mines, those other mines also
had to be operated under that certcin union. I believed that decision was
binding in our case, ant so I thought that the only two choices for us was
either to join UHF! to operate Fine "A" or Nine "A" would be operated thru
Zinc "B" .
We were
for us_
to go over to U.4'Zi. T.~'e saw Edr.".undson, and i answer to o direct questionfrom me, he said we could come into U!.i!'I aséyfitenomous group and not have to
pay initiation foes. I believed there would be no trouble to change to UHF.
in PLEA hal1,requested me
would be o special meeting at Re-dman's
at this meeting that the committee had"Our cormitte; then reported back to P25!» at a Hid meeting.
then instructed by P22. to see Er.-mundson to see whet the chances were
"Lt the last meeting hold
to make an announcement that the-re
Hell the follcaxting, Friday. It was
reported what Edmundson had said.
It was then moved that u special meeting be held the following
Sunday at the I3lk's Club to decide on our course. At that meeting the
committec reported on all things which had happened for the benefit of those
men who had not been at the other meetings when the committee had reported.
There were 200 men at that meeting. A motion was node for these men to join
UHF and it was adopted with one dissenting vote, Io one talked at tlnt
meeting, except the committee, until after the voting to go to UMW had takenplace - and until after the election oi officers and committeemen. -
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"Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL
K F .ITH was elected president and he asked the men if they
wanted to hear Echnundsen, and then appointed a. committee
continued! to got Bdmundsen. Edmundsen then talked, but I cannot
remember what he said, and than he invited all officers
and oernitteemen tc UNI headquarters. .
_ I feel certain there was ne physical force of an kind used to
make these men change from PEA to URN. I feel it was just u situation
which arose over which the_mon had no control, and they changed to UMN
because they did not went to lose their jobs.
"I have had this statement of five pages read to.me and it is true
and correct to the best of my knowledge, -
"This statement was read to net his residence and he
admittei everythin; in it nos true and eorrec . He stated that if the same
questions were asked hie under oath es a witness, his answers would be the
same as in this statement. K; statae the information given in this state-
ment would be given by him any time he was asked for it, but he refused to
sign his name.
Special Agent, F.B.I. signed!
Spscil Agent, F.B.I." signed!
~ 422 ~
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Rs, JOHN L. mus, rr 1.1..
iTITH
Sp in field, 111., was ex-newad at his one ax1' 5
Se bomber 14 1943 by Spoaial Agents
was Qrble to an LL c~.;1ci T oBr- . .. -~_,__ We ,
stand Ewglish nnd ho was unable to zmderstund the questions asked",
therefore u oumploto statement could not be Obtained-
' , lllluIIIIfurnished the follmrmg statement,
as inter-orator in obtaining the attomcnt not
forth
Springfield, I11.!
September 1%, 19%3a
whun I know to be Spoozul agents
an tion, no force, throats or premises have boon nude
in Obtining this Bti-tcmunt und I know that whut I may any may bo used
in 0. court of law. o
_ . . . .
I was born i 0rIH115!f-1?-00 V06 u.s. in-znd beam-0 5. n- Jul! iz0Fit|iLen of lthu ms. m
n Springfield, Ill.
nave been working at 3-{ins
now employed at Him: A. as 11 digger.It
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Re= JOPN L. LEIHIS, ET AL.
INTERVIEY Y! TH
1»: i~sent a" -~,~ was cooperative but it is not believed that he no d make a
. ' ' d
lgood witness because oi his lack owledge of pertinent facts an
events in the iiine "A" deal. has no knourn criminal record.
He furnished the following signed statement. 4
_ _ I11-
- -' September 17, 1943
Ill. do voluntarily
1t to pecial Agent and
No threats or promises have been made to cause me
statement, and I know that it may be used in court.
"I was born at and started
. hattat time. saredatliineain in. the mines in ¥ joiring '.'. ' .-and have nor ec. there continually since. I am presently employed
as a driver. -
"I was at Nine A when the whole group joined up with PM in
1932. I thought PEA was alright.
"I learned about the sale of liine A through a letter from
Er, Ryan. when 3. got that letter I thought there goes my job. .
"I didn't hear any talk to the effect that Mine It wouldn't. open
all the miners joined b1J.:A or that '1-ir. Elshoff was going to work
through Mine B. unless
Kine A
"They had a meeting at PM Headquarters to discuss this situation
ended in a dispute and a couple 01 men got beat up. After that the
I-Zine It men held another meeting at Redmans Hall, but I never attended
that meeting. I also heard about the meeting at the Elks Club where
the men switched over but I didn't go to it.and it
"I returned to 1-fine A the day it opened and signed up ULHA.
-here was no work that first day because some of the men were undecided
or didn't know about the change. I would rather have remained PLEA but I
had to join UEHA to keep my job and I needed my job. I noticed that
the miners got more docks under UIMA than under FHA. The present policy
is if you load 6 cars you don't get any docks.
"I have read the above statement consisting of 1% pages. The
same is true and correct. -
/we "Iii *
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Re: JOHI-I L. mas, er AL
ERVIPT TITTI On September 15, 191.3
t I-view eoial B - S rin field Illinois was in e
lE92-d difficultin un ers an ng que ions propoun e to J-lnl an
is e 1'3-Gd that he Fill make a poor witness. He disclaims any criminal
record. His statement is as follows:
"Springfield, Illinois
September 15 , 1943
Illinois do
e beenield-we ' vs unta st make the £0116-I-L115 ry'ho::92 I know: to be Special Agents
vostiwation. Ho threats or oromises have been made to me; I havmaJ:e any statement and that any statmont I do make can be told need not
used in court.
I became a naturalized
work at Hine "A" in aboutand at that time I bel United Mine 1.0:-hers. I have been
1.-or in" at Mine "A" ever since. I have never held any office in arqr
' O Fri r to "33" I was satisfied with with the U.1i.92.. and I didn'tunion. 1.1 -L ,..
care much vhether the nine changed over to the Progressive Nine Yorkers in
1932. After 1932 I was satisfied 1-ith the P.}.!.A. union. -"I was born in
citizen of the Unit ed St
I know: that Iir. EL.sho;" bought I-line "A" but I don't knot-" when or
thy. Neither do I know vfiv {He mziners switched over to the United Mine -
Markers. I did not attend any oi the meetings at which this was discussed
and I took no part in the stitching of the unions.
"I have been read this statement consisting of one and a
fraction pages and it is all true.
18%!-
litnessed:
Special Agents, F.B.I.
Springfield, Illinois"
I
-425-
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Re: JOHN L. LE7-'IS, ETAL.
r: I1-31' ~.-rrre $pringfield, 111111011
was interviewed at his home on Sop emlb 6 1943 bySpecial Age andtated he did not have a criminal record. s une e o speak
English very tell and would make s. poor witness-
urn_ished'the following statement
Springfield, Ill.
September 16, 1945
I make the following voluntary stateld, I1 ' '
. _ 1 and
whom I know to be Special Agents of the Peder stigstien- 0
force, threats, or premises have been made in obtaining this statement and I
know that whet I may say may be used in a court of law.
-1 hm in eie- tad to we1;.s. 111- and 1 became e naturalized citizen o e 11.5., in-
"I was employed at Mine A in -as s digger and I stopped working
at 1-Kine A in 1942 because the air was bad in the mine. _
"I am new employed at Panther Creek line #5, Springeld, Ill. as
B 111011113191 Of Y-lief
I became a member of UJRW. in-and I remained a member until
1932 at which time I changed to F-151}. because my local U.1i.II. union changed
to I--1.1.11. for some unknown reason-
"I reed in the ne-.--speper in about Sept. 1941 that ELSHOFF bought
Hine L. I thought at that time that ELSHOFF would operate i-Zine A as an U.I-1-W-
mine as he operated liine B cs UJ-§.92I.
Prior to the time ELSHOFF bought Mine A the employees were satisfied
with P.I1.I.. I thought P. Pi-11. was a good union, but it made no difference to .
me Whether I was o member of U-I»l¢W- or P.li.1'.. as both unions are about the
SB-H160
"About two or three days after ELSHOFF bought Mine A I attended o
meeting at P.1I..'.. hr. also attended another meeting at .12.! hall e
few days later. told me about these meetings. was in charge 01 these meetings. 9 spoke and so did several o rpersons, the names of whom I do not now. I do not remember what went on
at these meetings, but someone made the statement that if the employees of
Hine A did not join 0.15.2. ELSHOFF would not open the mine. I decided at
this time to join U.le!.92!. so as to keep my job-
-426-
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.. Il92; ..._ __.__..i___ ._.-_-. -. __ ---__ - ~ - ~ -__- _ _ "' ~ _ - - -- ~ - for ¢- - . - ;_ -- _ ,_ 1115;. --_ Q, *a:A~; '
C ' O
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. re»: some 1. Lewis, ETAL.
~J
nri Q mbnfi H19s-um Q m~vw- Q '. - Y "A few days after . 1h at new en. in = or we
continued! meeting and he requested me to attend. made the s
statement at this meeting that "Kine A" co he
operated through Kine "E"; that ELSEOFF informed him that if the employeesof Mine A did not join U.1E. .l.'. he would operate Mine A through Mine B. Q
also stated the employees of Mine A should join U.K.E. so that they eou g
to work. I do not remember what else went on at this meeting.
n-r -*|..._ .. 4........1.-..1 .. _..-...¢-: .. .-'4 OJ.-7U e1"Cu:uu.::u :1 llsccvig, at t}i¬ CD 3 inf was in charge of this meeting and again made the statement that
if the employees oi Line A did not join U.L'.¥.'. 1-iine A would not open. A vote
was taken and all present voted to join U.E.H. I voted to join U.K.W. so that
1: I could go to work at Lline A. After the vote EDI.lO?-ISON of U.1i.J. welcomed us
into U.iI.';-'. I joined U.!.:.T.'. that day. I did not go to the U.1£.ir. meeting
that day.
"Conditions at Mine A were the same under U.Li.'ii. as they were under
ea.-;__,:_. ,92 Jr'-
:3?
"No U.LI.h'. organizer attempted to get me to join U.lf.W.
"I do not see any difference between U.if.W. and PJ.-f.A. as both
unions are about the same.
_;-_* "I have had this statement consisting of four pages readto me
and it is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
' Signed!
F
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Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, ETAL
IHTERY ~~'<w1'rH » Springfield» lino";
. was interview t his residence by Special Agents
I n September 16, 194 .
d t ' d o tele hone is is re entl em l e as a igger a ine an is resi en e p
speaks English poorly and understands very little English,
an n would make a very poor witness. He advised he had never been arrested.
'92
_ ., ' "Springfield, I11. 9292o .
Sept. 16, 1943. -
, S rin f d Ill. make
a hom
of Investigation. I make itthe following s tement to
I know to be Special Agents of the F
without fear of threat, force, and promise of any kind.
Vine 'A', Springfield, as a digger. I nae born inn I came to the U.S. in- and became a U.S.citizen -.. - started to work in Kine 'A' in about- I was a memberof the U.K.h. at that time. In 1932 I joined the P.K.A., but I do not know why
except because the rest of the men did and I did not want to lose my job. '
"In about Sept. of 1941 I got a letter from RYAN telling me he had
sold Eine '5' to ELSHCFF. I did not think much about it, but at the next P.I.A
meeting we were all talking about whether ELSEIEF would open Mine 'A'. we told
to open Hine 'a'
committee told us
I also heard thatour pit committee to see ELSHOFF and ask him if he was going
and at another meeting which I think was at Rgdmen Hall, the
that ELSHOFF said if we went U.E.W. he would open Mine 'A'.
ELSHOFF would haul coal thru Mine 'B' from Mine A' if Kine A' would not go
U.H.W. No one ever told me I had to join U.E.W., and no one ever forced me to,
but I knew I had to join U.K.W. to get my job at Kine A'. I may have gone to
a meeting at the Elks Club on a Sunday when the men voted to go U.M.W. but I
cannot remember. I had been at a wedding for two days and had pretty much to
drink. I cannot remember when I joined U.K.W, but I think it was at the U.K.W.
hall.
"It makes no difference to me if I am with U.E.W. or P.E.A.
"I cannot understand English well. This statement of two pages has
been read to me and it is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
igned! _
wrmsssss =
S ecial Agent, F.E.I.
~. 1 Special Agent, F.B.I.
/
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Re: JOHN L. LEFFIS, ET AL
IN HVI'*= '.' '."11'.~; F s, was n 61"Vl8'Bd at
15, 191.3 by Special Agents
stated hc did not haw: a-criminal
reczor . - s 2 0 TE '
nlthaugh Le .135 tle i _1-.-nation.'W'I3'...ld make a fair witness _ s
lit nfo_
The following is the signed st1t~:ment executed by_
Springfield, Illinais
septenber 15, 1943
Ill. "*1" the !l0|.!o'".'l.::g vo at-.-9;. E1 -'.:;. T :.' -' * -'1' A-'F1'-.113 Jf tie Fedur u oi sti- vh= .1" .,b-a,.-ec,1.L 5,.
ration. No force, t11:';-I.-ts or przmises have bean nadc 1.!'1 obtaining this
statement arr I knrm +.h.:=.t what I may say 1:"-.y be used in a caurt sf law-
n" = '1 --. w_s .ar*1 1n
"I btctme a rnt.»r.b-r of in-in Ill. and I remained .11
member vi that union until 1932, at w1.ich time I changed to P3-IA because
my local UT.-'.'.' unibn changed ts PLA-
"'I was employed at Ifin; "=1 in _'=b-:>ut_t1nd I an at the
present time working at Ilinc "£1" as a driver, _
"Ir: Sept. l9,l I rend in the n:.»wsp:=pcr th".t Elshoff naught
Lfine "A" frr: Ryan. at that time I thought Elsh-11"! would operate Bins "A"
just as it v-"s operated by Ryan, 92mc::r FHA. _
"Prior to the time Elslzvfi baught I-fins: "A" the ampluyec-s seemed
stisfiu with I-ILA. I ttnught 1-.--s a {sod ur.i:>n being operated for its
members, but it naéc n" dif1"cr.~nce to mo T111-';bh'.;1" I an a member of U21?-' or
Phtk. I fI?'~fuT took an active part in any unizm and I have never been an
rfficer sf Q uniun.
"I die not hear any rumrs t-bet Fine "A" could be aporated thmugh
El-inc "B". _
"As ~.w.l1 as I can remember I tank '1 trip away Ix-am Springfield
imnediitely rafter Elshuff baught llin-2 ".1", therefore, I did not attend
any meetings of PI-.1. concerning the opcrntian of Kine "A" inc: I did net
hear any runars concerning the :'>p<.=I3tiOn of Kine ".rk . I ms nut of Spri.ng- '
field when meetings were helc at Reimcn Hall and the Elks Club in Sept.
1941 and I do not have any information canccming these meetings.
-429-
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ILL
In!! I. I "A few da's before Hinc "A" opened in bdpu-i 1 3 - at Mme to d me that all tht employacs
were joinlng UNI and if I wanted to work at Kine "A"
I would have to jain UHF. I immediatcly wont to
thu UMT aviliing and jtlne UHT so that I would work at Hine "A". It made
n: diff;r-ncc ts u that I was changing from FHA to UH? or nwt.
"I can see nu difference in the operation of Kine "A" under
UK? than it was under HL¢. _
"Na no
me a 2
Titness:i---wh: was in UH; orranizor attempted tc gut me to join
I jvincd at my a;n fret will so th1t I caul wnrk at Hine "A".
hnf tlis statement clnsisting vf three pagns r¢ad.to
n? currcct t9 tbs best af my kniwledge.
/s/ i
Spwcigl Afznt FBI
ial Agent, F.B.I."
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I 0 Q1
RE: Ian LEZIS,
11m:nv1e;. ".a11"11 3P'1"B'_ field, Illinois, was in erviewed at hi omo on
18, 1943, by Special ngonts
stated he did not have a criminal record.
18 able to and understand English, but would not make o._good
government witness as he was not very cooperative in furnishing information
during the interview. '
furnished the following signed statement:
' "Springfield, 111.
.September 18, 1943.
I I"1 i
Ill. nuke the .f'oi1cw~n;; voluntary etc.t-whom I know to be Special Agents of the
gation; no force, throats or promises have been mndo in obtaining this
statement and I know that wl'1e.t I mey soy may be used in e. court of law.
=1 hm in I
"I an employed at Hi no "ii" as a car blocker and I have been em-
ployed nt hiine "1." since about
"I became s member cf U!&I»i in about -end I remained in that
union until 1932 at which time I joined PEA because mgr I111?! local-"changed
to Pin for some unknown reason.
"I reed in the newspaper in about Sept. 1941, that Elshoff
bought Kine "A". I thought at that time that liino "A" would operate as
alweiys under PEA.
"Prior to the time Elshoff bought kiine A the employees were
satisfied. with Pi.-Iii. I thought PHI». was a good union, but it made no
difference to me whether I was a member of FHA. or U1-.57. I took no interest
in union activities.
"I did not hear anyone say that Liine "A" could be operated
through Mine "B" nor did I hear anyone say that Elshofi would not operate
Kine "A" unless the employees join ULTI. _
"I attended the meeting at the Elks Club on a Sunday in Sept.
1941. I remember voting at this meeting to join UETJ. I voted to join INTI
because all those attending the meetings voted to join T1113. I do not
remember anyone speaking et this meeting, no one told me I had to join UHTI
to go to work at Mine "A". I joined UIST immediately after I voted. I went
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RE: Jam: L. LE-$18, ET AL.
-Ii I
heme immediately after I joined Ui and did not
talk to anyone. I do not know who was in charge
of this meeting and I do not remember how I re-
- A nnfin +hn+ +herQ was coin to be a meetinze l92D92 D 4 _ _ _ 92!92w,LI92-our QAWVQ-wv _._w~v '---_- ----_. '3_4___:, _INTERVIEI KITH
loontinued!
"I did hot hear of or attend any meeting, except the one at the
Elks Club, between the time Elehoff bought mine '1. and the time I joined
mm.
"Conditions at Mine "AF have been the same under MW as they
were under P.h.@. ' '
ll e el- _..-_ : _ _ n _-.1-. ,. an-. '.'..'"I do noi sue any Chffuzuuuu butwwwza LEE-.n 3.-h§ Pei-Jae I
joined UMH because all the other employees at Kine "AF joined.
"I have had this statement consisting of three pages read to me
and it 15 true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
/*/ i
Zitnessed: '
Iggt, F|.BuIlSpecial kgent, F.BI.
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E: Ln ET 1.51.10
* '- 11*" '..'I'I'I-I Springfield,
was reai-
s by
born
became a.
at Springfield, Ill. He as e digger at Mine "A". He speaks
English poorly and would not mike e. satisfactory witness-'
lie was reluctant to sign the following statement for fear of being beaten
by Uh"-T men. He advised he had never been nested.
Springfield, I11;
Sept. 18,
I, , S rin fie Ill. makethe following voluntziry statement to nd
whom I 1-mow to be Sp¬CiE-1 Agents of the Federal uresu of Investigation. I
make it without fear of throat, force, or promise of any kind-
"I was born in came to the U¢S. in
- and became at u.s. citizen D in s ri field, and am P n5
working as e. digger in 1-line "Ii"-
' "I first started to work in coal mines in the U.S. in Q, in
Iowa, end joined the United Mine T.'or1:ers of America Union. I stnrte towork in the Kine "1." in Springfield in- In 1932 I joined the Pro-
gressive liine Tiorkers of iwaerica union because John L. Lewis stole the
ballots and our whole UH-T local went PEA. I liked the PI-{A and thought it
was an honest union being operated for its members.
"In Sept. of 1941, I read that Elshoff bought Mine "A" from Ryan
and I was afraid I would lose my job unless I joined UI.i'vT because Elsho
ran I-line "B" and that was ULGT. Some of the men from Mine "A" who I worked
with told me we would have to join 111.5? to get our jobs back and said liine
"A" would not open unless the men joined ULTIT. No one from UB5? in the com- -
pony ever told me I would have to join ULTu' or ever told me Hine "Ii" would
not open except as U1.-1'-F. I also heard the men talking that they would haul
coal from Ii thru "B" if we did not join EH.
. I think I went to B M meeting where a. committee was appointed
to see Elshofi, but I do not remember anything that happened. I read there
was going to be e. meeting at the Elk'e Club and some of the men told me about
it, and so I went to that meeting and voted to join WW. I voted Ilfii be- '
cause I wanted my job beck and I thought I would lose it if I didn't vote
for EMT}. Edmundson came in end made e talk after we voted, and then I signed
with Ilffi. I remembered the trouble the men at Kine "B" had and I did not
"want trouble like that. '
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RE: JOHN L. LEIIS, ET AL.
" than 131.? b c use on could talk more INTEHVIE' ITH I like FHA better 92 e a y# freely. I would rather have stayed with PEA, but I .t ued joined UHF to keep my job and still prefer FHA to Il OCT: 111
This statement of two pages has been read bk: me and it in true
and correct. tc the best of my knowledge.
j /=/
Luitnz-zssed 2
t B S ecial gen , F. .1.Special Agent, 17.3.1. '
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Re: JOHN L. LETIIS, ET AL |
is om-
ploye
He spews and ish fnirlywell, but ounnot re-
member very much about vrhot happened during the pertinent period. H9
would make only o. fair witness. -
Springfield, I11.
Sept. 15, 1943
S rin field, make the follow-cndn-m=~=» I we ing voluntiry
to be Special Agents or the :21 Bore:-.u o rrressigot on. I make it
without fear or threat, force or promise of any kind."
become o U. S. Citizen 511-5 stortod work-
nnd thbt your joined the United Mine Ubrkers of
America Union. working at Mine '5', Springfield, in about 1931.
In 1932 I joined the Progressive Iiine Workers of Ann rion Union because the
whole local changed and because I did not want to lose my job. I was not
forced in my way to join PLEA and I was satisfied vorking at Mine 'A' under
I ' _i
the U.
ing in coal mines
"In about Szpts of 191-=1, I got e letter from Rynn soying that
Mine A had been turned over to Elshoff. I felt right any that there
would be trouble like there had boon o liino 'B' and I felt we would pro-
bsbly have to join U35-I. Ho Ont. from the company over told no I would have
to join U327 and no one from UTZT ever tried to got no to join UIJJ. The talk
among the non who worked at Mine '.A' was that Elshefi would only run I:-Zine
'5' under U2..'.'I and that if we wanted to keep our jobs at Kine '1'. we would
have to join U117. I also heard stories that if we did not turn U337 Elshoff
would operate liine 'A' thru iiino 'B' by hauling cool thru 'B' . _
I did not attend any PEA meetings or any Special meetings after
I learned that Elshofi had bought the nine until one day our PLIA leaders
told us there was going to be n meeting at the Elks Club on n Sunday and
we would vote to go U12-'. They said we had to vote UI-57! to kc-op our Jobs.
The non who said this were men I worked with at Mine '11. -
"I wont to this meeting at the Elk's Club and voted to join UMT.
Right after that I s igned up with U251. I do not remember much about the
meeting except that Edmundsbn talked after the vote - but I do not reiaenbe?
whet he snid-
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.:.-'_'R0: JOHN L. LIKES, ET AL
' I was not forced or threatened in any way
to vote UMW or join UP.- Ff. I Joined became ET H
Contl I did not want to lose my job. I would pre-
fem-red to have stayed with P1-SA because I
liked and was satisfied. When I went back to work at UH under U151,
U151 told us we could not speak any language except English. Tie were fined .
95.00 if we were caught talking in a foreign language. I would rather have
worked under'PL1I~..
"I stopped working at Fine '41 in about April of 1943, because of
ill health. I do not belong to any union at tho present time.
This statement of three pages has been read to me and it is
truc and correct to the best of my L:r.ov:le<1go.
/5/
itncs sod: *
/5/ Special hgont, F. B. 1."
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Re: JOHN L. LHIIS, ET AL
mrg-*;v1y?'.-' 1..nH is Springfield, Illinois, was in erviewe
- So tember 15 194.3 at his homo by SpecialAo:=+=s*1n~=@-1 he ed Mr ' ' . 1 h_ve :~. oz-minel rooord s unab-e o speak or understand
English very well and would make a very poor witness.
-furnished the following statement:
Springfield, Ill"
September 15, 1943-
"I, ' field.rJ~:o the follcnzing volunter; s-':.:te1r.ent to and
-whom I know to be Special Agents of tho Federal Bureau
of Investigation, no force, threats or promises have been mode in
obtaining this statement and I know that wh2.t I may soy may be used in
o court of law"-"-
"1 was born : emigrated to theU05. in - and I become a naturalized oi izen of the U.S. in
in Springfield, Ill.
I have been ernployed at Iiine "'A" since about -and I om
at the present time employed at lino "A as e. digger. "
"I became o. mombor oi U1-FT in-and remained o member of
U23? until 1952 at which time I joined Y-ILA. because my loonl I115?
union changed to P.3'.A. I do not know the rsoson my looel UH? union
OhnngOd to Pl-n. .
I road in the n¬'.'8p&pB!' in about Sept. 1941 that Elshoff -
bought Eino ".~. from Ryan. I thought at that time that 1-fine "A"
would have been operated as before and that liino "3' would have
romineo 6. 1-HA minor
Prior to the tine Elshoff bought Kine A the employees at
1'ino '5" were satisfied with P11. I thought was e good union,
being Operated for its members and I did not wish to ohlinge to U131.
I did not hear that Iline "5" could have been operated throxgh
Fine "TB".
I hoard someone make a. statement s few days after Elshoff
boughtt Fine A , that Elshofi would only operate Line A" if the employees
joined Ulif. Yfhen I heard this statement I dooidod to join '01}? so that
-431-
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Re: JOHN 1.. mama. EI AL
IIFPERV IF. T-.'
I could work.
continued !
7 .'I did not attend PIA meetings held at FHA
hnll :1 few days after Elshofi bought Mine A , as I did not have notice
and I do not know what occurred at these meetings.
toid me in Sept. 1941; prior to the meeting It tho
Elks Club '- 1.I;O B would not open unless tho employees joined
13:31. I decided at that t:L1:o to join U.1d.?T so that I could work at
Mine '13.
"I did not attend the meeting at Rodnon Bull and I did not
receive notice.
"to1d mc that o. meeting was to be held at the
Elks Club crnpleyces at Kine "A" would join 1 attendedthis meeting on u Sunday in Sept. 1941. F1:-as in charge
of the meeting. Sena one made tho statonen hot Iiino "5' would not
opcz: unless the employees joined UHF. I voted to join U15? so that I
could work at Ilim "Jr" A1-tor the vote was taken, Edmendson of UHF
mode -'2. speech and welcomed the erapleyoes of Mine "I." into U.k'.W- I
joined U»!-1.T}} at the close of the meeting. I did not go to the UH?
building after the nesting.
Se far ea I knew there wore no U-I"T..'.'. organizers at the
EIk's Club meeting. Ho one asked no to join UM? prior to the time I
joined in Sept. 1941.
Conditions at Iline L at the present time are about the some
under U117 as they were undo! PE-II» '
oined UIIT in order to keep b at liine "5". I was
..,¢.4-4- .-. -. tn-_'. ».-..:_ -HA, -ml» -mm-.-92+ 4-n n 11 lf.FL'_chtila L1-In 92ni§l92a Q§E Ill-JU Iii-ii-JD UV 92l' CL-II .
"I have had this statement consisting of four pages road to
no and it is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
/$/
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Re: J0!-DI L. LIT-.?I5, :1" AL
11t::"z;:~>.v:3=: 2? I Springfield, Illinois was interviews a s
home on September 1'5, 1943 by Special Agents- -Stated he did not have =
crin:|.n_l record. ould not make a good witness as he finds it
difficult to speak and understand English.
iuI'nished the following voluntary statement:
"-
I11. ma»'e thc IW .. "ring vo ry st tF whom I kaow to be S;2cia1 Agents o_
nvestigation, no force, tnr-ats or nromis s have been made in obtaining
this statement and I Iinovr that *r:hat I92:nay say may be used in a court oi
law."Springfield, I11.,
September 15, 1943
rtiold,and-ral nreau of
"I was born cmmigrated to tn: U.S.-and I became a naturalized citizen of he U.S. in- in
'bp1"lDgfi92. ld, Ill .
"I was employed at "A" in zbout 1931 and I am at the present
time f3mpl0j,'red at I-{ind "A" as :=. digger.
Ijoined TJ1?-v in- and 1.2main;-d .1: members of that union until
1932 at which time I joined r "A. I jOiDc.d PMA because my loo.-11 UH?-'
union changed to PLEA. I do not know the reason my local IE-I? union changed
to PEA.
"Iread in the nersppcr in about Sept. 1941 that Elshoff bought '
Mine "A" from Ryan. At the time I heard this I did not think there would
be any changc in the operation of Iaiinc A.
"Prior to the time Elshofi bought 3.-iin-2 "A" the ='.=J!1p10}T1:CS were
satisfied with Pk.I.»1. I thought Pit: was a good union, but I nover took
an active part in union é1CtiVi'tvi=_:S and it made no difference to me whether
I was 2. member of URI or
"1
joined UK?!
"1
1-Iine "B".
"1was never approached by an U327 orgmizer prior to the time I
in Scpt. 1941- I
hoard someone talking about Elshoff operating Mine "A" through
when I heard this I thought I would be out of a job.
did not hear any rumors that Elshofi would only open Mine "A"
' -459-
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1=e= JOHN L. IEWIS, ET AL
INTSRVIIW WiTi on condition that the employees joined UHW.
con inue "I did not attend any meetings at PEA hall or
Redmen Hall after Mine "A" was sold to Elshoff,
in Sept. 1941. I do not remember if I had notice of such meetings or not.
"I attended a meeting at the Elks Club on a Sunday in Sept. 1941.
I voted at this meeting to join U£T'le all present voted to join UHW.
I also joined UHX at the end of this meeting. I heard some of those
attending this meeting make a statement after we voted, that if we would
not join UH? Mine "A" would not be opened. I did not see any UHF
organizers at this meeting nor do I remember EdmondsoQ_ of UMW making a
talk at this meeting. I did not no to the UMW building after the
meeting. I find it difficult to_§£§3§ and understand English, therefore,
I was unable to obtain much inforxztion about the sale of Kine "A" and
What went on at metings.
"Conditions at Min: "A" have been about the some under UHW as
they were under FE .
"It makes no dlffhTuCQ to me whether I am a member of UH? Or
PEA. I went to be 2 member of which ever union that will slow me to work
the most.
"I have had this Stntrmtnt consisting of three pages read to me
and it is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
Si-% =<1 -
Eitnessed: -
pacinl A;0nt F.E.I.
pecial Afent, F.3.I."
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RE: JOHN 1.. IEIJIS, ETAL.
INTERVIEW 'TH field was
ial Agen
September 16, 1943 came
the United States a Uni
field; Illinois. 15 presently employed as a digger at
He cannot speak or
witness. He advised that he has never been arrested.
"Springfield, Ill.
Sept. 16, 1943
"1,- Ld Ill. make thefollowing voluntary s te"1en't gvhom I
o know to be Special Agents of the :u of n, an make
without fear of threat force, or promise of any kind.
"I was born in
became a U.S. citizen in
"I was working in Kine 'A', Springfield, in the spring of 1941,
of P..A. About Sept. of 1941 I read in the paper that ELSHOFF b
from RYAN. I did not bother to think much about this and did not
with anyone. I only attended one meeting after I read about the
was on a Sunday at the Elks Club. I went because I read about ita member
Mine 'A'
about it
and that
the paper. I usually do not attend union meetings.
one ever told me that Kine A would not operate except unde
not har anything about Kine 'A being operated by hauling c
. I did not hear that I had to join U.K.W. to keep my job. No
U.B.H. I did
thru Kine B'
"I was satisfied with P.X.A. but it did not make an difference
me whether I was under P.K.A. or U.H;W.to
at Spring-
RAH.
English very well, and would make an unsatisfactory
it
came to the U.S. inpand
at Mine 'A' as a igger.
as
ought
talk
sale
In
L
r
oal
to
"At the meeting at the Elks Club I voted to join U.K.W. and I joined
U.K.W. right after the meeting. I joined U.E.W. because all the other men did
and I wanted to keep my job. No one forced or threatened me in any wag and no
one told me I had to join U.K.H. I do not remember much about the meeting.
e
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ns= JOHN L. LE-us, ET AL
Ii iviff WITH
cooperative, and it is belIllinois, was
Mine A situation because he spoke at one oi the meetings at ma Hall on
this situation. has no known criminal record. He furnishedthe following signodgaemel nt= '
"Springfield, Ill-
September 19, 1945 _
~11, , Sprigfield. n1.do voluntaril mal-'e the following st1te*':en* to §pBC1n.1 Agentsq
he threats or promises have been ma e
"I was
in the mines about
A off and on since
with all the miners
and could vote.to cause me to go !n1s !a!ement-
7 .T started working
1A at me. have worked at Mine
.28 a digger. I erwiched over to PIA in 1932 along
A. I preferre d"PHA because I had more to say
I learned about the sale of line A from the newspaper, and I
thought that I was in for
over at Mine B. I didn't
going to pull the coal of
to the effect that Mine A
UIMA.
"I attended one
bythe sale of Mine A wasthe same kind of trouble that the miners had had
know what to expect as I heard that they were
mine A out through Mine B. I also heard talk
would remain closed until all the men joined
all '-there the situation caused
spoke at that meeting and told the-A-.J-3-an nil-]1lUUhJ,J.¬b EU
discussed.
men to find out what Elshofi was going to do before they switched over to
UMIA. Seems to me that acommittee was appointed. It seemed to me that
the feeling was in the air already that the gen were going to swing Ul!Y£A- @@»'==1 to be IMP» in M
sin c . 15 group was a ways r ng; 5 up something unreasonable or radical
when we were under PEA.
T di.d.nt attend any more " etines because Ithings were being run. I ml that
work mo over because I
"The next time 1 went to n meeting was at United Mine Workers Hall_ ..._ .s.92.... ...._-cl unu way
heard Pro ing to
stuck up for FAA.
where I was told that it was the last chance to sign up without an initia-
tion fee. The majority had already swung over and there was nothing also
to do if you wanted to work at lline A. mo men Joined because maznr of the
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92 92
9 §
RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL .
:
Mine A employees were old men add were
afraid they couldn't get other jobs. The
men had also read & heard about all of the
trouble at Nine E and didn't went to hareINTERVIEU'TTH
anything like that.
"When the mine first opened they would dock you for anything, and
when you went to the meetings you couldn't talk. They also elected their
own officers whether you wanted them or not.
"If I had e free and voluntafy choice of unions I would prefer
Progressives, as you can say what you think under PEA & elect your own offi
OBPSQ _ .
"I have read the above statements made by me consisting of 2%
pages. The same are true and correct.
/s/ _
I
Ztnes s ed: i
I/E ' t
/s/
Special Agents, F. B. I.
Springfield, I11."
1
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RE: JOHN L. LE"-"HS, ET AL
NTERVIET WITH On Se to ber 19 1943, _ oris see smi- P BE n r
was interviewed by Special Agents- 'and had diffioultv in understen_1ng thequestions propounded go gllm and for this reason, it is not believed that
he will make 11 good witness. He hes no criminal record. His statement
is es follows:
V - Springfield, Illinois
' September 19, 1945
mm old, 111111015,do r::e"* the *"~"o".-.'i:1g; vo-u....:rj. und-whom I know to be Soooial l Bureau of
Investigation. Ho threats or promises have been mode to me; I have been
told I need not make my stetesent and that this statement can be used in
court . '
"1 was born in_ 1 came to the United Statesin - I sun not s. citizen of the Unite States. I am now employed at
Mine '1'. as e digger and have been employed here since about _ I was
:. somber of the United ne Horkers at this time end remained 11 member
until 1932 when the rest of the miners at Mine '13 went over to the Pro-
gressive Miners Union. I was in favor of the Progressive Hiners Union andthe switch over. myself then remained Progressive Miners as
long as we could. I ee that this is e good union and that it conscien-
tiously tries to ro resent the miners. I first heard about the sale ofI-fine '1. i who reed about it in the newspaper. Tfigured that
my job was insecure and that I probably would not be able to go book as a
member of the Progressive Miners Union.
I heard the stories that Elshoff would not reopen the mine un-
less it was under the United Mine Workers Union and that he was going to
hoist the coal from Mine M out through 1-line 'B'.
"I attended the some-meetin s Lt the rro ressive nail and at thewas I has wt United Piine Workers Hell with
against joining the United Mine viorkors es long as I could. When we saw
that the majority had gone beck, we finally signed up. '
"I wish to soy that I went back to Mine 'A' as a ml!-I member only
because the majority did end to preserve my job. I cm not satisfied with
conditions in the ULTT cs you don't have :1 free vote or the right to dis-
cuss issues being put to a vote. These are rnilronded through. I1 I had
my free choice I would be e member of the Progressive Mine Workers Tinion.
This statement hes been rend to me b
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nz= JOHN L. LEI$- ET *1
a it 1 Q11 true-Iwrznvzgw WITH ||||||||| '
/-/1 i
Witnes sad:
Special Agents, F; .3 I
Springfield» I11-
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RE: JOHN L. LEHIS, ET AL.
P V E2 "ITH On Se tenber 15, 1943,
S rin field Illinois, was interviewed by
Special gen s and
wns cooperative and it is believed that he will make a goo
A1= 1 {ms nv rriminnl rnnnr Hi! ltnfomgnt i5 gs fgllqlt.*_ . .rnpness, he ...,...c.'o....... e..._, e. ....-......... .-e..-...= ....- .._...-.-._ ...
September 15, 1943
Springfield, Illinois
ll- __ 7 -
"I, Springfield
llli is e t.e o owing vo un ery s e omen tand whom I lcncrw to be Special Agen s o e e era
been made Bureau of Inves ige ion. No threats or promises of any kind have
to me; I have been told I need not make any statement and that this state-
ment can be used in Court.
" I becameI was born in
t rou h m father a on November inaturelized citizen h g y p_ I began working at Kine "A" sboutg es u United Mine Tiorker.
1 noticed thnt the U.H.]. seemed to get along th Er. Ryan all right. In
1932 our men become dissatisfied with John L. Lewis es President and when
he stole the ballots on the question of the wage scale we formed a new
union, the Progressive Hine orkers of America. I did participate in the
formation of P.H.A. by soliciting new members. During the entire time the
P.M.h. union represented the miners at Mine "AF. I was satisfied with the
organization end it appeared to properly represent the men. I first heard
about the sole of Mine "A" when 1 eeme home from town end saw it in th
paper. I figured this was bed for the minors and knew that We would either
have to go back to the United Mine'Korkers or give up our jobs.
I hoard the rumors that Elshoff wouldn't reopen Hine AF unless
it was under tho United Kine Lorkers and I also hoard it said that he was
going to operate Mine "A" through the Mine "B" shaft. While I didn't pay
any attention to the latter rumor I was inclined to beliE£ that the former
rumor was true. I hoard these stories from fellow members of our local.
P¢.;
~._=:
I'_4'4' - . 5"E RE: Lu LE-HIS, ILL:I
..
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INIERVIE3 BITE Our grievances are now handled by company mon and they refer the grievances to the Superintendent if they have .
continued time and he hns to take up the grievance with Oscar
Fslcotti, Superintendent of Kine "B". hnt he says goes
whether the men like it or not. Recently I noted that the loose explosivepowder was not getting out the coal and I got up at a nscting cf our local
and suggested that a Committee go nos Elshoff about putting in stickcvrdcr which is mere efficient. The committee composed o;_nd mother fellow were appointed and they talksmm with shofi. [email protected]@1- told me that 1 had better not cone
up to the next meeting, that t.ose e ows were fixing up to boat ms up
end that 5lshcff had snid that I was n "Progressive Lgitntor!
I have noticed also that the local union is not disposed to
cppesc the company on e particular issue. Since the powder incident when
the union failed to make an issue out of the stick powder and accepted the
company's wishes I have stepped going to the uion meetings.
"I have been read the within statement consisting of three andQ M by i ml it W-
/==~»/ _
Litnessed:
end:
_Special Agents, F.B .Springfield, Illinois.
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RES L4 ET £1" _
INTERVIEU'IITH On September I4
_ at his hm *'~°
zis y I1 '.~' 5
_ a:;.~pez.re-3 to be cooper
llff1CJ;ty in CJnrPOhenQ1HL questions propounded to him and it is not be-
lieved that he would make a geci witness. He disclaims any criminal recordswas interviewed
old,
He rave the following signed statement:
Springfield, Illinois
Scptonhcr 14, 1943=
~-1. '
do " ~ the fo11;win; vzluntury : -men
when l knew to be special
nvestigeticn. N- thrents or prtmisos have been nude to mo; I have been
told I ncod not mekt any statement and that this statement can be used in
Ccurt 0field Illinois,
=11
Bureau of
"I was born i and be came a naturalized
citizen of_the United States in 1932 er 1955. I was employed at Hino "A"
ir and have been w-;rkin{_j there ever since. In that time I have be-
longed to the United Mine hcrkors Union and the Progressive Kine hcrkers
Union. Before 1932 I was satisfiei nith the United Kine Herkers organi-
zstion and I changed over to the P.K.h. because the rest cf them did. kfter
I changed over to the IEA I was satisfied with that crgsnizntion and believe
it represented the minors-
1 learned of the sale cf Mine AF to Elshef in 1941 by reading
it in the newspaper. I nlso received s letter from HF. Ryan in which he
said he had sold the mine and that I was no longer on employee of Mine uh .
I also received an unsigned letter tolling me that if I wanted to keep my
job at Kine "L" thnt I would have to change my union affiliations. I knew
when I heurd the mine was sold that I would have to change unions if I
wanted to keep my jtb. However, no one put any pressure on mo to change
unions. I hoard u rucr to the effect that Blshoff would not reopen Mina
A unless it was operated by the U.H.T. but it hed no influence on my
decision to join the U.H.H.
U attended one meeting cf the Mine PAP employees held at the
Elks Hell where the miners discussed as to whether or not they should go
ever to the UEI. I recall that a decision was reached at this meeting to
go over to U.E.i. end then Rey Edmundson was celled in. He premised us
rur jobs.
"I have noticed no difference in working conditions under U.M.3.
.- 445 - '
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T'ERVIFh BITQ as compared with warking ccnditions under th Progressive|ii'IlluIIIIlI|| " crs '
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RE: Lo LE-I18; 11-Ln
Lln Unlcn.
continued!
*1 have boen read the within statement consisting cf
two uni a fraction pages and it is all true.
/=/ _
qitncssu;
Special Agmnts, F.B.I-
Syringfield, Illincis.
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Re: JOEN L. tans, ET AL.
Agents r.......: .._.. +1..,;l?ff..3-mgy.-.rpE£4e -4». JJU-LJ..hE. UJL LUUJDC U1 bill-D 4-ll.
and agitated and although he expressed a willingness to give the Agents
any inforration he could and was outwardly entirely cordial, he refused to
answer any questions concerning the events that happened at the meeting
held at the Elks Club. At the conclusion of the interview he was asked if
he had been approached concerning this case and told not to talk to Agents.
He denied this repeatedly. Ho was also asked why he was scared to tell
Agents about the meeting at the Elks Club, and while he denied being
frightened, it was noted that this question gave him a definite start.
It is not believed that .vas telling all that he knows concerning this
case and it is suggested that he be brought before the Grand Jury for further
questioning. He advised he his no criminal record. He refused to sign
the stitcment, which will be set out below, although he stated that it was
all true and that thcrc was no reason why he should not sign the statement.
" give the following information to E
kno"-=:n to me to be Spec. Agents of t E .B.I.
o threats or promises have been made me to get this statement. I am now
working at Kin: A as a driver I have been there since 1932 or 1933. I
vns born I jo =" '- . 7. . l ' J_ - lmd the P L A because I wanted to
I had no preferance o one nion over the other.
I hoard through gossip that
never paid any attention to it at the
Id work someplace else. from l932 to
P.£.n. was handling things. when Elshoff took over Mine 'A nobody came
to my house at all to ask we about it or which union I wanted. I don!t
recall hearing anything at the time to the effect that Elshoff was going
to take coal from Kine A through mine 'B' nor do I recall hearing that
he would only operate line s with a U.K.@. union,interviewed at his home, on Seitember 17'
Pity .¢_ tr ha:J-J-AL H'92'uJ-J ldiod.
arcs -"QC
Elshoff was taking over Bins 'A'. I
time; I figured if I didn't work there
1941 I was satisfied with the way
"Ihe only meeting I remember attending was at the Elks Club_ I
dont recill how l heard about this. I don't remember at this time who
hidmchargc of this umeting. I am not sure why this nesting was held at
the Elks Club and I dont want to say what the purpose of the meeting was.
I was not a member of say committees appointed at this time and I did not
go to Elshoff's, or Edmundson's office or to the Leland otel after the
meeting. I joined the U.U. . at Eine 'a' about the time it opened. I
joined U.£.4, of my own free will. Conditions at Mine A are the same
under U.H;T. as they were under P.K.. so far as I am concerned.
I
- 450 -
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Re: JUH L. LEEIS, ET AL.»92.___.,___.._...._.___..._._. ~~ A- -7-- -1-;»92~--J_': -~A-4» -; l
.
IHTLRVIEJ RITH "I have read this two page statement and to
the best of my knowledge it is all true and the infor-
Con inue mntion therein is just as I have given it to the Agents.
t"s I have no particular rea I doh*t care to sign n1 L
Witnesses:
/s./ Qbpecial Agent, F. .I.it. Puul Einn.
: ' 4, .E.I. p c111 19th
Springfield, Ill.
Sept. 17, 1943"son for this.
I
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C , !92
RE; JOHN L. LEWIS, ET LL.__;- - -- " 7____ --Ir -;e7.; _
n
IETERVIEH WITH The followin investi atic was conducted by Special Agents and at Spring-
field, ptember 15, 194:5 Illinois, on _ . _
. At his residenc Springfield, Illinois,
-ever had been in any agents interviews end he advised he n--trouble in his lipé. _ H: appeared to be honest and truthful but it was
noted he did not know much about what went on because of his position. It
is felt that he would make afair witness if his testimony were necessary
and he appeared to be very cooperative.
The following signed statement was obtained from-
-
Spfingfiél. I11.
Sept. 15, 1943.
III give the following information to
, w o have identified themselves to me as
pecia ents of the .E.I.
this statement.Ho threats or praises have been made to get
"I started at Mini -*1 arpupd E954 6: at the present time I am
' w s a' qthere. Iwss bor1 1 amem er of the P.M.A. when I started at Mine A in . I ook no hand
in the switch fro U.E.. to P.E.A. and after the strike in 1952 I got a
job in a place where the P.H.A. was. I hated to see the trouble ihich
caused the split between U.E.W. and P.H.A. I would rather have seen the
men satisfied with one union.
"I first learned that Elshoff had taken over the Mine "A" through
the papers and then later I got a letter to that effect from Hr. Ryan the
former operator. at the time I did not know what would happen, whether I
had a job thre or nctL I figured I would just have to wait and see. Be-
fore Elshoff took over Mine "A"
Ryan. I was not approached as
U.H.W. or not and I had no one
I don't think I heard anything
be operated through Mine "B"
only open Mine A under s U.M
P.¥.A. Hall and one at Elks=
"I believe I readthings went along well between P.M.A. and
to my opinion or whether we should join the
come to me and try to get me to join U.H..
about the possibility that Mine A might
. I did not hear any rumor that Elshoffwould
.. contract. I attended 2 meetings,one at
in the paper of the meeting to be held at
P.M.A. Hall. I think this meeting was held just to discuss how the mine.
was to be opened. I am not sure but I don't think any committee reported
or was appointed. I don't recall any trouble at that meeting.
Q
..>
93!.; I
ix. L
RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET LL.
ITERV "" "1 heard er the meeting at the Elks Club through thepapers.I believe 12-h8.t p!"B8i6d. Thiscontinued! meeting was to see how t e ee ing of the men wesg
about starting the mine. I ihik ihii WE did iii
sign a slip to go over to U.K.W. if we wanted to go to work. I thought
I would be without a job if I didn't sign up, so since that was the nay
it was going to be I signed the slip of my own free will. Bdmundso cams
over later and gave a talk. I don't recall what was said. I did not care
which local was at Mine "A"; I just wehtea to go to work. I did not go to
Edmundsons or 5lshoff's office the night of the meeting. Conditions at
Kine "A" since 1941 under the U.M..'are the same in my job as always.
I would not be able to say as to how they are in the mine because I don't
come in contact with the miners.
"1 have had Agent qread this statement which is written on
this and two other pages to me. t is all true and correct to the beat of
my knowledge and is just like I have told it to the Agents. I am signing
this of my own free will as it is the truth.
Signed
hitnesses
Special Agent, FBI
St 0 Paul ; Kinn-
h
Spec. Agt. FBI miw!
5pringfie1d, 111.
5&pt¢ 15 "
- 453 -
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RE: some L. isms, is ..1.. "
' On September 14' 19-$3 Sgeeiel agents
and i:e"e
is very intelligent end was outwardly entire coo ereti'v0- Itis to be noted that at the time of this interview idvised
agents thtt although he hsd joined the Hi-.. he had always iz.vore<. the IIlI'I¢
He advised that he has necrininx-1 record. I-run the infornntiern given 'at the time of this interview it is not felt the-t_would
- make u good witness, partieulurly us his story is liable to e prejudiced
due tc his admitted preference for UHI.
The follewim; siigned st'..tonent was procured fran-
!pring;!l1eL1, H1 ,
Sewts 14, 1943.
" give the follovaing infornlltien to-
;;nd 1vho are imown to no to be Specitzl Jsguntl
of the F.B.I., no throats or prirxisos hl.VD been ml-do no to procure this
inf srnat ion ¢
"I on 92n.I'king at dine J; es 'st&ble boss. I have been there
ubiut '05-T80 I we-s born tin I first joined £1 minepi in iin union n '1: Springfield, it W138 .; . ~ . :orkin;; uti e '43,
in 1932, when they went to 9.31. . with the others. I would just es seen
hive stayed with U-:{J..'- at the tines During; the tine we ht-r! the F-311»
union trtllino he there were no outst:;m.i.n;; disputes there between the
conp-ny mic Tum or. lhen IJLSHOFF took over Mine nu in 1941 I
believe I reed uf it in the peters. I figured thut ii he bud bought
it and they mlle e switch, I would ;;.> ever with the rest of then, if I
wanted tc stay there. I ms not up 1:-etched Lt this tine about Joinim;
the U.I{.';. I heard sane talk that ELSHOFF might Operate Mine .-I through
Nine B but it was just talk. This mi,-;ht possibly be done if they minted
to make e big; mine out oi 2 little onus es they ere connected by the rs-in
r.1¢9211¢-._,_=,--Q-I 1 1-HA I92 92+ hnnvl 4-hm-92-. 'i!T$1'r-I92YC'U' wran m.'92nr92 +.n n1nnn Hint! is @1355is-41.;-,,un J; A u5L| uv nun-5 92|4l-U Q-s- vs. ---.. D--.-.1! -- _..__- -.-._-._-
the men joined UM.-I. I attended one neetim; ut the hednens Hull the met-
ing at the Elks and tried to attend one at the P.iI.:.. Hull but the Polio-kl
officials wouldn't let us held it and the m0etin{; ms broken up. Them
were only one or two who could spot!-ks I did not see any fight I got
scrtn discussed end left before it w:-s ull ever. I think there was e.
ecnmittee upcintecl to see if we couldn't find e place to have e
meeting. I ms not n member of that committee. It seems to no the
P
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RE: JOIN L. LEHS, F1 1.1..
y;-m-r -v
continued
I dent reoull
Mine n and to my knowledge nothing was
join U.M.'.i. to keen Mine MU open. liy*"""-i-' wv* A.g~i . ---o-n-.-.-q,.¢_..._. .--- _ i__i,___r_4_,_"_:.. __ _I _
Q
meeting was in charge cIe took
took o standing vote on whether they would go to
11.11.11 and I think they voted solid to do this.
hearing nnythixzg about opening
said about the non having; to
theory as to why the non switched
over is that E131-IJFF bod c contract with U.M'.'. ct Mine '15 and would
orcb-ibly operate Mine 11. under o contract with U.H.i. In my heart I
have olwoye been U.11.- I. '1 joined P.M.». in 1932 only because I hind to
go over to keen my job. 1§ft6I' tho voting was ever luff EIITUIITBON come over
and talked to us. He said he thanked the men for the way they had -voted
and told then they would be cccaatod bl-cl: in U.H.U. and treated the my
they had ols-rays been. Thlat sf-no time we
I did not go to Edmun dsons office, the
after this meeting. I hove never hold
Since the U.l!.a. has been beck ut liine
niine -. have been improved. Dues ore
ditions have injaroved, I thinlc, if tho
orcqressive official, I understand sily
over to U.1{."i. if they did he hud acnesigned cords going over to UJIJF.
Leland Hotel or ELSHOFFS office
r. union office and did not then.
U." I think that conditions ct
obout the some but working-, con-
mon con see it. I heard o
that h¢.dn't any body better turn
hoye In Southern Illinois that would
take care of then. I we-s not forced to join U.1i.'h'. but did so of my own
free
"I hr-vo rend this 3 .-gt? stztonont 5: to the best of my
knowledge and belief it is all true and Ls I ht-ve {given it to the
F.3.I. nqcnts, I on Signing; this of my
"Iitnosses:
Sgeoiul nbont,
St. Paul, Minn.
Hen 5.1. u11w.!
Sarinrfio 1d , I11 .
Sept. 14, 1945."own will us it is the truth.
Q
--455-
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D.Re: Jam L. mris, er AL.
, TERVIEIJ WITH Special Agents -and
S t r= went to the residence of
Springfield, Illinois,
= ad- and with the as-istance of a neighbor woman, w om he called over, he
vised t'n=.t he does not understand English well and that his rife does
not eithsr. He further stated that he has been at Mine 1* for many years
and that his daughter is in Chicago for two weeks, but that she could
assist in interviewing him upon her return. He advised that he hurt
himself at Mine A and has been in the hospitai until a month ago.
t further advised that he was a citizen through naturaliza-tion and thit he was born ix. He said he attended a meeting on
a Sunday at the elks Club, but he did not know what ~.-rent on because he
could not understand hnglish and he advised that he voted over to U-W
because the rest of the local did. He said that he do:-s what the young
men do and nobody forced him tn-" vote that way. He stated that if his
daughter were present sh; could act as his interpretes.
Btenographic notes of the above were t:-ken by Agent
and they are buiiig retained in instant file.
It was noted that -is a rather oldman and it is felt that
he would mdkc a poor witness.
-455-
I
U C
T
-I
Re JOPN L. LEWIS, ET AL.
interviewed at his residence, _
S Se nbe 11> pringi eld Illinois on ptQ4 r ,
Agents an _____. <1P He advised that he had never been arrested. H8 stated also tnat
e still has a job at Mine a although he has not worked for the st fiveor six months as he said that he had to leave because e himself did not feel ve well. wever e sta ed" ioois are still out there end he can return whenever he wants 1:-o=
J appeared to be more intelligent than the ordinary miner and it is
felt that he would make o. fair witness if his tes iraon were necessary.
The following signed statement was obtained from
Supt. 11., 1943
-1-o
order to got me to give this statement.
"I was born
in-I became a
to in- Ha to v-ork
I think this was in the spring of 1941; I amve the following statement
who er: known to me to be
its or promises have beenW LDpecial i
made me in
I came to the U.S.
eld. I first went
the spring it went back as U.1i.|f.,
a digger and worked
there up until 5 or 6 mar-the ago. I first joined a mine unionaround about -Lin Dpringfi-31d, Ill. I joined the Progressiveswhile ".1-orking at he Jefferson Zine but I worked at Mine '11 as a
Progressive for Bill Ryan- The mine closed in the spring and then
ilshoff took it over and We joined the U.h1.'5i'.
to go back to work. I felt this was the only
open the nine everyone knew this. I rend inwas to take the mine over, then of course the
and they felt the only salvation for them was
A couple of rten 1:12.: to sce me at my home and-C
in a body in order
tray to zet Zlshoff to
the paper that Elshoff
men all knew it too
to join the v.n.w.
asked me how I felt
and 1- told th.-:1 I was going to do whit the other men did. when I
worked at Mine A for Bill Rvan they never had any trouble, for a fact
they never have any trouble there non either. I never heard anything
about tho possibility of Elshoff operating the 3-iine A through
B. here was a rumor at the time that the U,L1.W. had given
E-lshofi a pile of money to operate ne M and get it over to U.I-Li.
I heard too that unless the men went right over to U.li.". the mine
would be shut down. I never attended any zaeetings where the question
of returning the 2.-Zine 'A' men to the U.!l,h, was discussed. I Joined
the U.2.I.-l-. out at Ifine 'A',__ I never voted on returning to U.MJI.
-45?-
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;T ERV1E..' BETH I just. joined up tho? told us our P ILA. card would
bc excepted so I just jozmed up at the mine as the
Continued other men had joined
I have never had any Egrferznce as to winch unlon I belong to
1-s.
/s/ L-3 Re: JOIN L. I.E1=T.[S, ET AL
s Dpecial .ag.nt, F.B.I.
_'_:P' " J "' P1.
{.35
AP.po-ial Agent P31
:-Q Springfield, 111.
- 5@p'¢__ 11., 191.3"
. 4~ .17--.-=4
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"I haw: had Agcnt_ road this two page handwrltten state
I rant. to :;:e and it is all true and correct and as I have g1ven it to the
Ag.-rts. I am signing this .>f my own free vnll
Signed
..' ' nfitnesses:
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92 Q .
0 , 0
RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ETLL
w|* |i¥IE"I WITH
-uIllin ' s interviewed at his homo '$ .. =md_
was cooperative bot had to be questioned threug]'L*'on interpreter standing of higiieh is not very good. For that .reason, plus the feet that he hnd very little knowled 0 of the Mine A situationit is not felt that he would make o good witness. ht-ls no known
ori1:1inz.1 record. Ho furnished tho follevring signed eta :
" _- I11-
Soptomber 18,-, 1945
"I, I1l., do voluntarily make thefollowing statement to Special Agents end Q_£ No threats er premises of any kind ve eon mode o eause
to make his statement.
, "I was born in o.r-riving in America in
1905. I was ntxirulizod at Spring ie , . . I started in mines as
soon as I came tc iozoriou, jnining up with IT1e'L'i. I hove never been on
officer in any union. I em presently ersployed at Mine A as o rligger, having
started there in 1936. I had jei_n_the Progressives at that time. Both
unions are the same to mo. ~
"I knew that r. RUN sold the mine to H:-. ELSHOFF, who owns
hne B, but don't lmow how I found out.
"I never heard about Mine A going to be olesed unless the men
joined UMZL, or that Liino it would be closed and the cool token out through
Hino B0
"1 attended one meeting in Springfield, where the men decided
to join UL-Ht, I don't lcnow whore that meeting was held, or remember muoli
about it.
"I have ho-<1 the above page of statements undo by mo road to
me by 4'i5ent_ The same are true 6: oer:-oet.
. *. /'=/ v
Special
Springfield, I11,
-459-
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0 ' 0 o
Rel JDEN L. LEInI5, ET AL.
TERVIEET WITH interviewed at his residence,
in is by Special on September
15, 191.3, with the assistance o e as he does not un erstand the
Lnelish language very well. She advised that he has never oeen arrE$*»@i'l-
It is felt he would make a poor Witness. He furnished the following
signed statement.
gpringfieldi llls
S¬ptp 155
who have identified themselves as~ the following information to
' of t1'~FF1B.I. I have had melp me as I
don't understarrd the nglish language very well . have to
say will be the truth to the best of my know I was bornhe t» 11- 5- & I heme a
i citizen ye-are ago. J-. have been at Years 5: an33 still thgne as e dizger. In 1932 I just fo rest over to
P.lI.-H. 8; I did not care what union was there as both were the same
to me and I did not prefer one over the other. I saw in the paper
. that lshoff hot line A and I was not interested in it at all then
' as 1 didn't 0'5;-'5 who owned it. I had no complaints against PJLA.
as far as I was ,concerned. My wife says that two men came to my
" home but I wasn t home & they wanted me to Join up with U.E."-:5. so
that Elshoff wodld open up Liine A but they never came back to see me.
K The men at mine A all talked around that if they wouldn't join up
is with U.i£.-'-. nlshoff would not open up line 1* & I believed it but
not for sure and that was why I later joined U.M.". I never went to
" any of the meetings at P.L£..i92. Hall, edman Hall, 1-lks Club and I
never was told about them E: I don 't understand good anyway if I
go. I signed up at the meeting in the U.1*.l.-T. Hall. It was the
first meeting of the new 5.15. . local as they had turned over by then
8: this was before Mine A opened. I never voted 8: had to sign up in
order to so back to work as the local had changed from P.l{.A. to U.H.-1'.
-#5: Since U.I*5~~. has been at Hine h things are just the same for me as4
they were under K1-1.1-X. and it still doesn't mike any difference tome what local is there. I have had Azentqread this two !
page statement to me and it is true and correc .
ls LI signed _
_92 f "Witnesses:5 W /=-/ lF _ 1 J-?oBnIu,.
3 UT]g rk Special Kgeg-112 FBI -ll!!
Springeld, Ill.
Sept. 15, 1943"
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RE: JOHN L. _1.sw1s, so 1.1.
.3 VIE? XTITI-I The following; investi nation was conducted byi S M 1=~=~==-= Quad 1- _ ht Springfield, Ill e s, on Septem-
ber 1?, 1545. _
At his residence Springfield, Illinois,
Arents interviewed w e n vise 10 never has been ar-
restot. in his life. was noted that he is an intelligent individual, and
- Nil d intelli- he rezidily understood the questions and enswored them rem y on
gently. It is felt he is honest, and he appeared to be cooperative, and it
is believed he would melee o very good witness if his testimony were neces-
sary .
Agents obtained from him the following signed statement:
inf ield, I11
Sept. 17, 1943
give the following information to H
entified themselves as Special Agen s 0
tm s er premises have been made ms to rive this infer-mution. I quit Mine A in & had been there about O years or so.
Presently I'M 6: have been since Jan. 1943.
I was born in was not at Mine A when it went
F. L5. L. in I was n eon}; when I started et Fine A. It
seemed at first F. LE. A. was o. little better but et end were about some es
U. ii. W. but still. may be a little better. I think I heard from the men in
1941 that Elsh-off bot Mine J. and I didn't know then just what would be tho
result of it. Up to then I had been satisfied with I. II. 1;. I heard men"
went around but no one ee.-no Z: eslzed mo to join over or how I felt then.
I believe, tolc. no about o. meeting; thut .-es to be held. Io.!so !eore| urea the miners that Elshoff might tote cool out from I-line A
- ' l * " o mentioned at the meeting. I think thru Mine B 6.. if I reziemoer u wus els told us that I never went to may meetings. I
e so cord that if we wont ever o . . . TI. 1-iino 1. would be opened 6: I be-lieve some 92.;Il0 told us this too at the meeting it I think it wes
who said it E: then I felt that I hod to je-in over to U. 1!. ff. or I weu
without work. I think I attended several meetings but I did not" go tethe
one on Sundoj; at the Elks Club but I went to e, few before then. I did at-
tend o meotq on the 7th floor of the U. H. TI. B165. & that was when I
joined up. E<.:.1un.scn wtxs not there but some Hoard member of U. 1!. J. was
there 5; welcomed us beck into the fold 8: seid we would be treated very
nicely. We were told we had to belong to U. H. '51. to work out there so I
had to join up in order to work. Lfber this I believe I was working al-
ready & had to go to this U. M. H. to sign up & I think it -nos for us who
had not been at the Elks Club. It vros either to go to work under U. I. Pl.
.461-tr
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, i
j 11.12.; JG!-_L92I L, L-E-T13, 1:: AL
W.-'tc,-ok over the russor was the Ir0¢§1"0sBi1'08
used to run the mine but that the ccmpany ~.-:c.u1c'1 nuw run it. Things werenet as gm-;I mcr Us Bis T56 as unis: Es 1:1, £2, Q they changed u lot of small
things such as starting at 7:15 L. M. instead of 7:50 h. H. I hnvo read
this 2 twc! page statement 6' it is true 6: correct tc the best of my
kn.w10dgs. This makes ! three pages nrw.i--'_
-Q I am signing this rf my own froo will.
.__ n - $1sI1@<1- L
-::!'_ iE.!!- ':.|___ _ _ ___ _1. vllUI1GS SO15 2
..
/S/' It Special Iu;c~nt, . - 1.,
St. Paul, Inm.
/s/ Special Agent, F. B. I. L1i1w.!
Springfiul, 111.
' Qcpt. 1?, 1942.1-;
-
-2 4
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..|-.4,.., ...4.
-452-
s_ _ _ - _ |-_-nu--e__; _;*;- 1-urn- "1s:*._* .__: 1 ' rv-";i:,. .. 4- -'- "_ 4_:svq_ru-Itpnqnnururgnv-qw--pp-Iv-I-'-0-v"'NT F F or be without s job. I did net belong to my
committees A-. did not go to Er1:1unt.sc=ns or i
Ccntinuod Ellshoffs office. It seemed that after U. H.
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C1 Q F
Re: Jom L. Le-as, 2:1" AL,
a'i"i 'r"Ii" "WITH , who has a room ald, Illinois, wai intern, 1943 by 5pecia1 Agentsand He advised that he has no criminal record. It was
noted that he was rather hard to understand, although he appeared to
¢Y* " . _understand the questions. It is
unless his testimny were
1 ' d -fol owing signe c-or 1msdy.a-lt he would make a rath_r poor witness
sary. Agents obtained the
which he signed in the presence
!prir.-giiel!,
Sept. 15, 19é3
"I give the following information to
, who are known to ne to me to be Special
Agent o .A§: . . . .o re s or promises have been made to get me
give this information. -'
"' ave been at -"ine A as a digger for about yrs. I was born
I came to U.5. in about I became a
citizen abou o in_spring.
I joined over with P-ALA. when the rest of the men at Line 'A'
did it was all the same to me which union they had. At the time PJLA.
ws5'tE¢ union at Lane A I liked them.
"I heard that L-lsho had taken over is-line A
other miners and I also got a letter from Ryan telling
was all right tith me I did not care who ran the minea job. I net some fellows on the street and they toldthe papers, from
of it. It .
long as I had
if we didn_t me
join up with U,L.-'. maybe the mine would not open and Elshoff might take
the coal out through 1-tine B. I dent know who these men were & there
were many of them all talking this way. when I heard this and that it
didn't cost anything -1 figured l better join the U.L¬.». it didn't make
any difference to me one-way or another any way. There were several meet-
ing__ held at this time. I went to one at Redmans Hall and one at the
Llks Club. I know at these meetings we were told that if we wanted
to have Kine A opened we would have to join U.l!..'i. as Elshoff don't
like the 1'1-ogressives. it the Elks Club we voted for going over to U.li.i'-
it was by standing vote. after the election Fray Edmundson came and gave
1 talk; I dont know what he said other than that U.li."I. was a good Unicm.I voted for UTLi.'-H. because i wanted to so to work and you couldn't get
a job any place else. I signed up for .lE.»i. that very same afternoon. I
was not a member of any committee and 4- did not attend the meetings in
Edmmdsons or Llshoffs office after the Ike Club meeting,
-463-
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Re: Jam L. 1£nIS, ET AL.
-. ;,-; v; - "CQnd1t,ic.»ns at Kine A under II.i£.i. are the BaliT as my W PM as far as I M
Continued! _ .t; W ha? *E* _.-E°?§ % i§-.*I'i-§?§e Si'a§i'"i.?.Z..E?~.arid 15 all true 3-DU CDFTECB BU 16-I" tn: "' uau Jwu-.1--Lu A '1-H 92'"~'~ '---*
' ng it of my own free wil1__ E -Si
"Jitne Q :__/.g./ B
sp¬C13! ggggl, 1-5.1-;
Linn.lm]peel 5;, 5; M1w.!
Springfie1d,'Il1.
Sept. 15, 1943"
464 -
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RE: JOHN L. LE-HS, E1 AL. M . ._--
tion wt ducted by
e rooming
inter vi-_
contested in the morning and=~ "news The mw .% 3peei1.1gsnts and %7 I Q
Prinz! ~.l , 19
isld, my-ants
16, 1945 he ms
us he hnd to go to work around
11:00 h=M. he suggested agents return at 10100 4..M. on September 1?,
which they did but agents he-rd to wait for him about 10 minutes s he
did not appear et his room until 10:10 h..M.
He was very uncooperative and he was told
if he did not wish to talk to agents he did not have
he wanted to. During the interview he once asked if
through yet end he mas again told that if he did not went
questions he should so udvise agents end they would leave
agents to continue.
He denied that he he-d been contacted by 1-nyenc
to be withholding inform:-tien end it is suggested that he
before the Gr-and Jury to ascertain his full story.
Ho furnished the fella.-ring unsigned stetenunta.at the start that
to but he said
agents were not
to answer the
but he said for
end he is felt
be celled
Springfield, I!!.
Sept. 17, 19430
give the following information to-
whe have identified themselves es Special agents
promises hnvc eon n dc no to give this of he F B-.1. Ne threats er ' oninformation. I have been at Mine 4. ubout yuurs A: I em still there& deliver powder. I drove mules on day shi till 1% years ego. I
was born in In 1932 I went ever toh P.M.i.. es the ecel did J: 1 no c p e organise. I don't enre to
srly if I wished to go beck to one union ever another. I reed in papers
that RYJJI sold out Hine 11. It didn't nuke eny difference to me [.8 I
have to make e living. I never heard that Mine 4». might be operated
thru Mine B. I don't knew if Mine .1; was shut down in 19¢]. or not but
I knew it was shut dean for 2 summers. I don't on-re to answer if I heard
that ELSHOFF would operate it Only us U.11..T. nine. 1.11 I lmevr is whet
I read in the pepcrs. I did net go to any meetings as I think I went
an nights then & did net go out to meeting |..t Elks Club. all I knew
about it is frcn the nupcrs. I was not on any committees then - they
are no ED-J for anyone. I hed no complaint at all against P.M.1.. I won't
-465-
4:"W9 ' h %; .
1' C V O
RE] L0 -ail
answer if l have any preference for one aver
unothgr. 1 gig-nod up at Mine n. with the U-11470
N0 one has talked to FIB about this mwatisutiw
& it is "true to the best of my h1OW1Odg0o
ii
pgciill J92gc11 ' OBIII special 1gent
St Pul, uinnoSpringfield , I11 -
n.,.-.4- 1'1 104:-"PHPUD ii, #77"-
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oi
RE: JOHN L. 1.5515, KI AL
- "" " .7 WITH follcwin investigation was conducted by Special Agents
at Bpringfisld, Ill-
inois, on ep em er l , 194 |
eld, Illinois, Agents At his resid
interiiewed _in the
has been arrested in his life. sane culty in understanding
the questions asked as he'is re terate and he had sane difficulty in
expressing himself. It is felt that he would mks a poor witness unless his
testimony is necessary.and he advised he never
-gents obtained from hin the following signed statanent:
t Springfield, Ill.
Sept. 16, 1943.
I give the following information to who have identified themselves as Special ligents of the . . .
No threats or promises have been made to me to give this statement.
I was born in 6: I came to U. 5. in-8:
becnrne a citizen cbou a pring eld, I11. I have been at lline
h re. I oined over to P 11.11. A as e. digger for ebou years dc an still t e j .
in 1932 cs 0.11 others did. I like both unions es they don't mks any di1-
ference to me at ell. I reed in papers that Elshoff Rot Nine A 8: people
also talked about it. I didn't think it would make any difference to me who
owned it or whet union I belonged to. I liked P.H..'l. while at 1-line A & they
were alright to me. No one 6: asked me about joining over to U.lJ.'-3. in 1941.
I don t remember of hering that El shoff night take coal out of liine A thruKine B. Everyone was talking th:-.t EJ.shof£ would open Kine A es U.H.-1'. 5 I
felt & believed that way 6: then figured I would be out of a job maybe too as
jobs were 1'2.rd to get; I heard they had some meetings but I don't understand
whet they say so I never went to many meetings. I don't know or remember if
I was st Redme.ns Hell but I think I was at 1711:: Club nesting on a Sunday
when the men stood up & voted. I don't know what they said. We ell signed
up to go back to 'lJ.l'l.'--. then. I signed up with U.M.'»'"-'. in order to have a job
Everyone was saying if we did not sign up we would have no job and I have slarge family so mo to have a job. I did not belong to any committee. I
don't know what else was said at the meeting 6: I went right back home afterthe meeting. I find no difference in iie union from another 8: we have to work
1.. .0 4.1.. T 1. 92-. A ' 1. -92+ ram-I tn Ina thin tiff! ! D528 8tB1':8" _-._J ___ 92__L Q. .--. Muxuer Uvun us. uuumu 1. n»".vu .-fiu -1-Ev...-_ -....__ -- ._.- --_- -- - .-. , U
ment 8: it is true 6: correct to the best of my knowledge end I have signed this
r own free win. o my /vi
S F.B I. St. Pr.-. 1 llinn.
pee c. agen .B.I. Hil1I.!' _ 487 _
" 7 i '*' 7 - '- is-gs-_-III»; :_:_ :;__.--9292;--.. ,__....__-__._-.,--__...;:.z_e___ v.-3,? _ ____7 --- i - - -- _
_ ._.., _ .--.- . _._- _ . __
_ Q
rm JOHN 1.. LEI-IS, ET AL.
-- rm mm» resides
Spnngiield, 018, was
Springfield Gffiee by Special
and 1943.
- was He is a
4* .1. citizen.
-Al e+a-Minn 1*92wn 92-TU 92-Inbnb B6555
members of both UIJIF
be influencing his statement, in View of the fact that he could recalllittle "r" inf ti 0th than hi EH ve speci 1c oma on. er s poor memo:-y,hi-rould be a good witness due to his appearance and y to1 Express himself. He furnished information as set forth in the 1- *-
'.-.1 signed statement.
"Springfield, 111 September B, 191.3.
__ ""* name is make the following statement
A to one who have identified
-_ themcelves o me to be pe 1. e. 0 o Federal Bureau of
Investigation. No promises, threats, or consideration of any kind
;;_:_ has been made to me to make this statement. T an lling, if noses- '§'aTy, to go to court, and repeat any part of this statement.1
a
_~ R-.v'|.
"In 1941, },{:Ln0 A closed on the last day of llarch. This was the
* usual custom of this mine when it 1'-:23 operated by William Yvon. i
__'- went int I "Ina busy
and idid zcep pos e oo muc on 1? a e men -ere _,_. I Went.
to te meetings, and did whatever activity was necessary. _
"One day after an announcement D hadpurchased ia.n's int: and ran__ into
Union neeTng' at RE-Hz s _ -. I asked then that the meeting Trny
I
a, goting to be hold at R::dnanS hall Y-hen the Progressives had {H511
_ ofptheir ofn, They told me thlit they could not get any justice at the
-, i Progressives. Before that I had heard rumors among the men that Elshoff
' M and !.%in=.: B was driving an entry from B int-o lilne ii, and 1-"ere going
to opeate I-Ilflt: A from Mine B. The nen who were working in Mine B used
to cone out and tell us about that. I asked these men -.-.-rw they were
going to have a meeting, and whether they wanted to go out of the
~468-
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IE: JOHN L» LEY'IS, ET AL
I Progressives. They said no,_ _th_at they Just wanted to
find out about their Jobs at'I!ine 1.,!Con!1nued!
_ M do not recall
after that. It was heldexec-ly '§'.'hat happened at the first meeting we hold _
at the Progressive Hall. I do not think that ameeting was held st _Rzdnan's hell. I know thatq and these others,
and other men talked at
Iline B into I-Zine .1, andthe nEeting about the entry eing driven from
the possibility of mining Mine 1-. from mine B .
They said than that they did not think that we would be able £6 get our
jobs back because of tat. They said that they thought that if we joined
the thited Liinc Yorkers, that Iiinc I. would be reapened and not be mined
through Tfine B. I do n
that, but that was theot recall that they quoted anyone as having said
general consensus oi opinion. It Y-as common
knowledge that the entry was being driven from B to .1. At that meeting
a corzrnittee was elected to go to see Elshoff and find out what was going
to happen to Mine 11. Ido not recall who was on that committee. I know I
was elected to the cornittec. It was to meet at the union hall at 10201
on one day, and We were
tY'o of cosrxnittee had al
vas going; to keep than
nenber, but not a nenbe
recall who that was. I
tith Eflshofi. I do not
do not recall that Falc
"By the next use
of the men. They all th
and their was a lot of
"$.11 of the men
¢ do not think that the
There was no violence a
I do not recall the det
until the meeting of th
meeting, because I knelfto all go out together. 1-hon I got to the hall,
out, oocatse they thou ht that the iii. ready gone *fr-on going at 10. l P55-' board
r of local #51 vent, and someone -. I do not
do not knot. what results they had in their conference
think they saw Elsheff, but did see Falcetti. I
etti told then.
t1ng.hmd talked tn an
ought that they tour- no go heir jobsback,
trouble keeping order at the meeting.
seemed all sot to go over and join the then.
re were more than about 30 of us who were not.
t that meeting, but there 1-as a lot oi confusion.
ails. I do not think o.nyth:i.ng else happened
e non at the K of C hall. I did not go to that
it "has to join the Ulfn, and I had said that I
would never Join tho HIT. I
"I had intended to go back to work at Iiine A 92hen it reopened,
ul Tmcn the local Went. UTE, I no d not
go ac , eeause new 1 could not work under those conditions.
_ I had heard about That had happened at liine B and how the company had
en _: favored 111'-I members, and knew-' that I would not be able to get a good room,
track, etc., if I rent to rork at Iiine A under the sane company, so I
did not go back. I thought 179' rigghts had been violated, and taking away
my; right to vork ct Iiinc I. under the conditions that I could work there. I
_ 1bi
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B?! JOHN L. LE-.IS, M AL-
92
1 <-].;g; 1:": *" "Before Elshoff bought Hinc Ix there was no dia-
sonsion as far as I know: about the union, and there
on inue was no activity to Join any other union. It was the
story that was passed around about the entry being
drlucn 1;-2: Iiine B into line A, and the operation from B, and the story that
11'. they joined the UIL 15.7-I 1, would be reopened, that caused the men to
chcngge,
"I have read the above statement on this page and two other pages.
It is all true and accurate. "
/$/ _
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ispecial I~s<=M F-B-I-"
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C ' O
Re; Joe! L. LE-'-'15, ET AL
]"T§E]§ UITH The following inxiitiaation was conducted Ex
Special Agents and_e.t 5prin5 ield, Illinois, on Septe e B,
1943:
I1. 92_:.. .__...: ._._._ 'no 11.2.5 :'|:::-ldvsuuc: SF2"il".§,fi%1d, 11112013,agents interviewed advised he has no criminal
record. It was noto e is rs or i literate and it is felt he would make
a poor witness unless his testimony is necessary.
Agents obtained from him the following statement which he signed
with an "x"=
Spring1'ieIoTI1'l.
Sept. 18, 1943.
. give tho following information__"L.-l- 92.. 1- V =-0 -.'.-no 1 c identified themselves to mo as
Special Agents of the FBI. Ho throats or force has
give this information. I was born in Linow 6: I came to U. S. in gleam o. citize
I have been at I»-Tine A since om still there as a iggor. I went to
P.!'..'.. in 1932 as whole local wont over then. I road in the papor that
Elshofi bot Mine 5. A: nobody felt good then and we all were scared 6: felt
we wou1d'_F'5ve no jobs. !o one came '; saw me about going over to U.l.i.?l'.
I heard that Elshoff might take coal from Iiinc A thru Kine B 2: that they
would connect the two mines !; if to wanted to work we would leave to join
U.?I. . It I think it -as just a scare then 5: I was scared too as I had not
worked for a long time. Hoard this from the minors. I also heard from
other miners that I-lshofi would only opon I-iine A as U.l1!. T. 8: I also heard
this at some not-ting I think and I felt I would be out of a job. I never
went to any of the meetings at Rodman's but did go to meeting at Elks Club.
There they said Iine A would be reopened if no went back to U.M."I I ho-rdabout the meeting from a couple of other miners on a Sunday. B
was in charge of the meeting. T-e all stood up A; voted as I di ooause a
the others did and I felt ii it was good enough for the others it was good
enough for me. I never belonged to any committees. We all signed up on
some blank at the Ells Club. I went directly home from there. Since
U.!l..'J. have been at Kine there is no difference - same as before under PJLA.
& I had no complaints against P.I~§.A, while they wore there. I have had
-471-
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R0: _JOHN L. Lswrs, ET AL
R D 1"" ' Agent-ead to me this two ! pagstatement & it is true h correct to the' c lection. I have signed cont1nued best of my re 01- this of my own free will.
"Jitncsscs_ .
'itnesses
lllIlIIlIIIIIIIIl{'Ii-I--51% @¢3Sac n~t. FBI
igPd!pcc1a! Agen!, !.!.I- J
St. Paul, Minn.
"Springfield, I11,Sept. 18, 1945"made in the
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Re= JOHN L. Isms, ET AL.
Ii *7 E3? WITH nas into viewed by S cial ilgc-nts _iiliii||. IIIIIilIIIIII|atiiillll and Illinois
on September 14, l9A3. Ho was very cooperative
and seemed to be above the average in intelligence, although his infor- I
mation was vary limited. He would be a good Witness insofar as his
statements made in the following signed statement are concerned.
7 _ "SE 14: 19¢;
Ill.
e the following volutary statement
Special Agents of the Federal Bureau
o threats or promises have been node to induce
me to make any statement.
in Illinois and prose -
am pre ently employed aworking inhand joined the 1.3: at
that time. I sta-ted working at Hine A in 1939 and was there until
the first of l9A3. I was working at Panther Creek in 1932 when
the state went progressive so I just signed up Pith progressive. I
didn't have anything to do with the start of progressive.
"Everything was going along fine at kdne A when Elshoff
bought the mire from Ryan. I got a letter from Ryan telling Le
he had sold the nine & at first I thought nothirg about it. I
believe this was in the early fall of 1941. I know that the pro~
gressive uion held some meetings after the sale was announced, but
I didn't attend any of the xsetings. I was living in Auburn at
that time and that's one of the reasons why I didn't go to any of
the meetings.
"All I know is that the majority of men in progressive had
signed up with United at a meeting at the Elks. It was some time
after this that I heard the men had all gone United & that if I
wanted to work I had to sign up. I had heard that Elshoff had mde
the remark that if the sine hadn't gone United, the nine wouldn't
have opened, but 1 do not have any other information about this. I
went dawn to the United Hall and signed up just before the nine
opened in the fall. I was not forced to sign up & nobody over
thruatcned me to sign.
"I do not know any of the details of any of the meetings held
by progressive in the fall of 1941 and joined United because I
wanted to be sure of a job.
~473-
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F._" Re: JOHN L. LEu-IS, ET AL; I
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_ - -"'1': .-'I'IH "I have read over this statement 01 2 pages& and I rrish w state it. is true to the best of
Continued I211 M31301?-
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U.S. Dxépt, of Justice
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Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL
II?TERVIEf.' mm I ntly
_ SP
at his residence,
Illinois, on September 18, 1943. He answer any
questions, advising that he had no information. However, he agreed to
furnish e statement nhich'is set forth below. g
"Springfield, Illinois
September 18, 1943
lake the following voluntary statement to
I know to be Special Agents of the
S. Department of Justice. tau of
"I was born i entered the UnitedStates in and obta1r.e my citizenship through my father
who was ltufliléd in the State of Pennsylvania, City and date
not known.
"I am presently employed at Mine A. I started w
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