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RAMEZ TAWFIKYNOAMAN, maleLJ
I Iwas
interviewed in the United States Courthouse for the Southern District.
of New York. Also present during this ihterview were Christopher
Morvillo and Robin Baker, Assistant United States Attorneys for the
Southern District of New York
[:::::::] NOAMAN was advised of the identities of the interviewing
agents and the purpose of the interview.
[:::::::::::::::]the offer of a translator and agreed toproceed with the interview in English. [::::::]was advised that it is' igc
a federal crime to lie or to make false statements to federal b7D
ff' ' l o icia s. I lhe understood his rights and he
thereafter provided the following information.
|:|
O9/28/2001 New York, New York
265ANY280350302 » 10/01/2001
SAI I/jm SP~|:|
MISC REQ. #41 000003650
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°. _,_~.f . ALL If-IIFIJRFIATION LjC|I92JTAII'-TED __g 3 HEREIN I5 T_T1 *Il:L.F92.S~$IFIED
' DATE. I:IEII:I2-2 IIIIIE BY __ Ibé' 5 13 3 |iI~9.;iU|:1m=m,-* I'~ ILL' I512 ' lb? C
. - wor ing Copy - Page
I 10/O6/2001
Reference Newark Lead Control Number[:::::::]
JIMI NOURI, I I
| I was interviewed at the FBI, Newark, Garret Mountain
Resident Agency, West Paterson, New Jersey. After being advised
of the identities of the interviewing agents and the nature of
the interview, NOURI provided the following information;
I I I
:I I I
I I I
I; I
Q S
Case ID : 3l5N-NY280350-302 Serial : 58885
AC5 REQ 10-21-03 0000001431b7C
ib7Dbf:
FD-302 Rev.l0-6-95! I t-s I I ~ "1
. . .136
' ' _1_. ' b7C
t FEDERAL BUREAllOFINVEST1GATTON_
_ . . __ ~ _ Date of transcription 1O/O8/2OQ]_
tl | also known as_ aka!| Idate of birth DOB!| Social Security Number| I
Portland, Maine, home phone number .
email address was interviewed at
the Portland, Maine Resident Agency of the FBI. After being advised of'
. the identity of the.interviewing agents and the purpose-of_the - "- interview,[::::] provided the following information; '
. _ ' . _t ~ Additional details regarding the trip |:|t"ddi< with|:|[:::::g:::¥ DOB: [::::::::]! to Los Angeles LA! sometime between
Decem er 999 and February 2000 are provided below. For'reference;see FD302s of interviews with[:::::]on.10/06/2001.and 10/07/2001!."
I '0ne day| lmentioned to that his visa
~ was going to expire.] Ineeded help and aske about the
paperwork | Ishowe some of the forms an papers| |was under the impression that he had to leave the country and
get his visa renewed. Then he would be able to return to the UnltédStates U.S.!. E:;::;gadvised[::::;:;;::]against leaving the country
and told him he s.ou_ take care o e matter through the embassyuin
the U;S. I Itold him to call the'embassy.y This conversation- '
occurred at] Iapartment in San Diego. ' _ .
tApproximately one or two weeks passed and he saw
at the Islamic Center of San Die o ICSD mosque roug
the visa subject up once again. said he called the Saudi
embass and they advised they could take care of the matter.E:::::j invited[:::::]to come alon on the tri nee ed to
take to the consulate in LA. .tol he knew a good
restaurant to stop at and eat in LA.| Iadvised that _
restaurant serves good food and is Halal. He asked if he ever
' saw the new mosque in or near Culver City" l h not been to the ' . . . - a _mosque.l |believes the mosque is on or near Washington Street.
said they would visit the mos ue afterwards. The trip had
_ no set criteria. It centered around going to the consulate.
wanted-to go the following day and extended the invitation.
agreed to gol There was no pressure or coercion; E:::::]noted
. a in Islam one does not reject invitations unless there is a good ~
reason. [::::::::::]asked if he should pick[::::]up.[::::::]saidghe'l
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nu: 365A-Ny-280350-302- _ .- _ ~.Mmdkm@.
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This document contains neither recommendations nor conclusions of the FBI. It is the property ofthe FBI and is loaned to your agency; ,
' -REQ 1°-11> ._ , ' W 000000048
92DWQ@g@ jk753_ . Q - -,
0
_
FD-302a Rev.10~6-95! . ~/T
106
V 4- _ - _Ib7C
265ANY280350302
Continuation ofFD-302 of On 10/O9/2001 ,Pa 2
would come over to[::::::::;:;:;Fpartment the next morning. [::::::::::].suggested to be there aroun : O a.m. [::::::::::]indicated he would
drive. - -0 '_ *'
" - The-following day[:::::]walked from his apartment on[::::::::]_
I |to| Iapartment This was on a weekda but definitely
not a Frida as that is ra er da H door - <"y, » 'py y-he ' V
came outside and they left in gold NissanAltima.| |needed to be at the consulate by a certain time.
During t e drive u to LA, they spoke mostly about religion. During
| | | | d h 0 the drive, hereinafter referred to as mentione teat
he needed to stop and obtain-some photographs of himself for the visa"
' process. They began to look for a place to obtain the photos. The
stopped at a Kinkos, but they did not do photographs. They then
stopped at a large mall off the I-405 freeway on Sepulvada phonetic!.
They walked in together and encountered a photo booth near the
. entrance. [::::]got his photo taken in his traditional headwear or
turban. This was apparently necessary for the visa.[::::]vms wearing
western clothing, including a sport jacket. After obtaining the ~
photos, they got back into the car and drove_straight to the consulate
in LA. _ ,- - » . "
. 4' _The consulate is
A underground parking. 'Theya large white clearly marked building with
parked underground and exited the car.[:::::]had his paperwork with him. They went into the reception area The IT waited.in the lobby. Soon a man came out and greeted[:::::][:::::::i
described the man as being in his.4Os, approximately 5'8" in height,
with a black/grey.beard down to his chest, who was wearing a suit. It"
appeared that[:::]and the man from the consulate knew each other. It
was obvious they had met before. The conversation was in Arabic _
however. did not understand what was_exactly said. [:::::::]
introduced to the man asna friend who just became a Muslim. The
man switched to English and spoke to[:::::]briefly. asked forinformation regarding Saudi Arabia. Shortly therea§%g%?iE2::]and the
man went behind closed doors. waited in the lobby for up_to
a roximately thirty minutes. and the man came out together.[:ff::]asked the man for a packet of information on Saudi Arabia. The
man told him to wait there and retrieved some items for The Kinformation included a packet of information and Islamic books._ During
the encounter[::::]was formal, briefn and official, as if he had a
V business pur ose. After being at the consulate for up to a maximum ofi one hour,[:iE::::::::::]left. "They returned to the car an
i again drove. They spoke about how nice the interaction was.
, indicated he was successful in getting the visa extension.
.estimated the time was now well past noon.T A » . ~ -1
w .
REQ lob A 000000049
Q .
FD-302:1 Rev. I0-6-95! ~_~-
265ANY280350302 '_ .b6
Ib7Ci
Continuation of FD-302 of I On 10/O9/2001 ,Page 3 w_ ~
' While driving they talked of their plan to go to the
restaurant because they were both hungry. They-drove several miles to
the restaurant through surface streets looking for it. 'The did not
have a map and were playing it by ear.[:::::]said the restaurant had
good food and said he had taken his family there before. That is'why
he wanted to take[:::::]there. E::::]found the restaurant awhile ago.
They made a few Uturns, got confused trying to find it, and missed. some turns. When questioned further about these driving methods,[:::::]
said[::::]was not doing those maneuvers intentionally. He found no
reason to believe they were being followed or attempting to evade p
anything. ', .- l - M
4 They finally found the restaurant and arked on the street. They walked inside the small establishment}[::::E:]observed it be,a
butcher shop, with deli or baker st le refrigerator cases inside.;Ef:::iinquired in Arabic to one of the There were no other customers
employees.; The three workers
E::::]tolci[::::] they informed
longer ab the establishment.
shop. The restaurant portion
The people inside recommended
was close by. They walked toinside talked Arabic to[::::]briefly.
him that they do not serve food any
They only sell meat and operate a butcher
of the establishment was closed down.
another restaurant that serves[:::::]that
this new restaurant; L
92s A [:::::ldescribed it as a Mediterranean cafe,.which could not
be any larger t an 500 square feet. 'After entering,[::::]mentioned "
that it was time to pray. AThey both ordered some food, which included
humus and grape leaves. There were some other customers, such as take
out customers. _There were no other dine in customers at this time.'Since it was time to pray, out of consideration[:::]a5ked if[::;;:]
~ wanted to go to the mosque to pray.[::::::]said he would pray rig t
here} went to the bathroom to.wash up before rayer. »He was out' of sight for less than five minutes. E;;:::iwaited a short~
time, too water from the table and went outsi e to wash up for prayer.
This was partially because he realized there was only one bathroom.
"Whether it was a public or employee bathroom is unclear to
-i washed near a tree outside. While he was outside washing came
outside. E::::j laid down a cloth to pray on.- They then praye ogether
. for_approximately five minutes. They then returned inside to eat.
p_ The only time[::::]was apart from[:::::]was the less than
~ five minutes he was washing in the bathroom. When asked why he did not. mention that in earlier interviews,[:::;:]responded that he did not, T
consider that time as[::::]being away, ecause it would have been
synonymous with prayer or preparing to pray. He did not bring it up
because he still considered himself to be together with[:::::] It was '
'REQ 10-11> " oooooooso
.
. - 3 1FD-302a Rev. 10-6-95! Q. -
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265ANY280350302'
Continuation 0fFD-302 of On 10/0'9/200_1 ,Page 4
purely a matter of semantics and misunderstanding. When asked if [::::]
could have been making phone or cell phone calls during this time away,[::::g1doubted it; -He did not notice a public phone in the _
esta ishment.E:::::]did have his cell phone with him but did not
remember him getting or making any calls at the restaurant. ididnot thinkE::::]would have had the time to be making calls while he was I
_ washing., ' A ._y ' ' . . y. -
y - There were two workers inside the cafe. 'They both spoke
-English..E::::]did not appear to know either of-them, There was an
older man cooking in the back._ The female waitress indicated that he_
was her father. _y 0 - _ _' , »-- A" -
" = While eating, they engaged in normal conversation. 'Two men
came into the establishmentf» The men were later determined to be A
NAWAF ALHAZMI DOB: O8/O9/1976 and KHALID ALMIHDHAR DOB; l0/15/1966!..
E::::] now realizes that the men were Nawaf AlHazmi and Khalid Al -
Mihdhar. AlHazmi and AlMihdhar sat down inside. They a eared to beArabic, even though they were dressed in western clothes.[¤::::]was ~
wearing western clothes, but may have also had a head covering. He is
_ not sure. How the first interaction occurred between the two men and
[::::] and[:::::::::] is unclear. The best possibility.is that the ..overheard the men speakin Arabic or the men overheardE::::] ommbmn -say something Islamic. E:f:::]is not positive who approached who first.
At~any rate it seemed like a coincidental meetin . There was nothingto indicateE::::]knew the two men or they knew did not];
know either man." Introductions started and was "the host" from
- itheibeginning-to the end of the meeting. translated and let
know what was occurring during the conversation between 1
and AlMihdhar. .This was because the conversations were in Ara ic an[:::::]did not understand it well. ' _ ' I y »
T -E::::]invited~Al#Hazmi and §lMihdhar to eat with them. [:::::]did not find this unusual as this was the type of person|q??9:fas.
is very generous. They sat at a table right next to andAlMihdhar and AlHazmi sat across from each other, as[:;;::] .
an were doinga E:::::]drew a rough diagram of the restauran and ,
where they were sitting. The diagram will be maintained in the lA
V section of the case file!.. 0 . » _ - , - I
. ,The conversation continued. From[::::::]perspective, it did
"not seem serious. The three_of them were smiling, laughing and getting
to know each other._ recalls AlHazmi and AlMihdhar having "chi"l or tea. lThey also sgareg some oq::::::]and E:::::] food after being
REQ 10-11> ' 000000051 i
92 .. ».}
FD 302:1 Rev. 10-6-95! -__.'v . _,~'
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265ANY-280350-302
Contmuauon ofFD~302 of - I , On 1 O / O 9 U O-l ,Page ' 5
.offered.'[:::::]estimated the meeting lasted for awhile, but not anylonger than one hour. ' ».; _ ' .dg ' g Q" i
. > , During_the-conversations[::::::]learned that AlHazmi and Alf
Mihdhar just came from Saudi Arabia and were students. They wanted to
study English. They were currently living in LA,-somewhere in the area
of the restaurant and did not like LA. AlHazmi was doing most of the
talking with »AlMihdhar was less talkative. At the end of the .
meal/meeting, ave his phone number to Al-Hazmi.. is not
sure, but believes also got their phone'number.. -told Al-
Hazmi and Al+Mihdhar that they lived in.San Diego and invited them to _
San Diego to check it out. E:::] told them if they liked San Diego, hewould be able to and was happy to help them. [::::%and[g::::]left the
restaurant first. AlHazmi and AlMihdhar stayed ehin ,
' 4 [::::]and[:::::]left in[;:::::]car.s They went to the Culver »
City mosque for sunset prayer. T ey spent approximately fifteen to _
twenty minutes there. The mosque was a few blocks from the restaurant.
It could possibly be located on Washington Street. .After prayer,[::::]
drove them back to San Diego. E::::]recalls[::::]calling his wife on
his cell phone advising her he was on his way home. They made no - 1yadditional stops. When they reached San Diego,:E::::}ropped[:::::]offon Beadnell Way and departed. * _ » ~
. [:::::gkas asked why he previously reported the first time hey
met Aleazmi an AlMihdhar was at.the party they had at their Mt. AdaRoad apartment after moving to San Diego. [;:::;1reminded the agents
that he has ADD Attention Deficit Disorder . though he does have a
good memory, he remembers.some things better than others. The direct
questioning by SA[::::::::]yesterday regarding the meeting and
surrounding circumstances jarred his memory. When he was at AlHazmis
and Al-Mihdhar's apartment on the day of the party, he spent four or.
five hours there. He specifically remembered this event right away
because of the significant amount of time he spent with them that day;
At the time of-the earlier interviews l0/O4/2001 and 10/O6/2001!, he
believed that the party was the first time he met the individuals until
later realizing he did have an earlier chance meeting with them. Justas[::::]explained to SA.[::::::;]yesterday, he was confusing twoevents at the same restaurant an was unsure who he met during one of _'
the occasions.[:::::]was hesitant to provide misleading or inaccuratelinformation to the agents, or say something he was unsure of. [g:::::;]
also noted the difficulty in remembering something that occurre near y
two years ago. ' _-- D _ . _,
REQ101b __ . .-000000052
FDJOA Razw69Q ].;"lf, » fr} Pic -
265ANY280350302 '
Continuali0nofFD-3020! 10/O9/V2001 ,Pnge ' 6
T The first time[:;:::] was at the Mediterranean restaurant/cafe
was the occasion he was-with[::::] as described above. pThe second
occasion was months later during 2000, when he was in the LA area for a
_ different issue. 'He was living in Santa Barbara at the time. iHe.
~prayed at the nearby Culver City Mosque that day. He knew of the d
restaurant from his earlier visit and decided to stop and eat there.v
A _[:::::]was alone in LA at this time. He seems to recall meeting someone
he knew from his past travels while in the restaurant on this occasion}
He cannot recall who exactly he met however. -This is one of the 4
reasons he was confused earlier on the issue. . ' .
' When asked if he could have been used by[::::]in some way -.concerning this meeting,[:;:::Lsaid he did not think so. However, due
to what happened on Septem er l, 2001, he now believes that there isia
remote possibility. ~Regarding whether he was used in an manner, such_
as for an alibi or cover, in any of[::::::]activities, said if he
. was used for this purpose he never realized.it and ' i a good job.
E::::]noted that he heard from his exwife,[:::::] t at[:::]was makingfun of[::::] behind his back. He never knew whether to believe it.; _5; |would not be talking with the FBI if he didn't think
that could be involved in the terrorist activity somehow.~ , r
However, prefaced this statement by saying that he would be very
surprised to find out E::] was involved in terrorist activity. When
asked what in particular may lead him to thin could be involved
in terrorist activity,[:::::]said if " y on the
plane that crashed, and his identit was not stolen, associationwith£:::;:;::lbecomes interestin .[%:;:::]noted that and[::::::::]spen ay o o time together.[::f:::]claimed to have no current contactwith[:::;]and no knowledge of his current whereabouts.. The last time ,
they spo e was in 2000.0 T _ , . A H i
92
After E::::]arm1[:::]returned from the LA trip he_heard
mention AlHazmi and Al-Mihdharin passing on approximately two ,
did not consider them significant. On one occasion,I |:|
occasions. The conversations are difficult to rememTer becausel |
if he remembered the men they met in LA. [::::]indi¢ated.something to
the effect that the will possibly move to San Diego and came down to_Vvisit. Another timef::::]mentioned that they were coming.down, possibly
- meaning they were moving to San Diego._ A f" ' . _ _
'- There was a housewarming/welcomei art. for[:::::::::::::::][:::::::]after they moved into their[:::::::§:::f]apartment. _This is
REQ 101b 000000053
Q .
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F0--302; Rev. 10-0-95! » ._;;_ _
., 265ANY280350302'' - _b6
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Comi,nuarlonofFD-3020f 10/O9/2001' ,Page -1-
the party that threw for them, as explained in previous- g <
statements. recalled this as his "first significant interaction"
with AlHazmi an AlMihdhar, until his memory was refreshed yesterday.
This event was the strongest thing in his mind at the time. This ' _
partially-caused [::::]to report this as the first time he met AlHazmi
and Al+Mihdhar. During the_party, there was a large piece of plastic
in the middle of the floor. "Everyone sat on the floor around the
' edges. The attendees ate from containers.placed in the middle.of the
plastic.[:::::] Al¢Hazmi, and Al-Mihdhar were doin the preparation,"' ' r - ' ' t th i t fE::f:] filmed some ofA cooking, aDd.S¬IVlng. a e reques othe party. 'At one'poE;¬;EEEE%]got in front of the camera and said a
few words. This included why they were gathering and the date. -Ale.
Hazmi and AlMihdhar were captured on the tape as well. Some attendees
were sensitive about not being filmed.- ' .' L ' .-.
* At one point in time,[:::] told[::g::¥that he was the i ' "
"guarantor" for.the apartment of AlHazmi an A Mihdhar. [:::::]wanted
to correct something SA E:::::::]may have misunderstood from an earlier
statement. -Regarding how many occasions he was at Aleazmi and Ali, *
"Mihdhars's apartment,[:::::]said it was between ten and twenty times.
Many times he went to the apartment not to visit them, but to catch up
with E:::]' spent a lot of time at Al~Hazmi and AlMihdharss
apartment. did not know AlHazmi and'Al~Mihdhar very well or for
"moved int ' T _ ., [::::::]very long. left San Diego a relatively short time after they A
o the apartment Most of interaction with AlHazmi
. was when[:::] was also present. This included the occasions wher1[::::::]
was at AlHazmi and AlMihdhars's apartment. .
' kn San
Diego during the time period of December 1999 to February-ZUOO. He was
homeless, but two Muslim brothers from ICSD let him sleep at their
apartment. He did not s end much time with them or at the apartment.Y One roommate's name was[¬:::::]LNU Last Name Unknown!; He was in his-
* mid2Os and is a computer programmer. E::::]believes he still lives in
that general area of San Diego. He is Yemeni, but may be of Somalian
descent. He also has famil ties in the Netherlands. The other .T roommate was[:;;::]LNU,-whoi::;:] did not know very well. [:::::] is 9
approximately "to 25 years o a e and is an engineer. He returned to"_.Saudi Arabia in early 2000. E::::§]lost[:::::::gcontact information. ,[:::::::] roommates were both regulars at ICSD an .spoke English. Theyhalso both knew[::::]very well and for much longer than dld._ They
would probably be able to provide information regarding '
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V? interviewed in the offices sf the United States Attorgeyj'1-4'_';':.'~ -..92 .;.92..
wake AUSA Rabin L. Bakér,.and AL~8ALMIs attQrnay§[::::::]
lawi[::::::::::::1 AL~$RLMI was . 1 {{{{{{{{ {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{11$ f ~" duthern District Qf New Ysrk. A130 present far the interview
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" ' I prmviqed the fsllowing informatisng _ agreement. AL
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On 1051132601, R Aanoum;
V $an Diego, Ca ifornia 91941; date cf birth
was interviewed at the Otay Mesa detention facility,
San Diegc, Callfnrnia, Qperated by QQxrecti@ns'Q@rwaxation oi L-America. AEDOUE was pravicusly interviewed by SA1::::]and SA
E::::::]cn Gctober 10¢ 2001. That interview was dacumented in a
separate FD43U2- ABBQUN was willing to talk with-the interviewing
agents withuut an attnrney and voluntarily prmvided tbg follcwing
inormation; - . » -
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n Saturday, September 15» 2801, at approximately 8:33AM} by;
ABDDUN was in his apartment watching t&l@visi0n coverage Qf'the ;
hijackings and subseqaent invastigation. AL~SALM§ joined him and-
sai, "I knaw they were going tn dm something, that is why I got
~married." AL~SALMI tml ABDOUN he was joking, than he left the
ream. _. V 92 '
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___._ ___________________ __ _ __________________ ,,,,,,,,, ,,
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TINA BETH ARNOLD, date of-birghz I I SSAN: [:::]92 ' hmme address: I ___________ ___________ __ Scotittsciale,
Arizona, home telephone number: emplcye at SAWYER
SVCHOBL OF AVIATI !N', 2738' Sky Harbor Blvd. , Ph_Uenix, Arizcma,
92 teleghone number: {S02} 273~l2U2 was advise cf the identity sf thev
interviewing Agents and the Assistant Unita States Actoru&y
AUSA!. ARNQLD vmluntarily provided the ollowing information.
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Case ID ; 2¬5A~§Y~280350~3G2 _> ~ - Serial: 62256 .I
._ ~ V =3§§ £921?¬;'I.=' 92
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I we addrsgs 1
sfI:_:_i;:_:;:_:_:_:_:3:_£_:_:_:_:_;:_:_:_:_£_:;:jwas interviewed
at the Phoenix, Arizona office of the Federal Bureau sf
Investigation The interview began an appraximately 6:30 p.m an
Gctober 35, EOGL. $ei§_advised he was hre to try tn clarify any
questions and assist in any way'he could with the terrorism
.investigaticn. After'b&ing'adviSed GE the idahtitias of th&
interview Agents, and.the purpose and naure of the interview, Seii
provided the following information: ' ' _.92 » v_ - .
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This "rv 1 s *'¢:~; vr :eu:>mn-.enda§io}:s rm s:anc §usi=;ms of £h-':- FBI ii is rim PiI3F¬r921i Q1 ihe FBI §m:£ is lnanadia you i" EC ,it ngfgjhe iiitributsrd aulséda your agzrrcy. - ~ _ ' _ . ' A 1;
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~ FE-D'.EVRAL~ BLIREAU OF 1L §VES'IlG¢°CiIQ§'i
sgsrzeol ___
- Qn October 36; * 2001 George Harb, birth|:|
|:!was :1'.n§:e:crv~:Le2wed in connection with _ Herb was
apprised of the id-entity 0f the interviewing agent and the gpurgzovse .
GE the intze1:view._ Harb g;-rovideci the following i_nEo;:ma_iion: , - 'Data vi t.ra:=$w.:ip{im92
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This du<:1.~m*:§~r]'I:@@nsRi§§ r§,j¢§_nman0¥ati<ms nor c:mu[ua92iq1z5'0i'l.1:v FBI. it '92s'£h:: preperty uf ih: FBI and is limned ta year a_g<<n¢§K. Q 0 _it and its crstcxrns we nut ta =7: liistrihuiad -Jzziside ynur 1g¢m:'y, A 1 V .30 V .
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Gesrme Hark Harb!, horn onIn ¬Qnn&ction with cwntrol number $D5§5, Qn D§fl5/2961,
Jte1e*h@ne number
ce A.ar talaphsna numner
_ &ele§hQne pager
number Harb is ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
1 After being advised éf thé idantities of the
investigating agants and.che purpose cf
pravided aha following infcrmation;the interview, Hark
Case.....-.~-..~.-..._-.¢.--,.-92-_.~___.__.,.___kl f:_.
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ID : 3l5N~NY*28S35G~3$2 .
3l5N~NY~2835G~SD
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' Serial : 2956 é *
' 598
&&1~§~ ?iE'§§'£'3 3'. $535 C £3 i¬l'.> ' .
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