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Court Proceeding — Tyler Robinson Officially Charged, Could Face Death in Charlie Kirk Murder
Court proceeding — State of Utah v. Tyler James Robinson (Case 251403576, 4th Judicial Dist. Ct., Utah County). Transcript is the YouTube auto-caption track of the Court TV feed (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9Dl6TPlMJI) — verbatim ASR, not a certified court transcript.
Welcome back to court TV live. We are in Utah, this hour where the county Attorney's Office there's expected to be announcing formally the charges against the suspect Tyler Robinson, the man accused of killing activist Charlie Kirk Robinson is going to appear in court at 05:00PM eastern today for that arraignment where he's expected to enter a plea of guilty or not guilty on the charges against him we are waiting for that press conference to start we just had someone to take the podium and say that they need about 10 more minutes before they were actually begins with the county attorney Jeff gray that's a live. Look so has not started yet. We're going to take a look back though it scrippsnews group from Salt Lake City's look at what we know about suspect Tyler Robinson. >> Robinson had confessed to them or implied that she had committed incident from his apartment. >> The FBI police combed every inch of it Tyler Robinson's life his family expressing to law enforcement that he had become more political. >> In the last few years Robinson mentioned Charlie Kirk was coming to you you talked about why they didn't like him and a few points that he had the family member also stated Kirk was full of hate and spreading hate. >> Neighbors across the community were hurt, confused what they called the quiet man. >> Turn to suspected political ascension I just learned of half hour ago. My son called me and said did you know it was your neighbor, I said no. >> Its neighbors said Robinson used to come over and help promote her lawn when he was a kid. >> Whenever I've needed anything they've been able to come over and help they kind of thing. >> So who is 22 year-old Tyler Robinson, we know he was raised in Washington, Utah. Yearbook photos show him a nearby mind you I school. Robinson attacked. >> All right a press conference has started let's go in his County attorney there in Utah, Jeff gray. >> OK ladies and world to begin my name is Richard pie and the communications manager for Utah County, I'm working with the Utah County attorney Jeff great. As he this is the county deals with the publicity surrounding this case. We appreciate your being here. Jeff will a new rape charges and detail with that counties findings are up to this point and then he will take questions the number of questions may be limited however I mean I'm a cut off of me assist him in and helping to pick to the people we're asking the question we just ask that you keep the questions to the process of what we're talking about and refrain from asking questions that speculate or get into the political dynamic of the case for Utah County. This is a murder case we're trying a murder case we're trying to keep the questions to that but I understand that you're under pressure and have a lot of different questions and we'll try to answer them. We're joined today by our sheriff and the prosecution team and our County commissioners that Jeff is going to be the only one speaking right now, and all that reduce right now County >> The murder of Charlie Kirk is an American tragedy. Was murdered while engaging in one of our most sacred and cherished American right. Of our Democratic Republic. The free exchange of ideas in a search for truth understanding and a more perfect union. It is also an offense against the state. And to the peace and enjoyment of the people of Butte and of all those who visit here. But Charlie Kirk's murder also strikes a more personal and intimate cord. Charlie Kirk was first and foremost a husband and a father to 2 beautiful young children. He was a son he was a brother. And a friend like murders the senseless and needless taking of Charlie Kirk's life. Has shattered the lives of those he loved and those who loved him. To CHARLIES wife Erica. His 2 young children his parents his family. And his friends. I express my sincere condolences and offer my heartfelt prayers on your behalf. I also want to express my concern for everyone who was at CHARLIES turning point USA event at the university or University it, Utah Valley University and all who have As County attorney I am charged with bringing in just so this to those who offend our laws. I am charged. With bringing justice for those who harm for those who were harmed. I am charged with bringing justice for Charlie Kirk. I'm committed to and I take this responsibility seriously. Today after reviewing the evidence that law enforcement has collected thus far. I'm filing a criminal information. Charging Tyler James Robinson age, 22 Aggravated murder, a capital offense for intentionally or knowingly causing the death of Charlie Kirk under circumstances that created a Count 2 felony discharge of a firearm causing serious bodily injury. A first-degree felony. The state is further alleging aggravating factors on counts one and 2. Because the defendant is believed believed to have targeted Charlie Kirk based on Charlie Kirk's political expression. And did so knowing the children were president and The state is also charging the defendant with count 3. Obstruction of justice a second-degree felony. For moving and concealing the rifle used in the shooting. Count for obstruction of justice a third-degree a second degree felony for disposing the clothing he wore during the shooting. Count 5 witness tampering a third-degree felony for directing his roommate to delete has incriminating text. Count 6 witness tampering a third-degree felony for directing his roommate to stay silent. If police questioned him. And count 7 Commission of a violent offense in the presence of a child, a Class A misdemeanor. For committing homicide knowing the children were present and may have seen or heard the murder and did so based on Charlie Kirk's political Also following the press conference I am filing a notice of intent to seek the death penalty. I do not take this decision lightly. And it is a decision I have made independently. As County attorney based solely on the available evidence and circumstances and nature of the crime. Because we are seeking the death penalty the defendant will continue to be held without bail in the Utah County Jail. Turning to the 10 page. Information. And September 10th 2025 at approximately 12:23PM. Charlie Kirk was shot and killed while speaking to a large crowd on the campus of Utah Valley University in Orem Utah. Police found the suspected murder weapon a bold action 30 odd 6 rifle. Nearby. Over the next approximately 33 hours. Police conducted the man had a manhunt for the shooter until the evening of September 11th 2025 when Tyler James Robinson surrendered to police at the Washington County Sheriff's office. DNA consistent with Robinson was found on the rifles trigger. After shooting Mister Kirk Robertson hid the gun discarded that clothing he wore when he fired the rifle. And told his roommate to delete incriminating text messages and not talk to police children were present at the time of the shooting. Turning point USA a nonprofit Charlie Kirk organized a public outdoor event to be held at noon and September 10th 2025 at UB U the event was the first in a series of similar events to be held at college campuses nationwide. Mister Kirk is a well-known conservative activists famous for these type of events where he discusses various political issues and debates with audience members has he been some comments have garnered a cynic a significant number of supporters and drawn the ire of many who disagree with his political views. The event at UB U was announced far in advance and garnered significant publicity and interest. Consequently several 100 people and did Mister Kirk was interacting with the crowd before the event officially got underway. That at approximately noon Mister Kirk seated himself under a portable canopy behind a table and microphone. He began speaking to the crowd and fielding questions from attendees format Mister current commonly used at his events. Mister Kirk allowed his questioners to approach the Mike microphone position directly in front of him. Mister Kurtz team members were very close to him on his right and left. As well as some behind his canopy and others at various close locations near him. The large crowd surrender Mister surrounded Mister Kirk on 3 sides. Temporary metal fencing separated attendees for Mister current by only a matter of feet. Directly above and behind Mister Kirk was the UV you Hall of flags and indoor walkway spanning several several 100 feet with floor to ceiling glass windows which overlooks the Plaza where Mister Kirk was seated. People were in the walkway at the time of the shooting. Approximately 15 minutes into the event. Mister Kurtz was answering a question about mass shootings by transgender individuals when a gunshot rang out. The bullet struck Mister Kirk in the neck. almost immediately. The bullet struck director trajectory past closely to several other individuals beside Mister occurred. Including the questioner who was standing directly in front of Mister Kirk children revisit bull near Mister Kurt, the stage when he was shot. Mister Kirk was rushed to a nearby hospital where he was declared deceased. The medical examiner's report is still pending. So you've EU surveillance. So at the moment of the shot up you police officer was watching the crowd from an elevated vantage point as soon as he heard the shot he began to scan the area for threats. The leading the shot came from a rifle because of that sound he look for potential sniper positions. He noted a roof area approximately a 160 yards away from Mister card Kirk has a potential shooting position and rushed there to look for evidence. The suspected shooting position accessible walkway to access the suspected location a person must climb over a railing and then drop to the roof only slightly below. The UV offcer climbed over the railing and down onto the roof. He then walked to the suspected shooting position and confirmed a clear shooting corridor between the He also noticed markings in the gravel roof top consistent with a snipe or having lane on the on the roof, the impressions in the gravel potentially left by the elbows. Knees and feet of a person in a prone shooting position. Police reviewed surveillance from the camera covering the roof and discovered that it recorded an individual dressed in dark clothing cross the railing from the public walkway and dropped onto the roof at approximately 12:15PM. Although the individual moved out of the camera's view for a short time, the camera again captured the individual running across the roof and then lo crawling to the area the UV you officer wreck nice is where the suspected sniper had dropped into a prop prone shooting position. After a short time which matches the individual rose and ran across the roof to the Northeast. This discovery led to an intensive review of UB U surveillance, it's recordings to attempt to track and identify the suspect. Surveillance revealed the following that approximately 11:51AM the suspect entered campus from the north. He is seen wearing a black shirt with an American flag in the center. A dark baseball cap and large sunglasses. Throughout the surveillance the suspect keeps his head down and rarely raises had enough to get a clearer image of his face. As he proceeds across the campus. He is seen walking with an unusual gait. The suspect walks with very little standing in his right leg. Consistent with a rifle being hidden in his pants. Unusual J continues until the suspect is seen crossing the railway off the open walkway and onto the roof where he leaves that the camera's view. The camera later chap shares the suspect as he runs across the roof to the suspected shooting position. Immediately after the shot was fired. A camera captures the suspect running across the roof sharing an item who shape is consistent with a rifle. The suspect is then seen climbing down from the roof. He appears to drop the item he was carrying as he hits the ground in it controlled fall. He then picks up the item and runs toward the Northeast and of campus. Expended crime scene investigation. Law enforcement officers followed the suspects us Kate path to the Northeast and of campus. Where they believe the suspect left campus and entered a wooded area. In that wooded area investigators found a bolt action rifle wrapped in a towel. The rifle contained one spent round. And 3 unspent rounds. This is consistent with the facts officers observed at the and immediately after the shooting he's no shell casings were found on the route suggesting able action rather then do loading weapon and only a single round was fired. Each round in the road rifle contained and edged inscription as follows. The fired car cartridge. Was asked no Tice is bolch W o what's this. The second cartridge. That what that was again not spent the last 3 were not spent were not fired. The second a fascist catch with arrows and symbols. 3rd cartridge. >> Bella Ciao Bella Ciao Bella Ciao Ciao Ciao. >> If you read this you are ammunition rounds and tell were sent for forensic processing. DNA consistent with Robin with defendant was found on the trigger other parts of the rifle. The fired cartridge casing 2 of the 3 unfired cartridges and the towel. >> County attorney Jeff gray taking a step by step through this investigative process over the capture of the suspect in the assassination of Charlie Kirk were hit the pause button on this press conference you're >> Welcome back to court TV live we have a press conference going on right now in Utah where the county attorney is formally announcing the charges against Tyler Robinson. 22 year-old accused the killing of conservative activist Charlie Kirk this happened at the Utah Valley University last week, let's pick it up right where we left off with this news conference where Jeff gray has been outlining exactly what these investigators found in their search for the suspect. >> Law enforcement was unable to immediately locate the shooter so they publish photos of the shooter. The UV you surveillance cameras and asked for the public's help to a death identify him. Meanwhile law enforcement continue to try to identify the shooter through other means. The Washington County investigation and on the evening of September 11th 2025 as law enforcement continued their investigation. Tyler James Robinson went to the Washington County Sheriff's office with his parents and a family friend to turn himself in. Robinson's mother stated that fought the the following to place. And September 11th 2025 the day after the shooting. Robinson's mother saw the photo of the shooter in the news and thought the shooter looked like her side. And asked him where he was he said he was homesick. And that he had also been at home home SEC on September 10th. Robinson's mother expressed concern to her husband that the suspect shooter looked like Robinson Robinson's father agreed. Robinson's mother explained that over the last year so Robinson had become more political. And had started to lean more to the left becoming more pro gay and Trans rights oriented she stated that Robinson began today his roommate the book biological male who was transit transitioning genders. This resulted in several discussions with family members but especially between Robinson and his fun, another who have very different political views. In one conversation before the shooting Robinson mentioned the Charlie Kirk would be holding an event at UB U which Robert Robinson said was a stupid venue for the event. Robinson accused her of spreading hate. Robinson's father reported that when his wife showed him the surveillance image of the suspected shooter in the news. He agreed that it looked like their side. He also believe that the rifle that police suspected the shoe shooter used matched a rifle that was given to his son as a gift. As a result Robinson's father cat contacted us and asked him to send a photo of the rifle. Robinson did not respond. However, Robinson's father spoke on the phone with Robinson Robinson and plus a implied that he planned to take his own life. Robinson's parents were able to convince him to meet at their home. As they discuss the situation Robinson imply that he was the shooter and stated that he couldn't go to jail and just wanted to end it. When asked why she did that Robinson explained there's too much evil and the guy referring to Charlie Kirk spreads too they talked about Robinson turning himself and convinced Robinson Robinson to speak with a family friend who is a retired deputy sheriff. That Robinson father at Robinson's father's request, the family friend Matt Robinson and his parents and convinced Robinson to turn himself in. The family friend spoke to police and reported telling Robinson that it would be best if he brought all evidence with him to the sheriff's office to avoid please have turned to search his parents home. Also asked Robinson if you had any clothes that were related to what he did. Robinson replied that he had disposed of the clothes in Interviewed Robinson's roommate a biological now who is was involved in a romantic relationship with Robinson. The roommate told police that the roommate received messages from Robinson about the shooting improved and he did provide those messages to police. And 9/10/2025 the roommate received a text message from Robinson which said drop what you're doing look under my keyboard the roommate looked under the keyboard in founding know that stated quote I had the opportunity to take out Charlie Kirk and I'm going to take it. Police found a photograph of this note. The following exchange text exchange then took place. After reading the note there remain responded white. You're joking right Robinson I am still OK. My love been stuck the norm for a little while longer yet it shouldn't be long until I can come home, but I got to grab my rifle. Still to be honest I hope to keep this secret to lay died of old age, I'm sorry to involve you. You weren't the one who did it right. Roommate I thought they caught the person Robinson know they grab some crazy old dude then interrogated someone in similar clothing. I plan to grab my rifle from a drought point shortly after her but most of It's quiet almost enough to get out, but there's one vehicle lingering. Roommate why. Robinson why did I do it roommate yeah. Robinson I had enough of his hatred some hate can't be negotiated out if I am able to grab my rifle and see I will Going to attempt to retrieve it again hopefully they have moved on. I haven't seen anything about them finding that roommate how long have you been planning this. Robinson they've been over a week I believe I can get close to it. But there is a squad car parked right by it. I think they are ready swept that spot but I don't want to chance it. Robinson again, I'm wishing I had circled back and grabbed it as soon as I got to my vehicle. I'm worried about my old man would do if I didn't bring back grandpas rifle. Idk if it's had a serial to me. I worry about Prince I had to leave it in a Bush right changed outfits didn't have the ability or time to bring it well I might have to abandon it and hope they don't find Prince. We're learning so many new details from this press. >> You hear County attorney Jeff gray there in Utah saying that this was something the suspect planned for over a week that he left a note for his roommate detailing that he had done it and that his parents recognized him almost immediately in those wanted posters, let's get to a break when we come back you're not going to miss a moment. >> We'll pick right up at this Back to Utah now where we are watching together a press conference and formal charges being announced against 22 year-old Tyler Robbins a suspect in the killing of conservative activist Charlie Kirk that happened last week at Utah Valley University. We're hearing a lot in this press conference this is more then we've had detailed to us in the past so again this is County Jeff gray was going through everything that's in what they called the information what they have as their probable cause against this suspect for these charges and they've also announced that they have filed a notice of intent to seek the death penalty. Let's pick it up right where we left off. ♪ >> How the F explain losing it to my old man. Only thing I left was the raffle was the rifle wrapped in a towel. Remember how it was engraving bullets. The af and messages are mostly a big I mean if I see notice bald UW you on FOX News. I might have a stroke all right I'm going to have to leave it at that really. Today I'd say ground has gun does just fine I D okay, I think that was a tooth that I to K dollars Robinson again delete this exchange. Again Robinson my dad once photos of the rifle, he said the ground but wants to know who has what the feds released the photo of the rifle and it is very unique. He's calling me are and not answering Robinson. Since Trump got into office. My dad has been pretty diehard maga. I'm going to turn myself and willingly one of my neighbors here is a deputy for the sheriff. Again you are all I worry about love that came from Robinson about you. Robinson don't talk to the media please don't take any interviews or make any comments if any police ask you questions ask The search for Robinson's residents police executed the search warrant on Robinson's residents. During that search police discovered the shell casing with that rings like the etchings found on the shelves in the rifle near UB U police also found several target boards with bullet holes in Robinson's Now as I stated in the beginning when I read those allegation tons these are allegations. And like the evidence set forth in this statement, those allegations what you've heard from the media. Even from state and federal officials has not been tested in the crucible of a jury trial. I understand the public's desire to know the facts. My own family members have have pressed me for information. Why are we reluctant to share the details of the investigation itself. And comment on the case. Because I want to ensure a fair and impartial trial. I became a prosecutor because of my love for the ideals of this great country. And the principles embedded in our Constitution the free exchange of ideas and opinions is critical to this great American experiment. But so too are the protections afforded to the accused found in the 5th and 6th amendments. The right against self-incrimination. The right to a speedy and public trial the right to the effective assistance of counsel, the right to confront one's accusers and the right to compel the attendance of witnesses. And perhaps most importantly under our Constitution the accused is presumed innocent Intel we did the state prove to an end partial jury of defendants peers, his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. That jury cannot rely on our allegations. They hear in the news or on what they hear from a public official. The jury is the sole trier of fact. And they will ultimately determine those facts based on evidence in the trial judge has these has determined is admissible. Again as prosecutors we bear the burden to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. But make no mistake we welcome this bird. I'd like to now introduce my trial to my trial team who will be charged with prosecuting the case. This is a veteran an expert team of some of the state's best trial attorneys. Chad green and or who is my one of my to chief deputies. Ryan McBride and David Sturgill on the far right there. And and those 2 we're very much involved in prepare and search warrants did a phenomenal job. Work day and night to to see that accomplished well after he was. Robinson was a taken into custody. Also Laura and Hunt. She is one of our special victims prosecutors. And Chris Ballard. My second chief deputy who will I mean explain just the procedural steps. We're a grand jury. We don't have a grand jury system like the federal courts do it's it's a pulmonary sharing system. So the arrest and filing of a criminal information and are merely the first steps in the criminal justice process. Today at 03:00PM the defendant will appear before a judge in the Utah 4th District Court for his first appearance to be informed of these charges and to ensure that he has an attorney to represent him. The hearing will be brief. The judge will conduct that first appearance virtually via webex. This is not unusual in the 4th district. All felony first appearances for defendants who are in custody are held virtually failing to that hearing is available for media and the Utah state courts extra town at Utah state courts. Now following defensive. >> Great giving just an outline of what's going to happen ahead in the case against Tyler Rob and son he detailed that information that's been filed 10 pages and formally announcing those charges that include aggravated murder witness tampering and obstruction of justice more of the press conference and the >> Today after reviewing the evidence that law enforcement has collected thus far. I'm filing a criminal information. Charging Tyler James Robinson age, 22. Aggravated murder, a capital offense for intentionally or knowingly causing the death of Charlie Kirk under circumstances that created a Count 2 felony discharge of a firearm causing serious bodily The state is further alleging aggravating factors on counts 1, 2, because the defendant is believed believed to have targeted Charlie Kirk work based on Charlie Kirk's political expression. And did so knowing the children were president and would witness the homicide. >> Welcome back to court TV Judge Ashley will kind of course honor to be with you today, those were the charges announced just moments ago against suspect Tyler Robinson during a press conference being held in Utah the 22 year-old will make his first court appearance later this afternoon to be arraigned on those charges. In the fatal shooting of conservative activist Charlie Kirk until then let's get back to that press conference under way we did hit the pause button say won't miss any of it and this is the press conference by the Utah County Attorney's Office. >> Now following defendants first to parents. He will be entitled to a preliminary hearing. At that hearing the state will be required to show probable cause the defendant committed the crimes, the purpose of that preliminary hearing. It's not to determine guilt. But simply to assure that court that the prosecution has enough evidence to proceed to trial. If a judge finds probable cause in Biden's the case over for trial an arraignment hearing will be held at that hearing a judge will agenda inform defendant of the charges against him and require him to enter a plea to a charge. The next step the next step following the arraignment is an opportunity for the parties to file any relevant motions and then ultimately the trial itself. This case has generated a tremendous amount of interest across our nation and even the world. The public's desire for information is desire is understand well, but it bears reiterating that this case will be tried in a court of law consistent with our Constitution not the court of public opinion. We will only discuss with the Discuss the case with the press occasionally. will not be a day to day or even week to week. Occurrence and with that we will only do so in a manner as not to jeopardize the fair trial process. Before I conclude I want to express my PRI appreciation for that tireless work of our local state and federal law enforcement officers. They have an extremely difficult dangerous and often often thankless job. I'm proud to acknowledge the exceptional work they do every day and particularly their work on this case. It was truly a marvel to witness their skilled work and dedication have brought us to this point. I'm also grateful for the leadership demonstrated by Bo Mason. The commissioner of the Utah Department of Public safety. FBI special agent in charge Robert walls. Utah County sheriff Mike Smith. Our local police chiefs and Phillies Jon Vitti the acting U.S. attorney for the District of Utah. I'm also grateful for the support of our governor Spencer Cox in our attorney general Derrick Brown standing behind me today and has offered his support and resources as we proceed to try. I'll finally I want to thank our Utah County commissioners Amelia powers Gardner, Brandon Gordon and Skyler Bell track. They too have pledged to assist with the resources needed to successfully prosecute this case. I donate now take a few questions. >> Says ladies and gentlemen, just just really fast if you could identify CVS are you >> They are still looking into it and undergoing investigation. They haven't ruled that out I I don't I talked to officials from both administrations, but I was not pressured to make a decision I understood their feelings on it because it wasn't in the news. But we didn't really discuss that. >> It's a The the FBI director >> I'm going to stick to what I just stayed in my In May in our information I think that Again we don't have any information at this point of suspects but I know our our law enforcement agencies are continuing to follow leads us to Grady I director today said that your poll card other people a number There are people who might be a I'm not I'm the suspect was a lone Wolf. I can't comment on that I'm where of all there investigation. I just know that these agencies are continuing to investigate this they have different charges and that they're reviewing the evidence and after they review the evidence and the law they could file charges but I'm I'm not privy to exactly what they're looking Again I'm not prepared to It's it's part of our code and so we charge that. Our of illegal mine. >> Is this a confession. The text messages is that really a confession. It is cooperating since he's been taken into custody. >> Ultimately a judge will It's uncertain again, I'm not I am not aware of that information that's again still under investigation. I'm not going to comment on that. I'm not going to comment on that agreement FBI. Presenting evidence to the public. Your team has been very circumspect that hamper the investigation and build up to this. Well as attorneys we typically like to control that information to preserve and impartial a jury and a fair trial. excuse me the suspect I don't What the family said is is what That the defense will be from Utah County. I I couldn't predict what That will be for a jury to Again I'm not going to comment on the evidence. Again I'm not going to comment on other than the fact that I or the evidence that we've gathered so I don't believe This is part of a public document that we have to as we file a criminal information we have to file a probable cause statement that's a public document document and so we're comfortable with that. I'm not going to comment on I can't share any more than The evidence that I'm willing to share is what I just read in our statement. >> okay it did you consult Erica heard about seeking the death I'm not going to comment on that. Thank you, ladies and >> I'd like to welcome right now following that press conference former prosecutor I wanted to show what her new Chris Van hollen a great day to have a constitutional attorney Chris and always great to have you on much absolutely and he did a very good job explaining that in the state of Utah they do not have a grand jury system and so it's necessary that he files this information and that's why it has so many details in that the probable cause peace next we expect the arraignment. That's later today and then there can be motions accent before ultimately a trial knowing that comment on the fact there are 7 charges that have been included in the information all the way from that aggravated murder and the felony discharge of a firearm down to witness tampering because of what he told his roommate 2 counts of that and then Commission of a violent offense and the Commish in the presence rather of children. >> All of these charges against >> A little uncomfortable at the level of over. >> Sharing of in Copa Tory evidence that they did in this hearing. There's a longstanding Supreme Court case 1966 that deals with over sharing information, turning. A trial into a trial of public opinion rather than a trial left to do pre process and even though he made statements about out whether he he you know that he didn't want to engage in jury tampering the level of detail that he gave at this press conference is it sad Oakley the danger that's here. And if I'm a defense attorney I bring it up Shep where the Shepherd the Maxwell I'm bringing up the overshare understand there's no. A grand jury here but the lead several of detail that was put into the indictment that was shared at this press conference again as a constitutional attorney makes me very uncomfortable. >> And I thought the same thing part of what I thought was oh how much of this is about the ongoing investigation versus the basic facts to say yes we have probable cause we have to put that in the information and then share it do you think that it really crossed the line and gave a lot of information about the ongoing investigation that in some states we just wouldn't see revealed that this point. >> Because remember regard somehow we feel about this and regardless of the emotion that comes out of this he had the defendant has a right to due process and telephone conversations and Tech messages and testimonies Our 4th Amendment violations for he has the right against self-incrimination there are so many constitutional challenges that the prosecution is going to have to overcome before that that level of evidence is actually admissible into court and now not only has it been disclosed publicly and in an indictment. Actually disclose it. In a public press conference. >> And it's in the information and as the county attorney laid out he said listen, I want to