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INT-' - WITH The men felt that BISHOP! was lhowlng vvoritil '
tor those non who were in fever of UJI-Th I *
eon inue heard that the ecnpemr wee 50111.5 to open the nine! _
several tines, but I d1da't go to the nines tn V
those days. - -
"-Fith regard to the cleotion in D600 of 1937 I cannot State Ii-8
to any nets of Tielonee or throats node tg anyone. I don't believe _
I went to the nine wtwoen Me. of 195'? and Ewe of 1939 when the -..........*'~-
reopened. AB I reonll it o nr.-tiee ins put in the paper that the nine I'll
to reopen. When we went hook to work the Progressive: had the nnjerity,
but it was an open shop ao a let of the men didn't sign up right away.
As far as I was eoneerned 't threatened or beat up __ é d rquomber
by $99110; . -.1 _-
and others I8! I--e -= ~ -all felt that if they didn't 7
do as those men wanted then to, that they night got hurt. It soenod that
when the mine opened in 2-In of 1959 they would only hire U=M;W.= non-
1_[t was my impression that Bowling Green of the U-HAT. seemed to be the
non who bod n lot of 1ni1uonoo with the ocnptmy. I believe FKIBEITI um!
BOWLING GREEN were good friends ix;-much on it was ecnnen knowledge
thet they run around e lot together at night, going cn stag parties, etc»
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I nude up my mind that I couldn't get ulcng wit JA - AIJGETTI and hd been
wanting to ehr;-_ngo jobs for a long tine; I have reed over thin entire
statement of four pages, have initialed the first three pllges, and hereby
sign this pogo to shun it has boon reed by no and it is true to the beat
of my memory-
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_ Spcoiel Agents~ -t - F ' B ' I7 u U-S. Dept. of
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I- 1: ¥ -in-=i%;;1-*rm JOHN L. LEI-I8, ET AL -oi;. .l _ 2;-::',:f?;?_:s
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' """ ""'" 1.IiE I iii intervi"-" agentsh in so -== 1=e=-=~¢ "- - »
es o so matters let forth in the
_ statement which he gave. Be does not read hglish but appears to _92lJ.'JGB!I|SIIlQ7 '
questions put to him. I . , '~ - 7 -
he 3
August 27, -
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LILJJ. LL51 ,J.92JFollowing is a signed statement obtained
_ '1, make the following voluntary ltatament to
and O h of whom have identified themselves as being
em agents o e eral Bureau of Investigation. Re threats or prmiises
have been made to me "to induoe me to make any statement.
"1 B born ~11 =w== =<= W semtv
when a ou ; man and have eon e citizen or aout r ear resentl ,ro-=_e.,-=l- - . - .- .-;-."=,-~--- Isid-;; Qt ~'§- and on amn] owed at '"'"' _" """"" "'
I '-' 92 ' I first joined e union i Illinois, in at
which time I joined the U.H.T. I stafté no '6 ng at Mine B in H an
worked there until the strike in 1937. I was a member of the U. . . until
about 1932 when the Progressive Union was formed. Everyone told mo that if
I joined the Progressive the dues would be smaller and working conditions
would be better. As for as I was concerned the working conditions under the
Progressive union didn't seem to be any better and it cost more in dues.
Since I never talked to any company officials I cannot say anything as to
how the company felt about the unions. I never held a union office and
didn't go to hardly any meetings. I do not know anything about events 1ead~
ing up to the strike in Hey of 193? and didnt know a strike was coming until
the day of the actual strike.
"At about one o'clock in the afternoon on I-Zey 12, 1937, one of the
drivers told me that I had enough cars for the day and for me to go homo. I
Zhen I got on top I was told that the mine was shut down end'for me not to .
cone back. I wont home that day and didn't even go beck to got my tools. I
don't have any idea as to why the nine was shut down. I never heard about
any men in the Progressives being fired for being spies for ts - '-é Some time after the strike two men come to my house to see x§f¥h§§F shout work or sonethin5- L11 I know is that they sT"as"s*;»; n - f
snout something anq Left Wu my W1L6 tel en to ienve.--an J13 _4l__. __'1I _ J, Q
' "1 remember signing some kind of a petition for the Progressives
after the strike, I cannot remember whether the men came to my house or
whether I signed the petition at the union hell. *'. _ '~ ' 2.9
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1Re; JOHN L. LEHIB, mm LL- . 44, ;. 7 1- 4125""
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' so I dc not know anything about how the men fa]. tcwardl the uniona. I do
not feel that I would ever be able to testify in any court aa to whet took
place at the mince before or after the strike in 1937. 4
- The above statement of three page: has been read to me by mywife.-,9 and it is true to the best of my memory. I hnv initild 1'-h
rst :0 pages and hereby sign this page to show that it is true.
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'a1 Agents, FBI, 11.3. Department of Justice. 'Litnesses :
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n§= Joan L. 1.51 s, or AL 7 I i '.'l.;f_1 ,4, C-It .71>, e
n'-mvixr WITH
I ' l i years. and does p
knowledge of the situation existing at Mino_:B:.. Ho
witness, however, to testify to the facti'§et out in
which ho signed: .was interviewed b S cio ontl
no r as one I hi!
could be used no 1 ~
the following atotonent,
August :1, 1945
Springfield, I11.
make the following voluntary statement to
of whom have identified themselves as
Bureau of Investigation No threats or _ or _ .
'*E§' promises have been made to induce me to make any statement.
."I was born in have always livedin Illinois. I presently reside at I I first started
n king t hiring ix: when I went to work f " ' ave been wor athat mine ever since, I joined the 17,11."-'7. ihqand joined the Hid in
1932 when the local men decided to go with PR1. have never held e
union office. As fer as I am concerned, there is no difference between thn
two unions. Everything was going along fine until the spring of 1937 when
some of the men started talking about signing up with U;H,¥, I reoall that
some of the progressive men were expelled from our unionboceuse7they
more working for United. I think the men were expelled from the union
before tho atrik , but the ompany wouldn't fine them and that: what the
strike was about,
"An I remember it, I tent to work in my regular place, that in inos a digger on the day of the strike, "Fe got to work after my
gong od already gone into tho pits. I remember that the men were loading
their cars short and somebody mentioned that we should only load the oars
pert full. I believe some of the men were saying that if we loaded the
cars short the company might not let the men work. I heard that Iony
Qlpteh, Frank Austin, Pete §3rter and some other men were going around ea
see'the méd £Jtr§ing to organize for the UHW. I only attended union ,
meetings about once every two months, and never took an interest in what
the men who were supposed to be spiea were actually doing.
"I remember that on the day of the strike we were told by the
union to quit work at about 2:30 P. K. so we e11 left the mine. I .
remember that we all went out to the mine sometime in Sept. and our local
decided to sot up u-picket line. I was on picket duty for about a month
when I came home. I heard that Pelcetti had told our grievance oommitteo
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Re: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL - -~*-
IFTERV - that only UIW'unn could work me the company had u -,'
contract with UIM. I believe about 10 or 15 men started -
nue J to work that day end all 01' these men were the men who
had been acting as spiel for UJLI. Our men decided __
to set up the picket line when Felcetti said only UHF? men NIBFB to work. '
e 1 didn't hear Faloetfi make any statements though. ~ -
I voted in the NLRB election in Dec. or 19:57 and as far as 1 man
everything was peaceful. There was no violence and no threats were made
by either side as far as I kznmv. I didn't go out to the mine egain until
the mine opened in 1939. I was not contacted by any one to join the U.ll.I.
I was given my same room and started to work it to
cl b t tr i 1' ab ut eas soon e.q I got back
work. After I ha. een a .e m no or 0 ye asked b TowT+'ldtch to 'oin the Uh-E1 so I joined at that time. --_ he never used any force to got me to jo e '- On.
As far es I'm oncernod, one union is es good as the other as long as 1'1
1'1 ork ing . -
"I have read over this step...-e..t cf I-our pages and wish to state
it is true to the beet of my memory. I have initialed tho first three _
pages and hereby sign this page. - '
- e .:%@i$TM¢» ,K <=1g=e=1>- .
"'i1_tn_-sises
_ J: eied! . J Special Agents, FBI
signed! ! U. S. Dept. of Justice
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u put to him,
seemed to have a very poor memozi and in general it is believed he
would mks e mor witness. e:'.'"'uted the follmeing signedi " -.
statement:
"Springfield, Illinois
August 28, 1943 "
the following voluntary statement
c when have identified themselves
1 Bureau of Investigation. Ho
+1-1-¢92n+e nr nrnmi can have hmon maria tn 1-no tn indmann IIIQ tn malts An?V . ._,......_, ... j_...,...__._._.._,.. ......- ......o.. ......_.. ..., ...... .... .....-.__.... _.. ..- ._.....- ....U
statement.
"I was born cane to the B-8.in, I became a. U. . citizen as soon as I possibly could. I have
been working in the mines e . 1 = I came to the U.S. and joined theU.H.F.', sometime around I remained a member of the U.ll.I-
until'l932 when I joined the ' ogressive union. I have never held any
office intthc union and never attended many of the meetings - either
Progressive or U.H.'Pf.
"its far as I was concerned conditions were about the same under
Progressive as they were under the U.II.¥T. To my knowledge the officers
of the Progressive were good men and I donEt think they were engaged in__. - _1.__ ___, .._._ __
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Re: JOHN L. mats, ET AL _ .
i 7 Q,» I,12 " -IN'IERVIETf "1 vi: beaten up. I heard rumors that the U.H.F¬. promised
Elshofi conditions would be better 1: their union no
"1 the only union, but I do not know how the company
men felt towards the unions.
Q
I went back to work at the mine in the fall of 1939 and remained
a member of the Progressive union until the mine was recognized as being
under the jurisdiction oi the U..."". Since I began working at Igne B
I have been in the Tie-st section most of the time. I do not know
about any fires or damage done to the mine while it was shut down during
thé S'bIi.kB-
"My opinion is that the mine went on strike in 193'? due to the
fact the company wouldn't make an agreement with progressive as to wagea.
I do not know anything about the action, taken by union officials in
connection with the strike.
"This statement has been rvkn to me by Special Agent and
it is true to the best of my memory. ' M
Sig: ed .»
Witnesses
Special Agents, FBI
U.S. Dept. of Justice"
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., _._ ._ ._ :__.. _ x »- L - V-. 4 .as. JUEN L. LEITIS, tr AL v Q _
INTRVIEE 111:1? The following vestiition was conducted,a -F > I ._._. I - Special tee aq ff it pringfield, Illinois on August 23» IVE. 3'
Q M arefield, Illinois, Agents inte ~ =- im in e 1:lesenceo 1 = ' I e std bl
BdVi5cd he has never been arrested. He appeared to be very cooperative and
appears to speak the n;li8h languaae in a fairly understandable manner,
However, he cannot read or write the n,_;lish language and at times had '
difficulty in understanding Agents questions. _ ' _
It is felt that he has a fairly good i~;.10W1ed_;E: of the events that
took place at the mine, and it is -inlieved that he would make a fair witness,
The following is a aimed statement obtained from
. __' 1"
°- August 28, 1943
__ ~ , I-an Dpn _ {mam i II -. .. - A ~ -. r-' 1 -1' - 1»1, F--'..92.1_:Tf'1*.]=_..g:fE5£@--I . ~r_.»; - "__ _Elm maxing this ree an vo untary s . - to . and
' ' ' ~__!- "J1 " ':' ';Q 2 u .
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? who are known to me to be Special iwents oz -- ea
"" nV8Stl5aI.lO1'1, United States De;art:nent of Justice, and no PI'Ol.'i51.-5 o threats
have been made me to give this statement, and it is true and correct..-
and came to the UnitedStates in wand became ve bee.. working at Kine B
cI have never held an union offices. From wt? s 'it
the IJLTJ there at Min; B seemed to be a1righ't and I don't recall of any
troubles then. I_ _]"1lsf'don't recall no? How the miners felt then in regard '
to relationship between U153 and the managment of Kine B. Around 1932 or so
John L. Lenis stole some votes and wtwminers decided to form a new union_ and
the Ir0JC3ssiy1,2__Miners of meriea I.~c:.l #51, was formed. I joined the PEA
then in 1932 becausifall us miners decided to Join it but I did not have anyactive part in forming it. As I recall it Carl lshoff got along a]_1-i-2% t
'§u:v'92 Fl Q _.__:J.L 1.92__ m-_~ ._.._i --; ..4~:~.:..-| 1.. 4...-_... 1'5-3*! . +11 +92-.- ' +_Witt} blitz rgn, mun curu U11. .u...L3.:..:| LJLRJI 4'7!; ui"iu4.4. pun? SI»1"lk¬ Sc-6-3'»-e... .1. 40, .
I recall that ever,-thing went along, smoothly from 1932 to 1937 and that there
were no troubles or strikes at Icline B. I never heard Elshoff or Falcetttl
condemn the FHA men or officials. The PICA union looked to me to be alrigja
and they did a lot of good for us miners as they helped us with our wor and
;-,ot us b nefits but new we have to do a lot of that work ourselves. The
conditions new at Mine B are a lot worse new than they ever were under P11.-
From 1932 to 1937 we miners ran the local and not a picked fem II we wantedF "I was born in
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INTERVIET? win: ; something we mm the no officials and . continued! - would be brot up at I meeting ~- ,;~--7 - - "..??-f .15;
and voted upon and no one forced or told "
how-1 to vote. - a _ é I - , . Q "-
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"I used to attend tho FHA meetings once in awhile and they didpot --
fino us for not attending. I personally don't think the PL-IA men had arzythinl
to do with those b0l.'ZbiI!',;S but I don't know who did it. I her. no kziowledge
of the moncv affairs oi F11 but always felt the P21 officials were doing rig?!
with the mohey, _ h __
them to join over to the United Nine eorkers. I recall that on several t _
.1;-l!i_§-';Pf:?,EJIQ';E sneaked into my yard and celled mo out and on one time rianted me to sign a card which he showed me and when I sen it was from thfl '"About L or 6 months prior to the strike some of the H1 miners _would go to the homes of the IPA minors and would ve them a card and asly
United Mine '--orkers I told him I would not sign it and that he should get
out of yard. He did not try to explain the card to me at all but he d
not fool ms, I also told him that he ought to quit doiny that otherwisethe Ru. will catch up with him and throw him out him and he said to me UL
"never mind, I'll never lose an job there." And;r'T1'¬ver talked to me in
mine about this but just in cg yard. I never received any literature re
U311? before Lij.ne_ B closed. I don't recall of any picket lines at I-Line B
prior to 1337. I don't know of any parties that wer-, given by Ilshoff or
UH-? men. ' " ' '
"I don't recall anything about the contract running out in March,
1937 as the PLEA men and officials Landled that matter and I can't recall
whet they may have said about it as I didn't attend many meetings,"
F .
"I never knee of any troubles at B mine just before the strike
cane. However, just before the strike happened I remember that 115!! '
SCf~i%92.;iEVIOUS got up on a bench in the wash room and told us that we all shoul=
go and strike and he was talking, something about not g..tting enough wages.
This was the start of the tron"-ole. Some of us miners told him to shut his
mouth as no miners did not want to strike as we were all satisfied with Pail
endrrith the wages were were getting. As for as I know I don't P136311 what
the PILA officials did_In regard to the wags question. I was not at the_meet-
in 5 when they expelled the spies and the next mornin; at the mne I was told
by other miners that some of the FEIA raenhad been expelled. I rc-call that
FP...slJ{_4'11,Y5_1_I_I~I was one f them who was -expelled and I can't I¬;1I:'C:1Lb"-I who the
others were. I heard that morning that these men all showed up for work alt-h
they no-re supposed to have b~.rC:!'l fired. I remember that on that mornin- t§-3. '£I1 'COt3'I'.-TEE and the president of Local #5!» s-on Frank Austin gettingareadf
to go down into the mine and Austin had his headlamp on and he had a whip in
his hand as he was drivino; mules. I naléaed over to Austin with the comruitt. .
and the ;1.92"~:Sid.¬:I'1t and they asked eustin_ '.-here. he was going and Rustin said
that it was none of their business and he cursed at them and held his nhip
u as tho he would hit them so the ' ll walked avtey. I actually saw this P ______ _ _ - 3 _."'a 1 "'*' . ' - -L J - .' 1'91 - . " -
. I '-- - » ~ - .
| , ..__ - l _ ~_V_;.;1d .3 . -~ ,_..; _,, .,_ 5_;'_
, _,_ - 1 - . -."-' ~ -1 "'-t P ,_ . I92'.I ,' --'.;1--1a""" -.: j,_. -= '-~" 1" - - we --- --w-~-v~- .-v~.'-- -*0 - -r- - 1 ,;¢- --- V ~_92--1"...--t .w, __..,._,p_~-.1--..-.. =:-"0 ~s»r~ ~P.l :y _
_'.!
3:,ii
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:92- --
.....".".,
-5.,
,_ Z1? K 5i"' :1' ;F..--.1§:,92 ' s
we>-,1.
Q
1a board member, had ts fed _ ' 5 -._ L""'me'n that F-lshoff complained to that we ners 1HcroEn0t filling
. f, .¢- , W5! V ya .:92;92_ .. :2. 1,5. - ' _ -- '- " '4 1,:-_, -1, . - --._- ,1; ,.' -__-'-"=,:y»- : ..,_I I. X ~ .
' _ - - , I ;~:_,:= -:1; " us; -~ *1.~ , _.'- -s r -v_ ~ ' ' -331-*5 '/:'**_~:-al~'::" §."c. :l2 Y. A " *
RE: JOHN L. IEIS, or LL . - .. - .*~*-'__~»5r;+§ 1"-,.~,-r*f;_--'-"'7-I.~;~_*»-~-.. . . , '_ _' Lg: " ;' . _ "- - n ; <.-.2 er. 92. L 7 , ..">"_".-' '1;-f 1 Q
INTIBVIETI TJITII g sgrself and was right there. Austin lent down
continued! into the nine afterwards and pulled out coal
with the mules. The gjssip at mac Bow!-s that
lc to E huff about firm thew exoellted
our cars with coal, and according gossip thor. told lahof that th
miners were doing pretty good and that if he slould no? fire tho!-'. men he 7
would call the minors out and close down the nine. . 92 -
"He miners never loaded siort loads xmtil that dad and some of ti
miners were sore b cause the management left those men return to work and"
some of the miners, not uqrself, did not fill the cars full and they did that
just ocause they '-..er=.~ sore. I loeded full cars and when I got out of the
mine I did not see any partially loaded cars at all but just saw full ones;
I did not know that there was suing to be a strike until I got on to; whenthe other miners said that celled them out and. that they were
goin; to strike because Els. o 1d not fire those men. I did not see
F¢l_I£ETTI tall: to any miners on that day. The strike was caused just because
the m2.:1aL;emenL of liine B would not fire those men and there was no other
reason to strike. _ l
"I recall that shortly aft".-r the strike, I with other miners, sign
some petition in the office of liine B, and at that time our Committee,
j31;:=idont and F-.lC3TTI, were t-1.E£Z',""iE'::>. The F31 officials told us that we
should si;.n the -nay we wanted to and afterwards T heard that TIL. work, Ho
one told me hon to vote and no one b at me up and we all voted the way we
wanted to.
"I never signed any petition for U257. I also think that I signed
some other petition for P311 along the road the-re at the mine. I don't re-
call an;'thin;_, about U1;-' forming a new local in the summer of 1937,, but I do
recall that at some time while the ine was closed Till-I! P§Qj1C'-' caie to myhone on so-vzral times v:it_- D01 i!iYI£nSQUI.LE and 2?-TTH {£92'5§':'GI "J,;.c;: .311 and they
'r.a.1C-Ed me to sign a card or paper with 1.11.? but I told 'thon"'I ¬~?'¢?Te not sign
but that if the whole local went I would go too but not ot,hen:ise as I was
well satisfied with P11.
"I IuI31LI.}b.-I" that the newspapers said something in fall of 193'? that
Mine B would be reopened and all of 115 lent back to the iiinc B and intended _
to Q0 blck to work. I don't know if PLEA had a meeting or not as to what
action they would to-kc and I don"t r':5'1ll of anything unusual he_oor_irl"._ni$during summer of 1937. That morning I saw Fill-CEINI come out aalk to us
miners but I did not hear what he said out I heard from others that FJIIJSETTI
said he want;-d so many to do down into the mine but they had to first go info
the office and sign up with U1-ET. and then no Fl-U. men went down at all and we
all we-nt home. However, I saw about 12 men, one oi whom was JOY-Ih' SIRTOUT,
angst
I. _. _ ' __~.
» - . .._ 7' s I " ' " R 4;. I" "- .=_...-.'L..|.;--..uI »- 92 -' -4 - *7 _ .- -- :-... - a 1-. M-.-.~- -F ._. _,r -_-,-.-.-,,.,. ,,* ,7;-_»--o -...1...-, --W --,~, -- -- - r- - 1'. ¢--4.- .._..._-en. - J -2
5'1 woQ 92- I' -* if-.1-4 . . '3: 1 _,_'.-'-P Ss.-¬"~"l1":'§§ ;.l~%~-:,g.-1*--qwoef- 45 K W - . . '_-__{;';;;, ' : u *5 '=T' ,,
. -Y _ -" .'.'.lf:.;"» 7."i"*"-- * -" - --r"?=-'1" " . . " J lg: _;, ;-._ .- {1-
' _ 5' I ".- 7"-" ==.>»;. tr.. . . . -_ _.,_.._ .. __ -,-RE: JOHN L. LE-.15, ET AL . -- '="-'Qj_{:'I:E£'4¢;?;F~f..-"§'F_II{:.
* _ 1. ' _ Q;
- ,, .1-we ego a Izsrsevrsr: Inn: I come out O lline n office and uteri-n continued! I. leading them is the nne and had one of hit. 4
-hands in his pockets and Io all thought he '9
had a gun and ht hollered at us to get out of the we; and he let those men
into the mint himself. I actuall; saw this happen myself. I did not go to . -
an; n;etin, that day but was told to be back at Mine B th next morninb-and
I was there and no started a sit down strike. when I got there I saw this
bunch of l2 or so in the mine office and Sheriff Lou Gwld was there and he
told us PE; miners to let those men 50 home and they left the mine and got
into Son: automobiles. There was no troble there and we miners did not
hurt those l2 men at all. Everything was orderly. Ls I remember it one
of the F35 officers told us that iI_u: left the nine we could not return so
to stayed there hopin, to go back to work. Us really were not striking as
no were willing to go to work as Pi; but would not sign up with UHF in
order to U0 back to work. 5721 did not brinj in any strangers at all on the
strike and it was just our local ten who were out there. is were there fa
several months and we were protectin. the mine property as we did not want
anyone to damage it. FXA officials'did not threaten us at all and no just
decided to stay th;.1"3 to protect our jobs. The strike was very quite and th."..'
was no fights or bloodshed. " ""
"I was not at the Mine B when the Marshall came out, and I don't
know much at all about this matter. I don't know Tor sure if I was out at
Fin: -'1 when they tried to reopen it a;;ein in Doc. 1937. a
"I voted TEL in the first NLRB election and it was by secret belle
Government men more th re. No one told us how to vote at all and I: all
voted the ta; we want too and we were not beaten up and it was a good
ol ction. f1%.officials told us that when no wont down to the nrmory to
vote thrat w; should not t ice -any p:.pers from '_nyonr.= as they s id that U.-57
men might be alon; the StPGut giving out papers. I voted EA'bec;usc I
liked them and I was well satisfied. I f-.01 th;.t the vote rclfloctied the
tru- wishes of us PT3 hiners. _
"I don't know for sure if I went out to Kine B in Jan. 1938 when
they tried to open it agin.
"I 11¢.-.ra thzt Elshoff would not 51;, contract with 12:. £11thO we
all were PEA but I don't knot the reasons.
"I 1d1JC',.'d!lI" that I went 0' . ti: Ifino B and'F.._LCT]TTI told us that .
all could not go back until all rooms ere fixed and some returned but I
was told I would bu called in c con lo of weeks. I dont recall just what
they asked no out there. I don't recall what was said about wages but we
believed they .101 1d be the same as b for-:-, the same union scale. Everybody
was glad to get b.ck to work and I did not go to me;tin¢s so don't know any-
thinj snout the wages. -
- 96 -
l - -. - -' 1 _ - - ~_ .» - .1_ 1-92 92 V92'- ' l - 1.. ~_.- -. 92 F ~. . - v 3-_*92 - 1 . -L . *-- -r . __o ,_;.r ,,,921_.-A:92 1 __,_' ->__ S, _'. ;_?; J--.._ <_,. - _ - 1 _~ . _ __.- ¢ M w~ --1 - -~ ---~-mu - --- - 1! '1-1'~n|yrv ----w -1-vn.».I', 92..wrlv¢ ,. - .-_,---» r~5-.-- --.-~-_-- -l-- ~¢6- ----M--" -ll-I-In - --
i
i
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'51-Ii: '3
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T' 9
3
-ii; .> - _. 3. - ~. _,._<71 H, _. ,-,.._"an_ .-. rt»--;._ . -- _; 1,1.-2; i.-~.. c ' - -or f';:_-ii: -- ~-' -'-1* '-5 . 1 . I .,, -:1:-.-=r;; iJ 4. L. _, 3 _ :4; "-1 _._ ',_-',.;': s" ;_ ;.-_- ~ u,f,_:g', 33- =,- - 0| ' _. M I _ - 4- _ 5, _ {-4! .:V-.1_92:,'3_£V--- _h1_ I I ..H ' I-' -._- 3"--If-":5 3?"."?§r'iI I I - I r I Q k T--if-J
I7... »-o.."'-r '-. ,_. -. ... - - Q +.-we '" -
. '<.'§..-3-"' s~ " bl-~;"%".'f_' -
- T --_=-;'-s"~:£-. -
.lt j§"~'1
. r -92_ .- _ _ I;--1 _. _Qv~ .-_ I - _ _m g -_-r -w ' '7E: 401:1: L. LL..¢.LS, ETLL _ l V - j W I;
_ 6 i _ ii... ..__:;_r'
IIJTIRVIETJ rm: ~x saw a lot. of no"? men there and the;-' m.=.ma'- s
continued! - -. to be comopz-113* men as the; were allowed to go _
all over the mine and those men came from
other states and they were UET men. TQL'§___PLO'I'CII talked to no sevorfl times
in he nine as to W111; I didn't sign up with'm:.'.'T"énd I told him I liked H51. BIl}lSIi':'IO'J'I, the mule driver, t£.1k-ud to me several times and asked when I
was oozing to sign u_.- with U35? and he said I had b-it-C1 Sign up b-ziore it is
too late for no, and that he would
h-'_.ving dirt t1zro'.en on coal cars
I heard th_:t logs and sulghur were
E;S:'1O.ff called us and told us $11211
were not doing, it. I don't believe
at $.11 but it was b;in_, done by Ulf
191»! I last paid duos to P25. and in
around the nine of other F1}; riners
not -want to got e; boating so I doci
the mine
was anl-=.fix
but
putme. I had no trouble with anyone
oth..r . iners bad troubles like that.
on loads of coal b" U15? men and once
n. rte. taro doing, 11> .-Isa we told then we
that Pd. miners were doinc, won; thing!
non thcre in the minc. In the spring 0:
summer of 1540 joined up with UNI. I he.
g.tt:Ln; beat up and whipped and I did
dc-:1 it 1:0 ld be best for me to si;;,n up
with U11.-. TC-111' .-LOTC1; cane to mg home than and I 5i5_;92'lGd a card for him. He
did not say anything. I don't rc-call of signing any card for PITA during
summer of 1.940. I still liked P51. better than UHT but joined over so there
would bc no trouble. In 1941 I voted in the next RI.-RB election and I 1:q,*se1.f
voted for E11,; cvon tho I was then nit]. U1.-';.. The election was alrifzt but atin 1» mm there were so many new non there who were brot _ ' - s
to win that election. I voted the may I wants-6. to in that election.
No one forced no hon to vote eith';r.- -
"The Lnc B -aas in bad condition rzhen it was r- ofrcnc-d. It is not
all o;-en fet and now thcro are onl;-' about 253 men working tl':c.~o. It is
caved in a lot and some of tn: rooms will never be opt ned. I don't--know
a=r;,"thing about n fir-:= there in the nine: o ~
"I can't road the 11-rvliish l;n1;oa._;o but
been re:.d to no by ..g.:n- in the zrasenco
and corn.-ct and I have si-_;ned it 01 :2;-' orrn free
trrxr sses =
s;.-...,92_.-J FBI,
St. Paul, Him. i
ow:-#.aa»=;¢ ._ ;
Six:-cia n_;cnt, FBI,
I-iil"-.:a.ukeo, His.this 4 page statement has
of my wife and it is true
will." .
I .
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,:!:-f-trié;
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9. o. fa;
J ;. -_;_~,_.-2_- Z-r-_ 1Q. _.-1' _ -.3!-'
~..'
*2 'r .r ..' Q, P!-fu '<- 1
i-"2
i;-5»'- :92__'I'
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To
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% -=.
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.92_.
l
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r_-!_i._.,,-- .. Q1
.1F ,..-gt-o s ,§,,".- 2;; .
' U__.-92_. I _
' - .~ - ~ .~ 1' . If?-2 .¢ Aw"? -1-L1
. V . f ;_-__. H JFLW _. _.¢~ H :.__.: "P .| J. - .1 i J: -Q, V ' I92Y V"_ K: P: 92 '- _ ;.. T gl ,:: .._ ,.;:.;,__= ___ .92 . _ _-'7 >_ ~-»-. - . - I J .s , _;;,Lf_i-_-.':»..
. - e o _ _-~._. -.=-P-=;_~_~_'. -:- _ .~ ~" ~'-=- ?-'>"<= *-§ -* ;=i-?..isv A%§=:-e=">*~1_-.-~<":<"- 7' I ___, '"= =. m - ~ - - . __ 2-*'."e=¬=. -='_~- - s~'.=.»- - .
P, 4 ...¢ t Q.- ' - ';£'§92§. v "' "' ' " ' ""- "1... ...:: "-' _ ' _ V" ~ .¢- 3/,.§5=92=.f_ I.. It-_> '.-u..§¢q_¢=§.;o, _.*- -_- 1 ¢~-M: .1-4;; V, 1- I - ' - - - .&A~."=-is '- »Re: JOHN L. LE3-I5, ETAL _ _ _ W _t _- _92 " .
1 MWE-' lei we '
was bo
W85 natatAg I -92
1we92>B1=26. f
&
E
Gourt -- -
92 1 -H. .~ E - .-on 1" 2 Y-='~ = . - -- ~-.r~»i-.- ' -..L;.z",.-!-=.-4.~ . . - 'l' silrwi 1 -*'15§$' =? -- 31- ~92192!'*:- - ~.=~§§r¢§;'. '5'-'-' ""<-'92,~:-.?-,a- ",1 -". -,;;--*-;:"" .'-or.-..» ,. .. -2-z.---.92' - u 1 . .. ~= 12*--. '~=--=..I; .» - -=<r--, -- ., 4 W-¥-=»-1- ,.='-----.¢'r.:J-»'= - -. *"'-**¢'""- "- -Is '-==I@ - ,. t. 1" e. . as _ -.--= . _ ,0!!
esa. - ' - -r nihi-
Efiu uuii ¬.¢¬'t 5f 11.1.3 .|.-1O'1T1ElbJ.6T1, IE 15 I155 iI§.L18Tiél1 L15 TOULO Di i
guo T11
The following is a signed statement obtained from '
95;» .. 1'1 _¢ n . 'W ,'-o-,-I-*""v* . ._ -:";='}-.9292-;__';:!:»: I-'._"'; ;= '~ "1 _ _B =' '=-- '::*__ "r'
rr ....1....,-92= ILIJJLU|92 PA -92n 1-Ln!-.-@-_n__L §-_1-.A- .>92_»J d-QC J. U I5 JC1 UUl4.I'-71.1 U J-FUELJF G-1'-IL1 ULm"-0»tarily to and who have identified thernselw
to me as Spec 8. - I the eer * eau 0 Investigation. Ho promises,
or threats have been made to me for this statement. _ Q
__"I lite a1.""- . Srin ie d linois and at present" ~ *~ '" "~"~'1f?ii-.'" I cane to thekw-'92 _ I WES bbrfl 10¢ _;'~:~:;-:,::-=-é _.', rha-11 o ae es in -and was na 92.1I'3.Lj.ze' pr ; e d, 111., in?
an officer o
Springfield.
Elshof 1':..... .._; .. ' - _ 1"!_.:4....I 1.1:..- !Q_._l_____ __r; mu. -:0 "nae ormsrs in
' on. I joined the mion when I~r 92_,_-_ ___--._ .__.i J. HAVE HUVBT
was working aromd
"About. I started to work at
and Buckley were the operators ofa miner. it that time Hin_gj.as
Later Elshoff took over 1.31% nine .
Buckley's interest in the mind. ,
"Fr-ore-gate 1932 there was not much labor trouble at the mine.
G*;nerz11Iy the PELEEIOHS wtween Elshoff and the '6. ii. were good and with-
out trouble. s »
miner 's
miners
3 weeks
counted~ '.
"In 1932 the miners became angry when Lewis agreed to a reduction in
pay from 92¢ per ton to 68¢ per ton. H a referendum Vote th ' u
overruled Lewis and voted not to accept the reduction in pay. About
92~ ..-
we
._ .--4
I;$
.92=-'-_~' .
.174.
92-' _..-. 1'0 ,5 --4 ,-
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R.~. . -51* =.*='"*.**."==s*- re --.-11*. *. . . -- .. - » - - . -- ~ -..P 7 M5} " .' ht, [M -. if '- _ ".3" ?E.i}?l ."'.'!¢g;-"§E:I-a . - - -- - "'1'" ,-...§¢:"-.-. 1".'=s..> ,+*$é'>1:*a»-, "?.»:»=.:"-" -' I M -_ . =~' ~ Liz"-_';': __-71.-__,_..§¢'1-1~=",-_.__92fK'». '_
} * 9 *GP1".__
Re; Jam L. LEWIS, swat bf] C/
weif @0835.
IPJTERYIEH surf-1 Rafter Lewis signed the agreement rot a lower
continued! wage scale , the minors had some meetings aunng
themselves and decided to establish a new union
I attended some of these meetings and was in sympathy with their aims. I
was glad to get away from the U. I-E. V. iie established the Progressive line
'..'orkers of AE1E1'iC3 at this time.
"after their organization the P. H. A. secured a closed shop agree-
ment with Elshoff, owner of Line B. From this time until late 1936, Elshoff
seemed to be. satisfied with the P. M. A.. There was no trouble between
P L a and Elshoff. There were a few men who were not satisfied with P. ll. A.
and they were constantly a.§1tatin;: for the retum of the miners to U. H. I1.
One that I 1"~.§T?|<3I'.1bm.I is Ejrink Austin. There was talk among the miners that
Frank Austin received mone§i'fro:~1"the U. H. W. to help get the men from P. 1..
back to U. LS. H. Ihere also was talk that Austin was paying dues to both
U. M. W. and P. H. A.
, "From 1932 to 1936 I was alvays satisfied with the leadership in
the P. H. A. T0-..T:I: was no talk that the officers of the P. 1!.
nine a r-*-cl-cot. Thu. members of P L 1. were satisfied with their
'Ih:. members always were permitted to express t»bO!".5ElVOS at the
»"Ih the P. If. a, meetings there was no talk about the
were attributed to P L. n members. Host of the members did not
thing about the bombings. To the best of my Icnuwlege, the men
b: responsible for the bombings are not dismissed from the P.A. were rm-
officers.
meetings.
bombings whic;
know any-
all-1 ged bl!
LE. A.
"While I was in the U. H. W. there were many extra assessments in- »
posed on us. This was one of the major objections by the miners to the
U. H. W. - having to pay many assessments. This problem was not present
in the P. 11- A. which imposed no extra assessments while I was in the P. l!.'
from 1932 to 1936. One of the reasons we broke away from the U. 1.1. J. was
the many extra assessments that were imposed by the U. Ii. I. The only
thing that co.1ld be termed an extra assessment by the P. H. in W115 BI! EESSCSS"
rnent to take care of some rzvenbtrs of the P 1.11.4. who were striking at another
mine. _ '
"From 1932 to late 1936 there were U. M. W. organizers present in -
the mine !.{i.ng_B! but they did not set up a picket line or distribute
p;~@Iy1ganda or literature. Frank Austin was one of these organizers. In
this period I heard stories that blshoff and Falcetti -were going out on
parties with U. H. W. men. .
""" """"a I
, _ !
_-'99! ;_ ,
v_ . _ - -- .. :,-.;92__-; -Q;-f-H -- i -.._._._ _. - ._ 1 _ __.. __
~ ' -; ..._._,,_ . ~>. 5 _; 1: ..; =,-L .~_' _--:"- '4! -_ :L_ _ T...-W :,_ ..,...; __...___ .;.,- . :- »*' . _ ,.= __ , . .4 J -.. .:» .,_=» __,.»~ -..a *~" I .. - . - . -' Ea--="- -=»1--.~-;1-'.-¢- '""'"* - * 3**~*# ~ =.- ,;.'.., . . . ' ...-1. _. .. . " _ ' "
e:-:*= ' -I , I-.
" .- *-:-1% . n
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4 71>
IINTERVIES-i WITH ""Ib the best of my recollection a strike occurr
continued! ~ ' ' at lline B in the spring of 1937. I heard-
thatt'HtF"k'e:=.son for the strike was that the
minors were putting short weights in the cars. ibis strike was settled and I
for days later there was a second strike. I don't know the causes of thisstrike. I hoard that the U. Ll. W. men went to work in the mine, hand that the _
P. E. at. men refused to go to work with the U. H. Y. _
mt this time I heard that Elsho wanted the U. u. Ii. men in his
mime, I heard that Elshof! told people that he wanted the U. ll. 5". in his
mine, and that he gave the mine mules to U. H. W. men as that they cgqld
use the miles at theirhomes. This practice was permitted while no work ,
was being done at Mine B - while the mine was clos;c1 down. I heard that
Ifrank Austin was given 2 mules. I also heard that Elshoff and Falcetti had
said that U L E men could use the mine mules until the nine opened up again.
None of t..e P. LI. A. men were given any mules from the mine. -
Q "".1.bout summer of 1939 Tony Plotch came to me at0. and told several of us including
me ;1"3I: several others those names I don 't J
%1* m he :1. 1;. us. at that time, and that 1: 1: didn't join the u s
the National Labor Relations doard would nuke me Join the U. Ii. V. later, if
I wanted a nob at Hine B.
I know that cha:_les_ Bohdxgpon was a. U. 3!. ". organizer because 3
I heard that he told s..vere1 oi the miners that they should join theU,
, ti. if they wanted to work, and also that he had beat up several of
t dd t tt inth U 1:.-F sotttorthel the miners because hey i no wan we go _ '_ __ 5 __ _é _be-it up 'I'.I ? known to mo as
_ "In addition to Austin, Plotch and Bohannon, I heard that the
following men also were U. H. 31'. organizers: John Cotton! imenias, John
Sirbout, Gog;-g<; Jstoaway, Emory Jscznvay and J=1m-es I§Pa§._e:"i rrone'~trtnest men-~ever ttnt.ttt..><s "Q-?rsonal1§?. aw 7* "" : _ l '
Iccause I had been ill, I I-mew nothing oi the wage dispute _ _ .
of 4LpI"i_1 1-137; and nothing of theneeting of P. H. A. men in Kay 1937. its .
I recall, short-1_;r nit-er the P ll it men at mne B were out on strike, I signeda petigion P. . A. The sun who brought the petition to ne was known toms as ph!. He asked me if I was satisfied dth the P. 1!. It-,
and when I told m that I was satisfied, he asked no to sign the petition.
a . - - - r I .- _ . - ,_,.-<- _'=§~.»:..r:_,::__<.:,_ wry; ,-,,.-,,.____.:'*.= ;: -let."
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Re: J01-N L. LEJS, or .1. - ' ' II ~ I "~62
1NTEHVI'3..' ".JI'I'E *Scvera.l time__ in the summer of 1937'Boin¬
continued! Iron U H W came to me to get me to siga 1
' I petition for U. H. H. but I never did. IY
don't know the names of the U. ll. vi. men who brought these ptit-10118. T:
"ht the time he new U. H. J. local was___org§,: d ummer 0
13'"/'_,_ cg no akad oin the U. H. '1'. I-.1.-5;; .1. ' T**@1'°f°=*-o» I W 81'" 11° °I'I=-1»
ac o . I-' -Li. or . l. "Ii. men during this swuasrv '
II don 't recall that I received any notice 5 v who 'owners of i§:i.r;Q to ogen up in the sum-..:r of 1937.
_I didn -. take a grcat interest in l;.l!u! activities » .3 . 0 0 =
stite arsenal in December 1937 to voto 1.; an election called by the *
National Labor Relations Board. I went of zgv own free will. No one took
me to the voting place. lhe clction was advertised in the paper. Lt this t
election I votod for the P. H. 4. btcausc I wanted to belong to that union.
It-was the best mion as for as I an concerned, and I did not want to
have anything ti» do with U. H. Y.
"Tho election was run by the N. L. R. B. A6 for as I an con-
cerned tho election was fair and square. Nobody told no hm! or when to do
a.nythi.ng It the eloction, - "
Q,
"BEG-3.1180 I had quit my job as a 1-finer before the strike started
in May 1937, I did not receive any notice from the mine that I could re-
turn to the nine for .1 job. I donlt. know if the nine sent out noticos to
the rdners that they co 11d re-turn to work. . -
"I recall that I voted in the elcction of 1941 in February. The _.
Ii L R B said that I could vote occoune I was an honorary member oi P. LE.
The mine O0lD.,!<'-'.I'1}T contended that my vote was not valid because I was not
employed at the nine at theltimu of the election. I voted but my vote
was thrown out. - , - ' -
' ' I
-I have had this statement consisting of this and six other pages *
read to me, and I st-otc that it is true to the best of my knowlodge and '
recollection. ' I _ ' -
, . . _
' -- Eff" -==,.;. "::92.;L','~::8 " *1;-L-Ff" '. .
Witnesses: < ~ I ,'. , , .
__ special Agent, F. B. 1., Springfield, I11. ' pocial Agent - F. B. 1., springfield, nu.
l e . i-.o . -' ~» _~:,_, . I _, ~_ J --:~
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. ' -». # ":_ .3 ': {Rel JOHN 1.. wens, er 11.. _ _ "
l xi e "~ @212 h
, nu tater-'
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Special Agents
,.ILLIA§@:K1,e.R R Springfield, Illinoii V 1.- 2* - A V e'e" Fir-'.§d*= F°- 54- -1'.9é'2§_E.lY.° - -- en§-_q;i-Lne=:19a. 92d °¢!_ Illinois, was one of the miners at '3' whoso iciting - - ners o transfer from the t I a, and ti?! he hid
personally solicited him to do so. He stated 5 an associate If _Ci-.ARLES BOFASNON, DOAEIHIC P£.S¬;UA.IE, and other al age I= .1 spies who wereM ,__ £.- ......:...." .."v-tn, I * .-¥ " ' 'I'U1T§J.J-A5 In mne B pa. .. of wmeh were eglled from ELF-.7: tor their eenneetior-_1a
With ULTQ '
-' no te -
t B.
- In a written statement executed by on lmgust 26,
- v 1 w er tried 1943, he admitted he never fa ored PF» even thong e as a me-mb and
to persuade the miners to join Y%, and that he himself in Hemmer, 1959,
joined the Uli and paid dues to them, passing out their membership cards at -
luine "B" to solicit membership.
- tated he was a member of the L'M'E1 and on the Grievance
_._- Committee 0 A Ca "'- 69. He thought JOHN L. LETIIS was a fine men and
capable leader. ' 2
,1
. This man would not be a favorable witness.
I 'I:he following signed statement was obtained from
_4,ug-let 26, 1943.
"I H _ make the fell owing voluntary statement b_ whom I know as Special agents of the Federal
Brauo vestigation. No eats or promis-an of any kind have been made
- +n nun.
we-*1 lt "I was ocl1'r. Ill. end presently live at
I11. I am employed at Mine B . I am presently a member of the
- . Mine workers oi America, and a member of the irievenmco committee
of United Mine -nerkeri Local £7469.
f'I first oined United Mine Jorkers hereinafter referred to as UHOJ I11. a= went to work at the Coal Co. mine in
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Que I joined the Progressive Mine Torkerl Of -
éf¬ . I. - :1, _»__7 I F _ f .-., -_ 1, . t,-__ I J 92 ! _' ' '~ 7 '*'~'§§5 T '92[email protected]! 92 .
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IWTERVIE1 92ITH I stayed e member of [MW until 9-6-S2. It -
contined! Jimerice hereinafter referred to as EATI when the whoiu
of Kine "B" went TI. I paid dues until lay 193? to
PET. 'v .
About Nov. 1939, after tho long shut down, I petitioned {IE to '
become e member. The UL-E accepted mo & I paid dues to UH-G from than on to
the present time. ' -
5
'1 feel that John L. Lewis is I good loader for Uh-I. I did not -_
like the leaders of Iii. es they wiverc mostiy foreigners, they wented to settie
ell matters their own vmy, 6. would not let me express myself at the meetings.
"'.'ahen I was working at Liino "B" I worked as e member of PHI? as I
had to be Plfw to work there when the-4§*§?ed the contract, but I eliaya wanted
to work under Uli 6: I talked to the men to get them to join Uli as it wal I
letter union and conditions would be more satisfactory. I talked to the men
this way prior to Nov. 1939, but after I wee e. member of Uhi I passed out U16.
"' I - -cerds at the Mine B to get the II11I3r_3B to join UHF. I did not force anyone
to sign up wi1UlI.i. " _
3'15 re: as I know stseorr, operator of nine '3' took no sides in
the mine dispute 6: was entirely neutral. I have no information whatsoever
concerning unfair tadzics used by U!|l'ii or tho operators in the mining dispute.
. I. u._- A
Ti tneas : ,
Sp. Agt., FBI.
Special Lgent, FBI. ' '
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'e-in was h ed on Auger =5 1943 ,1 - ~ ci eats a " " ' ' e This person apparent y 1 e a goo
witness. He is of average lligence and is definite in his remarks.
He is wil'ing to testify on behalf of the government. The f'O110 -1'iI!g signed
statement was taken from him:
m.
ugut 25, 1943
"I= ._ C We f 01-1<>"~="ine voluntary.
statement to ' whom I know to be Special
Agent-5 of the ederal Bureau of ' .=.i;ation. -
~=itiw1 he-me was 2 ' I merely <-===-
"Hy first membership in union mine-s"iI3s in en I
joined the United Mine Workers of America re-fared to 1e na er ae.__ the
U. 11.. W. I joined at Springfield, Ill. and went to work in Mine "B" near
Springfield. I remained e menb-r of U}... il Se;-t. 1932 working at 2.5.18
"B". At this time about Sept. 6, 1932 I joined the Progressive Lne
Workers of America hereinafter referred to as P. H. W. This was local
#54 and I remain a member of P. H. Tl. until about March 14, 1941 when
Elshaff signed a closed shop contract with U. H. W. tI
"The relations b..tween U .5 and Elshaff at Kine "B" prior to
Sept. 1.932 were satisfactory and they worked on a contract.- There were
no strikes, lockouts, or slow"-'do.ms. The only difficulty was merely set-
tlements of individual miners -ii f1i~=|*-i '=D .u_4--4a.-'.@_v..v..--
of P 1.5 ".1 local at Mine "B". I feel that all:
the miners wanted to join the P LI W to get away from John Lewis because
he gave:-ed the decrease in the wage scale in 1932, he claimed the ballots
were stolen, and would not permit the miners to have a revolt and signed
a contract with the operators association. The only part I took was to
attend meetings at the formation 5; voted for P H17. _ "As to the formation
"Relative to relations between Elshsff Z: local 51+; F. 3!. E. be-
Ii-.f.3¢3I'1 Sept. 1932 and April , 1937. ." fro-11d state the relations were satis-
factory up to about Jan. 1937. Iowever, from Jan. 1937 to about April,
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Re: JOHN 1.. LE..~IS, er AI. ' =
_,c "Relative to relations between P E! officials
& P H'U membership I heard isolated expressions
that P M U was racketrun, but I do not recall
who made the statements. There was no compulsion
by P 1.111 to keep members in line. I only attended about l/3 of P ll ii" meet-ings as they net in S,»-ingfiold, I11. I ran for f
local 54 in the Fall of 1936 but lost. ' ' '
. J
"It is my oginion the r-ink & file of P H '-.1 thought the P 11".?
members who were defer-d.1nt.-3 in the bombing cases were framed and were not
responsible for the bombings. '
"The members of P LE J did mt feel they were taken advantage of
in a fin_f..n<':ial way as all assessments were put to 2. vote. For the first
year the assessments were 15% plus the dues and after the first 3.-ear the
dues to P 2.111 were a little higher than those paid to U 2.! J,
"As to relations between local 5!. & U Ii TI from Sept. 1932 So
April, 1937 there was bickering, over membership and 2. group of about
twelve P 1.5 U mo-mb.rs which included Dominic Pasquale formed a local of
U 15 .5 at lne_k"B" & then told Elshafft "reéo':;'1'eo" them as they had a.
majority. Thisdwas before the shut down about Hay, 1937. _92 C; " -- i *1sr;._; <2 {X16355 ~
92 5 _. .Y
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"Tho TY I.-"..|' did not set urn a nicket line- dis*.rin"=1te literature l I
but they did have organizers in the nine as aforementioned. These men were
as follows:
Joe A_lb=xnc_s§_!___,_ John Ilnzmia-ll
Andre! __$c}u7_:l_e_vious John _$i{Q_ut
J Domi_1f1ic__I_?zg§quaIo " George JacawayPete Qarter ' ' "i ems;-y'"35'¢e'eey _
I-r;.nk Austin Charles;
Tom Plotch "James ialemm .* ' $---1' " =-o.__..,,.-,.-,.,,_.,, _,-
All of the hove mnti-one-d orgunizers of U H31 had contacted no to join
U 1.1 H saying the U Ii If would give stricter regulations which would make
better working conditions. '
"Concerning the wage scale controversy in the Spring of 1937 the
miners felt to my knowledge they mere? got a report fronlshall what the
temoorary agreement Wes, & that as soon as a contract was signed there
would be e. retroactive clause in it. I don't recall 92-:he_t the agreement
was. As to the 92-ages I felt, E: believe the others felt, that the P H11
would give the same as U Li Z would offer, but as P H 1| was smaller they
would let U ii vi state what their contr.-.ct was 6: the P 14 IT would adopt
the same terms. . ' sI
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Re: Jo:o*L.tEwIs,s'1*x.L . l
w t 7@@
INTI-LEV xi *1 do not recall any slow-downs or: stoppagesh at this time, but the 12 above timed U H W
t ' I - in h_;in_e_[_]3'_* tried to convert P. members into
U L111 membership. T
"I felt that the actions of the above named twelve miners con-
sisted of attemptillg to recruit memwrs of P H J however I doi not know any
threats or pI0mi5-35 were made bl these twelve men. " .
"I understand tho operators of Mine B clained they had no existing
contract with P 1.5 h with retroactive pay. I understand that Enew contractswere grcacnted to the ogerators by P L! W officials, but the iaoerator refused
to sign. P E15 officials claimed that they were "stalled-of _ by operators
of Linc "B". I ditl not attend the P 1.111 meeting; held on the fnight of Hay n
1937. I was told b"P M 1| miners that this was an emergency imeeting. I
was invited to this meeting 6: I believe the other P 1&1; miners were ir-vited.
I knee by word of mouth & I be-love the other P I1 J miners know. in the same
manner about the attempted discharge ".11.. the actual sxpulsiori from P H E
of the 12 men naszcd above. I
"I believe all of the P K if members wanted tho expullsion and dis-
charge oi these men and as a matter of fact I recall that the feeling for
this movement ran high in the nine on my 12, 1937. During 11111.5 time I
was working below the surface "pulling; coal" and I know that {coal cars
were coming up short, which I understood from conversation had with miners
was due to the fact that the above 12 men were still being pcrmttod to_
work, and not because of any wage problems.
All day on 3-13}! 12, 1937 I noticed a growing indication of a 92 E
strike threat. I believe the miners struck because the above mentioned '12 men were still employed 3; not because of wage troubles. x
"I signed the ,92otition of H1-y 26, 1937. In regard to signing
this ,>~.~tition I was contacted at the headquarters of P H ac at 6th &
Washington Streets, 5pringfield, Ill. by a mmbcr of P 1.! J who ask if I
would be willing to sign it. _
*1 Imow of no U 1: petition which was made up in the Sumner of
1937- I know of no other pctiti n presented in the summer of 1937 which
I£2ful":Bd to the miners returning to work regardless of the pnion under
which they would work. I have never been thrcatencd in connection with
union or mine matters. ' j
. , . 1 t
' "On Sept. 2%, 193'? I went to Nine "B" to work, arriiiving there at
6 30 A H-, ho revel I noticed R " W '3 Y RBTB 1 QR
Y ld L» we u a: " ~-._,;@.= Ht Mk ' : "3--I-I ";.==»:»¢:..,,,.' -vi " -_ .formed 51,1 waste L; _ 1.? .- i-§eif;**_r _,J_ H . M 1, .and G1en?92Stuf1clbc§§§ not o go on I"Jni ' prtruiscs di-ii -A snga
tho picket. I was not threatened by P ii W officials or representatives.-4 -.1»
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" u "-E "I do not believe that the P u tr miners wen
-_ Z ' considered the Federal Injunction of 12-9-37,-
oontinued I knew that L_'._;_L_n_<:; {3f'___3v:-as to be reopened an "
1.2-9-3? from notice in the m?rrspa.pB1S. I did
not attempt to go to work on this day. _ ' N ~ f
"No threats or promises were made to me and I have no reason to '
believe that sneh threats or promises were ld to anyone who signed 3
ballot as being a P B U in the election of 12-15-3'7 held by II L R B.
"During the period from 1-24-38 and 11-6-39 mnbers of both unions
cane to 11;; house. The U U I7JiIa~5tIi8d to persuade no to change to U II '57
but no threats or promises were made.
' "Then mine '3" reopened on ll-6-39 I noticed that a few, possibly
ld or 12 miners, said that they had changed over from the P L. '-J to U H 11*,
but I can not recall their names. I was not satisfied with the wage scale
when Ljine "B" reoenod as I felt that it was about the sane wage sca1e.I
had b¬&n working Wlllaul. The feeling of the rrdnors at this time was to
return to work disregarding wage scale problems,
'"It was generally known &'.1OIlgSt the Iriners with whom I talked
aft;-r nine "B" ooencd on ll-6-39 that there were some cases of violence.
I understzxnd from such conversation that P II TI and U Ii T1 miners were
hurt. From qr personal observations I can not say this was correct. The
minors claimed to no that this violence was due to members of U I11?
attempting to thnaten members of P E If to drop that union and join U 1? U.
"In the summer of 1940 I sifned s card to join the U H TI because
I felt that large nurfoers of P E J nine:-s had left local 54 and joined
U L Ii & that it appeared U Ii if would oc. the controling union at Mine "B".
I was _t;:-fag of unemployment and for this reason changed over.
"In the N L R B election held 2-21-191.1 at Springfield, Ill. I
designated myself as a member of U 152:. I was at that time paying dues to-'
U 1; 1|,
"I have read ard initialed this statement consisting of eight and
one half page: and it is true and correct to the b=st of my knowledge.
. /51
.
'".'|'itness: i
J n ' l5. B. 1.-
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R92 JOHN 1-as LE-'15 LT -L14 7* 1 ' -I * - I b r.
92 .
V A-71* . '-,.,...» l _.,,-._T'»-.._;._. . _; h "" ' U ' . '-
.r' 1- H181 . .92 Srinfil I1 noil, mrugust - 945, -Q special Agent " Rd 3° "Pe °d 1 b° "11""to cooperate - '~ o the " W " '2. n - he si no statement ~-
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....+ l92_._L-L 1_,.u1_...Itru i.UI'L-H UULDW;
Tho folloving is a signed statement obtained from
Springfield, Illinois
August 26, 1943
"1 » M.Sp:-in field, I 11018 ma e the o ow ng vo unry I men -
' - .-id" , hem 1 mg to be Spcial gem oi eoeralgoau of Invosglgaglon . S. Dzpartment of Justice. No threats or promises
of any kind have been made to me and I have been advised this statement could
be used in court.
-- ;-'I'.¢r"<=. -l§= '- "I1:-~ I" ll. "71-5;?'¬ ; =-13,121,; - .1 -,:., ,_.=_i I'5 ' ---l-'7 -'?"';-'-:"-"T 11%,.
92."--:.-' 92§H: 1» r via-.,;';h;<:.!~-»--~:~a¢ _,92.-=1.92.: 3- a. I-ti-_-_-_. _,.,§ ._;:>_.:; CL _. _ -,-
"I joined a miners union the first time elbow: " st I
Springfield, Illinois and went to work at 1;T_ig_g__':B_" as {moo . a.-=
Frog,ross_i92{o _1fin_e j-_owrkors__of_o_Ame_rica which will bo referred to hereinafter" '* ' ' - - 1 reas PMFI. The United Line Workers of America will be referred to hora no er
as L-WI. The PHI is the only mine union I. av; -reg; been _a___ -Z Iwas a member of F1-5.? from approximately l all
of which time I vorkod st Liina "B" near spr ngf"i¬Td, ll. ' W re - any
office in the union at any time, _A"1 was b-or
Elshoff, appeared to show favoritism to those miners who were in sympathy ,s '
toward the URI. At this time, I believe thore were about 100 men working . -I
at Fine B who had PL??? cards, but who were still sympathetic toward the U137. -
In this connection, it had alway be-on my opinion that Elshc wanted the -' 'a "At the time 1 worked at Fine B, the Operative of this mine, 241-.
- UHF? in his mine. The P3117 men did not appear to got along as well with him _
as some of the Ullfi sympathisers. I can produce no evidence that thi was
true, but it scorned to be the opinion of moat of the other minors at this _. 171759 l . ' - ' __ lb
' - - * - . . ' n -M' "1 recall that in 1935 Elshoff refused to take out PM?! duel from_ "
the mine:-'s v.-a.g-es. There appeared to be no reason to believe that F137 miner
felt thlift they were being cheated by their officials. I tun satisfied that '
,-. K --._ .. ..... . - ._,1 '.,., .._ " _ _ j; *4 " "" -_~-- '-er-=--;~< __ i W~-A e ~ -V ---. ;. - r P 1- --__:Q_ :.r_ - l _-_,-_§- I . _.:-.1? aft _;. -H ._.. r ,____:i.b_~_ I. me: I l_r_ __ __--LL _:v it _.5. , V e - ;,;,,r 19+ £1 <1 f-*_ig;r:_:{92- mi HF _'=_,?-i '0 } -J 92- 4 1' Q: U
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. 92 * .. '
Re: JOHN L. 1.1-ms, ET AL - - e .- -.
INTERVIEK TIT3 officials of the PHI. I felt} and I believe it
WJ§§§§§@,n §§$§1 - was generally felt at this mine that the miners
¢Q 1gu@. "" convicted in the bodbing trials were frimed, and
that they were no more guilty than members of the
UMW, and their sympathiserss I - I
"I have never been threatened by anyone, and I have_no knowledge that
anyone else was threatened in any way while I worked at Kine B. I was i
satisfied whi1e.I'workod under the PHI, and I certainly aI6 EBt went to wurk
as a member of the U151. I would not want to work under J01!!! In LBWII, 1'01 ' .» - .- .2» '-hm"I
~..Z
I feel that John L. Lewis personally got a large portion of each miner: dues.
This is my own opinion, and I was not persuaded to believe this by any member
or members of the PET. ' _
"I have rend and fully understand the one and one-quarter page! of
this statement and it contains the truth to the best of my knowledge.
» @**°°>
'Fitnessed:
r 0 . - 92
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mned! . -.
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_ August 31, 1943. ,
I.' x .0Re: JOHN L. ems, sr LL A - A -;
'2
-' T!£1.£RVL*1'¥ I¢i'.".". The 1 ellouin investiat-ion was eomucted bf -5peci:_1_1.. .. g and - ,
a -- =: -- _. - .$8 _ 1 g_ .4, Q9 '
A . Ikgni-5» Gt -
I no s _Augus 9 ' *
Illinois, ggents interviewed' I"':'=' »{. ;'._.3 :' .
- - -"?":am¢.i'-i'¢7 " .7-I -- "Sprirgfield,& gtfj 1'.-1" - .- sod that many years ego was arrested one
Q but never was charged with any criminal offense.{92 . .It was noted thot@ is rather intelligent, has been active
in union affairs for marry ye especially prior to 1932 when he was
very active in UIJW affairs and it is felt that if any irbrmation or
background data is needed on the affairs leading up to the split in1932 that he can furnish such information. It was noted that?
was definitely in favor of LTLET but it is believed he gave a fa c
honest statement of the events as he recalled them.92
g _geve agents a signed statement which is as follows:
f -1 LTY Sgrifi _ Illinois,-g
an makin this rec and vo 81"" "n " and. _:.,..,:i;;§;§éi=::_;. i _ _ I ..,.[:_:,._ _. ,.v-,.=_--. _ .... _1 who are knesn to me to be Specie- ..,,-nt-s e- ...e .ederel ' T stigation, United States Department of Justice. R0
threats or promises have been made to me to give this statement. ~ -
s "I born I111m1= and
a a citizen of United" "111 not w*§1nce HQfahen I quit at Mine B where I was a coal digger. i.IOW --
st joined the Nati'on:11 Progressives in Illinois. In was -'
board member of United Mine Uorkers District No. 12 and I re gned
alter I Wes on there ier 8 months, Before then I had been subdistrict
beard nem_ber of district #5. I worked at Kine B in Spfingfield, I11., 'for about U or years in all.
"Before 1932 relations between U157 and the management of {Zinc
B were alright as far as T know. In 1932 i was on the Scalesormittse
of U1-ZR from District No. 12 and I attended various meetings in regard
to the wage agreement. I had heard that JOHN L. IEITIS went on into Ohio
men bu n 0 - u so-"ac oo t1~;r1. eIl1inoia7 000m g. QIl1inoi:_ ifrorsé Illinois;,wt:we 10 COF1mit 2 antfw that con-nittl ' that year after being on it for ! oruyearu, After this trouhlc _.~:...~ J__,;.
..
34 .* " -T ,.."*'*-. " """ ""-='*'..=1" _,».' - ' - *1? ~ ,. _ rt .. V -. ,-_ »- .,.92 .1...-: - . - _e-~ _' . 1',, - ' F ' F W 4-i 14" 31"? J. '§_,_§' -'.»_1-'¬-,.-?$'=;**j.">.;,-§'~:1 i-"'7?-Y.--;:-="f-.--,~..;1;?-.V _92,N .- 1 - ""9? 7'?-92-;.'.:h-27:"-%?3]I::j>:< 9.1:.-"*~f P-hi?
92 _ - . . _~, ~ -, -.-5. ,3 - . Q_' gs_ O 1 1 ,1 ""'~-':¬-§":. B063.-
5 .* 4 ~01 .___ =:;='92. at;_ -1...-. -.: _ H .._,-_-.,., __. *'q;;§_|@mA
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Re: JOHN L. IBIS, ET ILL
- gs; - -
- E, g _ -1
lz!J__ INTER. lm Personal grudges against one another and could not get. .be ;~ along. I-.-.1-IRIIJGTOIJ is new deceased. I felt um ms:
Zr con ='."' should be cleaned up and that the miners should not
bring in another union. I finally Joined the Progres-
sives at ljine B as all the others did. Some P114. Committee tole me that
if I didn't sign over to PM.'. I would have to quit. That night about '7
or 8 of us signed over. _T.'e were told to sign over which I did. I -
was given the U15. ritual tho instead of the FHA so in one way realhr »
never was with Pin I ne@_took any active part in forming the PM; at
all as I was satisfied with the old L'1S.'. I was just about forced to
join over to PM.., or else I had to quit so I signed over, but I never
was beat up or anything like that.
92
"as far as I know P12. officials got along alright with the
management of Mine B. However, I recall that neither the Pf}. officials
- nor the co::pan;' itself gave out much inforrationas to what was '
going on between 1932 and 1937 nhen the Kine B closed down. no far
as I knew the Pl-Li. officias got along with the managezuent of Kine B. If
I the P13. officials did any crooked work in connection with the books I
-... don't know about it as I never had access to their books. hen I first
Y joined over to R3. I attended a special and regular meeting but after
._ that I never attended any more neetin;_;s because I neverapprovodeof the
_ idea of the riners splitting up like they did, that is, to have PE. cone
7 in and take over. I don't know what went on with those P21. meetings as
after the split between U15-' and when Pfii. cane in I never took any .
92 more interest in mine matters and just did Il'{,' work and went hone. While
, with P11. I don't recall of then ever assessing any special asscssnents
except the death benefits assessments. I don't believe that the I?H.'.
J officials did enough for the miners to get the.-.1 clean and fresh air in the
; nine. However, this has not been remedied even since U217 cane back to
_ Kine B. I never heard any rumor about HE. officials doing crooked work
' with money etc. of the Local No. SA. I never heard anything wrong then.
E "UH? men never set up a picket line st Mine B prior_to the time
L the nine closed that I know of nor do I know of any leterature being
I ' given out. ' Before the nine closed CH..RLl-5 3QF=_»_;_NN,ON, C01I0JrI.,.~_N_..I*I_I..S,' a
T '1ittle Italian naneginli, PETE W1..ji_I§_.',_U5iII3, _;I.CfTCH, and sev- _
eral others would go arourxiwin the Kine B and would ta1Tc tE th¬' miners -
_i about going back to U111? but they never used any rough tactics at all.-
They didn't have to talk to me about it because I still at heart with-I
_. g Z UIZT even tho I had joined over to PM... I don't know if the above '
='*5 non receivl-ad arr! salary from UILT for doing their organizing work but
-- several of then did tell ne that they would get back from U11. money they
» spent on phone calls and for car fare. e
f '. 4-.
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4-:Fl - , .-e. . >-~.'
Re: JOHN L. 1515, ET LL ' J,
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s92
i
1?1It!'I'EIWIE..' "I never heard about my parties being given between
ab 1'.
I odn't know a ling
they were going to close down.
"I had $1: daughterin-lam drive me to %I§§§__B to get LU check
and at that time I had heard that the men were not working but I did not
know it was a strike. $=t tiine B I asked OSG;-J2 Fi,L='3EI"lI what the trouble
was all about and he said he couldn't say and I don't know just what he
meant by that. '-hon I went out there there was only the office force
there so I didn't ask argrone else about it.~ ELSHOFF and the ms: men. In regard to the contract
Io - nee -'-"" ru.n.ninP out Ln s Of92"' ""' "" I '92-3
out 1
wage
"I don't know anything about any men being expelled from
for doing spy tor}: f or U11. , and I never heard anything about a meeting
being held 1=:hcn those non were expelled as I was sick before the mine _
closed. A '
"I can*t re of =1-gni any petitions in summer of 193'?but arounif that time is now dead!and another man cane to iiftas u. asked me to sign some paper in i
connection with the wage scale they were sorking and I signed it and
they said they were going to all the miners. I didn't care who made -
the wage scale as if there was not any scale we could not work. I
was not threatened at all and signed that of zrgr own free will. -
"During the summer of-I was livinge in
Springfield, Illinois, and aro11T1dthat time cn_.:1=gj,s__s_Q*¢IT'U"U1 , 9';";9_r_;_
,'dI._'uI.'.S and several others cane to cw hone in a car and mentioned they
had formed a new UM; local and asked me how I- felt about it and I told
them I Still felt that I was a U.-5-' nan and that I would sign up and I "
told then they should go ahead and try to get more men but that they
should not use any force or rough stuff. J. short time later I signed up
over at the U757 hall. . ' ' ~
"It seems to ue that whenever the P5. had meetings that there
we touble of some. kind. I think that around Easter, in 1937 or 1938,13%.-.YBI.".E ;:»honetic! was killed in connection with some meeting. I just
h ard about this. _ .-~
.1
p
J1: ;-' '5-. --tL, _
..- - _a oi _ . ...._ ....___ .. .___-___. __....._..._ ._ . _ _ _. ~. _.. ., -. _ -. .1. 92:'1_" ~~-- '-_. - ' -' ..'*: 3'; r1"~' ' .-= . - ViI .. 1- e;-<,,;- - - . _ ' ' <::.*-= W :--=. ;?"--,;5,.s_1_.-_ _ - ; ,. -J, '-w = - » - *-. I V-"-u.H _. 08373 __ I 4; O 3% _
1 ._ . ~Re: JOHN L. LE-Is ET ;.L 14 La» G
- J0/"2-D'1.92
INIRI T. I just to see what was going on. I saw a bunch of
Q wops around there with canes in their hands and I
con inue ' told then that they did not need any clubs as no one
would come out and bother them. They did not harm
me at all nor hurt me. another day I went out too and on both times
things seemed to be alright and quiet and the men out there were from
Local 54 and I did not see any stranoers- Ho one had asked me to help
in the sit down strike and I never took an part init at all. I had
once said that I would never picket any union. I think that the miners
went out voluntarily to the mine to picket it and that they were not
forced to go out and be there.
"I read in the papers about the Federal injunction being gotten
out but I was not out at I-Zine B and don't know amthing else about it.
_ "I did not know argrthing about -the nine being; reopened in Dec.
"I did not vote at the first NLRB election and don't know am?-
thing about it at all. I think was sick then so did not vote.
"I don't think I went out to Eline B in Jan. 1938 as I only--
went out later when they opened for good. I read that P!i.'._non the first
election and I donit know: wr:;r EISEIOFF would not sin e contract with FEE...
I took no active interest in union affairs in 1938 or 1939 till Ifine B
reopened. _ _ " ,
"In the fall of 1939 I received a registered letter from Iiine
B telling me to come back to work and I did and I was told that they would
call me later on and they put my name down on aliat. I saw FALCETTI
and he did not ask me what union I belonged but Ifthink he knew I was a.
member in good standing of U15! . .1 month or 6 weeks later the paymaster
stopped at nor and told me to eone out and then I had to by new
tools asst-gr old ones
1;; 1tools
1 e nuc ma _._; was an shop when I went
back, and no one told us why it was that way, and nothing was said about
the nag 50816. I went back with U215. The P!-L. and UM. miners got along
alright in the mine there when I went back to work. There was quite a
few new UM? men in the nine B from Indiana and other states but I heard
O'|92-1L l9292.-.n». -92.- m -.4-on Q1 -Q» I92t92 n»9214-.e|_-or->4 I-A 1-r-.§n in Jinn vn-9-v§ HTTQU :921Qn§1-r92I92 P9-UUQV LIB" LRIII uulu 1|-JD Q1-L92J U92l U92J UH? 1-ll U11; IIUAU liljij.! ;$I92-IU-L/1 Q
they were not there long enough. Nobody asked me to sign any memh___ - _shig cards in 1 I I had heard that LE % , Uh-., and 5
was had a fight at hine B to never saw it but
IU .
/ "t dnk ' over union matters but was a personal fight.
.
1"
- i
92
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. i
is
o
L.
,-
E,-Rs: JOHN L. teasers; s / *"--=.
nwrszw . - '.' I W
' " any fights Fe't§'§enT"énd PEI. men except one morning =
"In Feb.,g- M
__l..'f _
I . _ _ .-~.._.:-i_r-;~:?"§-
0 ;_-...- ;__
_. _. .
c c Av
was a Fm. nan and 1-o_v.as supposed to have been beaten '
P by :__Q_t.he1-wise I never saw or heard of -
there was some difficulty in the wash room I recall-
1941 I voted at the NLRB election at the grmory in
Springfield, Illinois and I voted for U255. It was a g;-od and fair i
election, 1 was not told now to vote and voted foi UHI because I like
them better
"I
not getting
were taking
miners were
"1than
think that of the Fit- men voted for U1-LT because the;/Iene
any benefits from PEI}, and I don't think the FEEL officials
much interest in the Iago scale matters. I feel that the
sick of the strike and voted for U3-ST to get it over with.
don't know: what conditions the nine was in in 1939. In Oct.
1940 they were still trying to open up places in Iiino B. I don't kznom
of any fire
"I
any meeting
were givingwhile the nine was closed down. '
don't know wrqéfnscof was kicked out and 1 am not atter
when he talicedlabout money. I . -
"There was some gossip around that LFIFIS and the Feabody mine
EISHOFF money but that was gossip. I never heard anytha1._ng
around L111. offices that this was so or turs.
"Ihave read over this 3 page statement and it is true and correct
and I have signed it of cw own free will and no threats or pr0mi5B
have beer. made me.
<$~~1"*~>
JTT1 1'! ' l _.
__ Special agent, FBI, St. Paul, Minn.
" j£4Y _ Special .92.;6nt, FBI, liilwsukee, His.
._r
.
.
I
, ~114-+36,. . ..|r_
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Rel JOHII L. LWIS ET ' '0 _
A!V nifv = The following-imreeti ation wee ooe ~»- -- - -3" r Special Agents md "K at pringfield, no e on gust , K.
1 -£7he the Springfield Field Livision Agents intervieweda
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:-"rho advised he has never bee: arrested in his life-
It was noted um! rather intelligent and eeemel to havee good knowledge e.e to whet wen on at lkline 2: He advised he had =50
objection: to testify in Court if he weremieeoed end it is felt he
would nuke a good witness if hie testimony is necessary. 1
' Springfield, I11.
92 August 51, 1943
I h f t . t - 7 =32 ff: .:i3:":e_: f§°I. ?"1..fi-- 8.11 WILD u-{U Id-IUIIH bu an Mu vu upuuo ll-EUJAI-oiof the B. I. premises whatever have been made In .
'1$ odéress is d, I11.
first went to work in now years ego. I
been working the la
months beoau
I om e citizen of the U.S- born in§f%Q5§3tt%HmEQ;3e Ifirst joined v.::.$. in Spring. in-and _'be onge o 1; e un on -
to 1932. . 7gave Agents the following eigned statement:
! Priorto 1952 I knew of no trouble between Elehoff and the
U.!;3}' The reason for the miners going from U.ILY. to P.E-L. as I
having reportedly stolen the votee on tho
wage out question. I went over at this time beoouee moat of the others
A92A_ . "recall it was due to LewisE J - ¢ - .0->-31.-" ;,I
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' '1" 92|_I' P.L'.A. officials were doing alri ht. I dent Icndl _
oi any force being used to keep t5 men E1211. . '
4"" 1" '-'- ' """ P.l!.£.. in line. I never did go a whole lot to
5
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Re: JOHN L. LEYIS, e'r;-.1. " '
g'PQ . '". £970 ' " '
Union meetings. I did attend some towards the
last. s -
It is my belief and the general opinion that the P.!~'.1.. miner!
convicted of the bombings were not guilty but had been framed by the
Uellavfia
I dent remher all about the money but as far as I was concerned
it was all 0.k. The local P.Ii.A. was run by the men, there was no
clique that was running thiggl that I recall.
"'Bet'.een 1952 and 1957 I don't remember the U.fl.'-T. picketinug
the nine or bothering the men any way. I saw no literature or leaf-
lets distributed by U.?I.U. I dent know whether the alleged U.Ii.'i!.
spies were active in this period or not if they were it was down below
and I was alt-ays on top. -
"I never heard of 1-Ir. Elshoff giving any parties in Springfield
or Chicago for U.1I.TF. officials or men. I have heard that he gives.
parties but I never did know who they were for. ~
".e.fter the union oOnt1"u.ct ran out in 1957, I understood that -
whatever the wage scale was it WOu10 be retroactive 1?-O April the fiflta
I was told this by P.!l.J.. officials, I dent think there was any feeling
at this time that the P.lf.A. wouldn't be a'5le to get as good a contract
as U.I-:.*'. In April 1937 there was some talk around wondering whether
they would get book pay but nothing serious haggend. The management
never talked to mo about what its attitude towards dealing with P.l5.A.
was but as we vent on to the time oi theeetrike the men began to foil
thnt Elehoff wasn't going to deal with P.ll.A.
"I was not at the eeting where the so-called spies were
expelled. I heard about this neeting before it h--ppened but did not
go. The next morning when I came to work I heard about th;se non
having been expelled and that the Co. would not fire them. The men '
felt the position of tho Co. was wrong. I remember Joe__§3_l_}:_>gp3_s_e,
J£;:j92_9_s_MfIQlo, Lndrew S9-E};-_elevious, Domenic Pasquale, Pete Carter, Fran__Z_92_c___
.r'.ustin, Tony Plbteh: JoHFIe:an'ias, Jo1in"Si"F_t§'u'tfGeo. &."Er.ory Jooaway,
6. Chas. Bo_h1_:1i}:'n_§s be ing the~tF6ublesE§o"grou-5 E-t'the mine"Ee:ne"Uf ' "' '
an-s§'+.-556 the ones expelled at this time. I know the men -Here not
eatie1ied<'over wages but I the real reason for the trouble was!
the Cos. refusal to fire these men. I remher some of the oars being
loaded short on l':y 12, 1937, I dont know ME this was, whether it
was on aboount of wages or over tl firing of these men. This one
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Rel JOHN L. LEWIS, ET LL .
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day is_the only time I knew this h.appeh__o
. H I 1-sq that about 5 oelock the
1l_d the t out on sftemoon oi in}; __, ce_ e , , men o _
strike. I dent know exactly what t1c reams whether it was because
of the spie_s"'cT because of wages. I dont recall what petitions I
signed during the summer of 1937_ I do think I signed several such '
petitions, but I dont know where. Any petition I signed was for P.LI.1l.
and was signed under no compulsion and of mg own free will.
I heard oi a U.l..". locel being formed the runner of 1937,
no one cane to me at that time to get me to join.
"I dont recall anything unusual happening during the summer
of 1937, no E-ody bothered me.
"I was at the nine the morning the sit-down strike started.I heard of this through the papers. I Went out and esked if there was any work that day and he said yes, 3 elong
to . ." I rember that on this day only a few men went to work these
were some of tse so-celled U.i_.".. men or spies. After the Prog;?e's'sivee
found oizttthet no one could work unless they were U.1l.:".'. the P.1'l.&.
men decided that if they couldn't work no one could. I wee at the mine
most of the time during the sit-down there was no fights or trouble _
while I use there, we just stayed there to protect our jove. I dent
know of any one but local men taking part in this. Ifcet of the men
carried canes or clubs, no guns that I know oi. Tie were there of our
own free will we could cone and go as we wanted. 92'.'e were not bothered
by any U.IZ.l'-I. men at ell. I was there the night the U. S. llorshall
cane cut and reed the injunction. The miners left peacefully, but sort
of felt they should have been 9.110"?-Gd to stay there. 7
I dent know whether I went to the minejvhen they tried to c
open it Leo. l3, 193'? or not. ' A
I voted at the I?.L.Fi.B. election Dec. 15, 1931, we met at
the Hall and vent down in e group. I70 body forced me .tc vote one "way
or another and as far as I know it 1-res a good honest election. I _
voted for P.I.A. '
I dent remember anything inpfoning of unusunl nt'.t92.11'6 lsetween
the time of the election and the time the mine reopened. -
I kot a registered letter telling me the mine was to re- 7
oyen and I was there the 1"irst'dey it opened, I dont remember anytime limit to report. -'-hen I reported to go baoh to work I sew Falecetti
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JOHN L. LE»'v'IS, or AL _ _ _: ; " -
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/.-. I 7 r' I v 921J_ ".' . - ' J?-"".-.'=i ,'-"~'92-~ .2910 " I
who told me to come out the next day ii I wanted to T :
go beck to work. I rstur t vork the next day andworked up until ~ I knew nothing about
. ' 'e.|'-. . 0 . I the wage scale e ssuned it ould be
the regular I11. Inge scale. At first nobo said
a1r~,*thing' to me eoout joining the U.l'..T-'. I didn't _
pay any dues to either Union at this time. Both unions sent men to __
-11 11-rI_r h9292GQ +l'92 lsn run nlwlvir ':"I'92 T92D_ L fL. lawman vv nuw J_A92J G-uvuu Jv.|.e.44.n..92B ll nweel: me to stay with 1=.lZ..A. he didn't beat or thresn me 11: 111., Thinnr nnma Q Ann; 1-r92ll I.J"'Ill-92-J? my 3
was just before the 2nd N.L.l'{-TB. election, he Wanted me to stay iith
the Progressives but I told him, It didn't seem no use. B92'1rgarnII,-
a P.i'.A. mm who changed over to organizing for U.li.Y'. came to toe Ii
about changing over to U.Il.'- ._ and I told him I might just as well.
He didn't beat or threaten me. I went over to U.Li..". because it seemed
es though they had the majority over there anyway. After the strike
when I returned to work I saw e lot of new U.1-I.T*'. men there. A few of
them are still there but most are all gone ncllo
So for as I lcnow it always seemed it didn't make any difference
to the management which union was in the mim.
"I dont recall signing any cards for eithir U.1!.§. or F.H.A.
from the time I Went back to work up until I joined the U.}§.'!-'. I
joined the 11.1-1.7. sometime prior to the last N.L.R.B. election I dont
know just how long this Ins.
I voted in the last I92.L.R.B.
I voted gfor U.Ii."-T. because I felt that
_n__c_>__3:here. I voted of nr; own free will
threatened me if I did or did not vote
by _s_e_o_r_e_3_§£ ballot. I believe it was A
most of the men voted for the U.l-.7-'. be
I did. The only ones that were neat up
those were progressives that felt theyelection and voted for U.1i.1?.
the progressives wasn't getting
and the way I wanted nobody.
either way. The election was I
good honest election. I think
cause they {tilt the some way '
were Boat after the election
oould do like the U.l.?!'. men did
End stay there without joining the Y'.E"."'. They gave them wgoedlge
to ' he U.1'.*'. o d i the didn't the run them off.
isgm 13 n 1' __ ;
one oi the men who got bent he is still thereio joined r y
at him up. I dont know who bent these men up. I was n Co. man andbe
no body botherec £67
I dont Icnor whet kind of rh: e the mine was in when it was r
ger to put it in shape than it '. _______ - i -p
one-ned but I dont think it took any Ion
o'1~.=::*.ys did oo"fEJi-F. I gent r£mh_e_r__hoo.ring anything chop a big fire out
there while the mine was closed. I have heard. of Jae iGloecov-' but
I vr:ent at the meeting 92 h:;:.l'6 they kicked him out for/Saying something
ob out money. -
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_ .> - , _..»._W_,'. _-. , ,._.we ,
IN m ' :r'" ; I always felt the Progreeeivel 3!; »- =e- _
W §¬§;§§~~--. f the best outfit for the men. It vea always felt thlt -
the u.1;.Y:. 25 pgyngg for keeping the mine up while -'
. the strike Ins goinglh ' . '
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'1,.~ "F-I have reed the foregoing A page etntement and it is 111 _
true and correct according to my present recollection. I am therefore I .
signing this statement freely and i:iati1iE§ each page thereof-
. _ <$1':1=Bd> it
witnessed _ Q _ A " " spee. Agt. F.e.I. liilvn! _
1:7;
Springfield, I11 '
August 51, 1943'
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RE: JOHN L. LEZIIS, 1=:'r AL A, ;Q K l ;.j_
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1-V'IE I ..iT1-i The }'ollowin3 vetetion was conducted
t 3prin;;fie1d, Ill. on August 28, 1943. __ " . _- _ __
At the residence of Springfield,
Illinois, Agents interviewed . in a_ e advis e s never been arrested
in his life. __
It was noted that he seemed to have a preference for um and in re-
sponse to Agents questions he only remembered those things which he feltwould in no may be to his disadvarztage. He appeared '00 be a shrewd?
with a convenient meznory and is not b-rlieved that he would make a go é
w-1 fncal e:"L ...._.....--
The following signed statement was obteined fromlhdn: ' -
$pringfield, I'.L1.,
kugust 28, 1943
free and volunter; stan 0 * who
are known to me to be Special kzcnts o = ederal ur .a'u ves igation,
United Stats Departzuent of Justice. No promises or thre:-1ts'have_been made
ms and this statement is true and correct. _*
I was born in fend came to the United Statesinnd be-ce..1e a citizen around I an a c dig-;cr at Mine B Iin pringfield, I1l., and have been there for about°a;'ears. I first join-soa coal miners union around it Springfield, Ill., and have never held
any union office. _As far as cf" tf".o:~c were no difficulties between
Elshoff and UH. up to 1932 or so. I-rior to 1332 Elshoff and U323 Dot along
as far as I knot of. Around 15432 I joined PL}. because all the other miners '
did and did not trike any active part in the matter. It seems to lnethat
P111 5013 alon; with Elshoff alri;ht between 1932 and the time the mine closes,
and I don*t recall of there' oein;- any strikes or other tr-ouo1e between that
time. ' I don't know» if Elshoff or F;-lcetti ad any difficulties with PHL
b-:-twee. 1932 ani 1937. I was not an active member of FIT. but did pay nw
dues and attended only a very fen meetings. Between 1932 and I93? I be-
lieve that the P75. officials did. s 50-Dd job and I never '.-as suspicious of
them and they seemed to get for us miners what we 1-:a.nted and I never suspect»;
then of doing an;¢thin__, wron"_', with our jmoney or rights. I feel that those '1 ,
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RE: JOIIN L. IEIIS, ET AL ' ' "-.
IN'3ERVIE..' '-JITE; I beard thru gossip at Hinlel B something about
continued! parties being given by Els oi! and U15. men
or officials but I never attended such affaiz. '
I rocall that before the strike in 1- ? something was said about pages but
I never paid much attention to it as I still was getting my same wages. '
"The cause of that 193'? strike was not over any we to question but
was baused because there were some FER men who were doing underground or
crooked work for Uti? and that was the cause of the strike.
"As long as I can make e living and don't get into aw trouble it
doesn't matter which union I belong to. I did "not go to any meeting the
ni ht before the strike but heard something later at Mine B about some
spies beinc; kicked out. _I recall that on the day of the strike some of the
men did not load their cars full of coal but that only happened that one
day and they did it because they were mad about the spies not being fired.
KI recall of si-_.i.nin; some ntition for Pitt during the summer oi
1'-337 and can't recall if I si¢_ned any more or not. I sigied it _of- my own
. free will and no one forced me to si_,n it. ' -
193'? UlI.T formed a new local and I
was then asked to Join it but I can't recall who asked me and I told them '
' I would not sign up as I just stayed neutral."I remember that in summer of
I did not take am p-_1'ticular activity in the strike as I did not
"want any trouble with an;-one. From the time the nine closed in 1937 I
was not out there at all until the :..i:1e opened for good except one time when
d *- t th nd h 1 th -r. '- ck t. I hanoened 4 Pl... men force me to be on ere a_ c p e. -1- e A _ __down town one da and Q-92;_sn1oe F731 In n and I think one was in~ W - - .--- . '~ ; . l -t" nd th ~ told ~ I sho d be u ere another M one ic! a e_r no ui .
and they told ~ L, out and I did that day and then they wanted to keep
we there that t1i;_;]1t too but I had 1.Q=WifE phone that she was sick so I got _
back home. Thegx tented me to lag :10..n on the cement floor of the rash room
that night but 1 wouldn't. There was about 150 or 200 men there on the
strike. There were no outsiders there in the strike, just from the local _
-_ PILL. I .1-'.=nt out to the nin. m_ self that day and no one forced me or took
me out there, but they told me I had to go. I felt that if I didn't 50 out
the_' aivbht do some harm to rec. I voted at the first NLRB for the PHI. be-
cause the; were the majority and that is 1111;; I voted. It was a secret ballot.
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.- V V 4 .2--3-=';}'_ {M I 'R3: JOHN L. ET 1.1. /_ ..-_. ~ . » ' ~~~""'~fl_
I!¬1 .e'.RVIE.-.1 to be 0. E. according to mgr judgeent and there
continued! did not appear to be anything crooked about the
"When the mine opened in 1939 I heard in some way that the mine Ina
going to reopen and I went out there and they put ne to wo:r?; right away. I
don't recall getting any registered letter from Elshoff. I still was Pl-Z...
'1' :-92i"ln T -.1--e 1:.- -bwnn in II-inn F fhawe. 1:01-92A lmnn 1"l"l£'_' rnnn §'.H::a1-1: PI-nn n§']'us1II AIIJLLLG -L 92lGA1J "UL IKLLIB -L-ll I-1-I I" ill-IIGHICI "92I92-I 92J92/Ii-D-I U I IIIBHIII VI-l92Il92I D575 92'_l'592IIlstates and they would f§k ¬E>me about going baa: to U15? and there. was one
man in particular who was very nice to me and he explained hcm much better -
UL-'.' was but they never threatened ex: or forced me to sign over. I joined
over to U155 because almost everybody else was either U15. or was joining over
so I joined too. I signed something than but don't know just whet it was,
but think it was a membership card. I might have signed some card too for -
?Ii.. but don't just remember.
liinile I was eo.r1c;n; at es FIE. I used to send out clean ea_rs
of co-:1 but still would __.;et fined as they -claimed I had dirt in the coal but -
I know I did not 11.. e that dirt but I don't know who did it. It happened,
once in a. while to me and I heard that other men were having trouble also. '
"Seen I returned in 1939 there was bad air in the -nine rooms. There
were some cave-ins too then. I do-n't know an;;thin;; about a fire beinb there
in Mine 11 while the mine was vacant. _. ._92_
".125 long es no one causes any trouble end they just let me work '
and don*t bother me I an satisfied and I never took much interest in the
strike at all. -
"I can road the En_lish lean-;.1a,c but I have desired that A__;.'.nt -
read this two page strztonent to mc which he has done and it is tme
Min correct and I have Si;-"nod the Baud."
M"IE,ITE_:SsJ-__5! ~- . ".
Spe a .92;en , I,
1.£il- aukée, Sis.
re
Special n,_j'rl'1'C, FBI, -
St. Paul, Minn. _
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RE. JOHN L." mes, sw id. ' 1
I / . ~1'.
Springfield, nnmv use mm I
and
at his residence.
viewed in the presence of his wife and been
arrested in his life. _ ' I
It was noted that he had difficulty in xmdo:-stotnding the '_
questins mentioned to hin and his memory ills rather peer. HO appeared
to be honest nd cooperative but it is believed he would be hard to
interview as £1 witness unless his testimony is nbsolutely necessary.
Ho gave agents tho following signed stotonont and inmuch cs he cannot
writ-0, he signed both p-50: of the statement with an "I" and his wife *
signed his none for hin.
Spri'gHcId, III
August 30, 1943.
E1 1=1- 111 whinethis rec and vo on ry statement to _ W15
who are known to no to be Sgeeiul Agen s o - Fedora uresu of
nos igcticn, United States Dojmrjtzzcnt of Justice. He throats orgpranises
have been node no to give this statement.
"I was box" nd I cane to the .
United States about and I 11m no*t cn"-n. citizcn.' I applied
o irst we but can't nd w r o ' I r I po rs my fi he e I eon into this country. I
vnrkcd at L1____r_ since G--BL ELSHOFF took it over end I worked till .:1 ycdr F1;-;c I was 0 Quill digger there. n.1l1921D1~
Illinois I o '. I union but before I worked in Pennsy1v*1° a
whore you did not h£~ve to be10n,'; to 11 union. I have nsvcr_ held any
union office at any tine. Prior to 1952 I felt that I!-$3.! was more for the
company than for the minors. at that time I changed over to P!!!» as the
others-did but it didn't nc.kc any difference to no which union there ms
and I never helped them organise the H-in there. In 1952 when we belonged -
to U23! we minors felt that we should nut tnkc the out that JOHILL. LEJI8 _
92'!E=_';*;+3d us to take. at first H!-u men got tllong pretty good with 01-RI. .
EISHOFF and they were able to borgin end nuke contracts and I don't
know of any troubles between them at 0.11 cs everything seemed to be 0.1-
right as for as I kzeew. I never her-rd of anyone suspecting the PW».
officials of doing; wrong things. I went to moat of the Piih meetings
between 1952 and 193? before the nine closed. The union we pretty
fair when I was there ut I-li1_1g__B. Nobody Eve:-cg: told no I had to staywith PAH. and could not goinc 115?. I never any opinion regarding
these P15, non being sen o Jo-11 f-:2 the bmbings as I never knew uny-
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RE: com: L. Lens .s'r'sI..'- _ - ' 4 Ha . _ -.2 I _» I. v __- I fl , g V .r92 I =I 7 . _ 1. ,
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men ever bothered no before the mine closed.tam; about 11:. I never suspected any or the Bil. '- o
officials of stealing any money or of doing wrong thing!
and I think thnt they were doing e. good job. Io. {III
I never ,got any papers {run '
Uki-I before the mine closed and I never sew urq; CH-I men picket the nine be-
fore the strikes I now? know of e.z2_y spies being in the 1-92_.*_.'e for !!'_lT @
I don't know anything about any parties being given by Elehott or by EH
or anyone else. I don't remember any-th:_ng about the contrast _runni.ng g
cut in spring cf 1937. Before the nine closed there we no fights or
t like th always did. trouble at all Ind things were going along jus ey
I heard that there Ins going to 1 meeting the night before the strike and
x just heard it but I did not 5'6 and 1 don't know if 11-. was a speoil
or regular meeting. Ch the day of the strike I heard nothing about
wages and I did not knew of anyone .- in; expelled frcm the PEA. We got
oelled out frm Hint B but I don't mow re}-.;,'. Ilreoell 5'.:nethir.g the Rn:
""d'
of the strike that sane eors were being loaded short. As I remember it
some Pm. men told us to lead them short but I loo-dod my oars full. I
reeell that the trouble at the mine started beeuuse the Minewgmen would
not fire srme BMW men, and the strike was not euusod boe&Q§e_of Wages.
' "I did not Sign ::.ny petition right after the mine B 0106031, and
I don't reeell of signing any petition for either UHF? or FHA. I hoard
smethmg ebout LIE?! forming u new union. I else recall th!-It while the
J» 92v. |'92v.4-I -mar.-.+-{$4- Inn F4-92 11-92"v'| rn-rein +0 llmine was closer} 5 re-an some to m' house ......... .,_-oi. .., u ..... W... ..-. . .. ...-.but I_ 3 d not sign for them. Ono was K and tho otherwas and I don't know who the ti¥.'rd"'no' me. do not rooall
t, ' ,1. on lg during the summer of 1939. _ I -_._ we ' 2. YPP
"1 do not recall rooiovir. eny notice that the mine was to be
1 oned in So t. of 193'? and as I reeull it I heard some of the others '~ Psiy the mine was to be opened. I was out at
the sit-d-hm strike, no one forced no to go,
going en I stayed e 0;-uple oi nights out at
property. All of the non were local PEA men
hurt the mine. There ms no trouble or flghts everytho mine for o. few days during
I just wont to see what mm
L_ L_'!_ _-..._.J LL-.ihi: ifkiili: to IR!.-1..P Euuru bnu
just out there to see nobody
thing was peaceful.I was at tho nine the time that the U. S. Hnreen of-no out and told ue '
ld ha t le' vc when he told us ,1-ggis old us to gt-.ok up we woo__ gve o » -. - oand leave everybody p7:o'1-Zed up and 1oft* !%» ?o fights nor In-thing
threi ' "14 ,
- I dmt lcntw nothing, ebout the attempt to oponthe nine on Doe.
15, 193?. _
"1 voted for the PW». in the first NLRB election on Does 15, 1957.
'1 I tld D0 that I ht!-G to V0170 for RH I 7012611 fut th Nobody force no o -
- . » II 12 II,
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.as..r'osx1..1.ms,s_r4u.. _ __ ._
.-' r I l '-R ..
at -, Pa t 1901:»s ags": *-"rma because I 1s.1=@a um uinm and they were
at the nines - a = ,
Ina, _ "
' I dent remember anything about the
the mine in Jan. of 1938. Fran Jan. 1938 to Nov. 1939 I did
the mine but stayed around hone most ox tine. Se far as-..**~§:i'. J.
I ' .._L:-71 ._ ... - - _-. .__
-5,I"'-':?==?""' '"* a= '* ~; *- . " o s .- ;-_ _;-to ..' ' -*- 1'! 5" . " ' - _&,_; »-.nc92 »_ ' :N " _i>. ' ,¢;"92y- Pia:-. ;'{- '-.' -- -;7-z=- -Ir" ; - "»~,,.I . _ ,..., , . _ .1. _.._ £- H 1 J- -amt . s , .9638O - - __ ... 1 { J 3 J; - .1-_'- __ -. .:'~; j. ..~..r *1-' ' .-;:~f.;-.' -i1"-i<~2<*".-¢92.'- ' ~ 4
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themisn
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attempt to open
not go to _
I remember the
only time I =snt to the nine d".:'*...,,'=~ the strike was at the time of the sit- -
down strike. 92 ' I
"mm. the nine opened in Kw. was cane to my hens:
I had only three Hays to show up for work. He said nothing to me about
joining may union. When I reported for W1.-Pk F1xLCE'I"1'I, told me that nq
rcczn was not ready for mo to work in yet and that he would let me lmer
when 1 ooeld some heel; to W./[IE1 he never told no when to e-no back to work
I had to go buck frcm time to time to find out I went back to jmrk inand bl-;u5ht no e. letter telling no I should ems - -- o ork in three " ' days or I would loose my job. He only gave me the letter and no
Jan. 1940, I think. '
"I dent believe that
election, in Feb. 1941. .*Tnen' 0
1
I joined the U515! until after the last NLRB
I went back to work they gate me e rem thathad bad air this is the real reason that I guite last year because they
wouldn't gi.ve_'me a room with good air. Nob y ever threatened ne er hurt
no to make me join the UHT, but my tools were stolen "I believe rthie I'lldots by one of the U!-JET men hired there those men hat no tools of there
own in many oases. This was before I '5o'{ned the UH. I have had my tools
stolen on three occasions £Llt0g0'thO!'_l2_11 three of these times were
fore to ast HIRE election. It in my belief that the UlHj;1en" » '75,,-1,.-_':. _ . ..5-_ 3 so they stole my tools instead. I never hoe -re;
of the mb"t"eii'io1*o;e say anything to indioate that they favored one mica
cver the other. I do not remember having eigned am; men?"-orhin cards for -
either union during th¬_s921nn01' of 1940. -- " '1-- - '" -1 ". ;= '=.~
.1--' . . I I - I -5. .1. ;. '. L -. . . '1 '
' "1 voted at the second mas election and again voted for the no.
I did this because I felt this to bf tlir best union. I think that the UHT
11- n this eleetiorn because there were new nen brought into the mine I _
saw several men in the mine who didn't even have any tools. after tin .
election was over many of these men went away. In the Jan. following the '
-1,,..L: 5.. 1' 4 1.. A 4-mm Ihlfl 1' 901+ T krrl +n Tn-In I-'hn IMT n-r Tm hnn+ nnu.LuuuJ.u.u 4 JO.|..u$u Ulla or». 4 -L-r.bU 4. an-5u iv i:92-'-A-so Wiov ow. ...- -- ...._--s ....J. L...one threatened to beat no but I had heard 0? this happening to others nd ' '
I joined to keep anything from happening to ne. It is my opii 7.-an that
0-hditions in the mine are worse tmdor the IJH1? than they were under the
_ PHI; Q . ' .92. ..- L, ._» ,
- "When I returned to 't'he"mine there were a lot of Bqueones in it, I
' it was in pretty bad shape. I dentalmew orqthing about any fire while the
. _ 92av _ .
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Rh - -, - ' r -=::§;j..,i:»
JOE] L0 H KL I "'.:"|.§.1;._
" i f "<1 L - i I A '
92 I . 3.; ~ IH mine was closed. " _ _ ' - .
ocmtinued "I dent kncm Anything about tho nootinq-4 pt
G1xxSG¬1I92ims kicked out: . - ' ~. .
I know Aww-"I $§..1-;P.2E~"1:1?1@vB. 1>Q§lZ1il§-¬1.~§,QU!~LE~'PKY35.§J.-13_T§.;._me:K_1JJS_IIH, TONY 1=_LcrTc'H, ;:<!_2;:zi;.,11;.1;I.:»s, Jqzizgsgigrvr, GUERGEAIID mm;.L;C¢§ I.n.Y, CHARLE BOH¢~.NNO1§,but I dont know tho other hid; TUHY PLOTCH,n¬E'"T:'i1c of thém'¬T'E'§E'tionod previously ma hr-wing oomc to sec no to
get mo ta join the UM?» _ _ '
"I hf-we had road to me this twc page iqrpe-written statement andto the best of my reoollcotian it is all true. I 04;: time-rofuro signing it
of my 1.-wn froe will. . .
1!
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I to _-1.
Spec. 11431:» '= Milwaukee!
Springfield, I110
Aug. $0
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up-.- P- E .;-; ~ t I
aozmt. 1.':..1s,mm. , ,6 751 - "
M4 I .4111 '
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manner nave a as to the events
which took ce at the time of the strike and which he had. personal knowledge
of, peaks broken En ,lish, but seemed to grasp th~ meaning of
ques ons qu ckly, and was var; cooperative at the time of this interview.
-|-4. ;_ 92_E;_-|:.l_-.._.: a.';.__._¢ "g"- .I.I .,..-.1... .. _.-..-..-1 I-I4»...-,.-.. 4..-. &.-.-J--21".. 1.1- 4... at.-Q1.1.» lb UeJ..l_t.VUL1 b.lr.-92. l'IU.E.l.U manu :1 buuu Iu.uuLDa uu vc=au..|.1' la vu uuuaufacts set forth in té !E>»..-1n._; signed statement which he executed at the
time of this interview. ,
"august 29, 1943
_ - Springfield, Illinoil
_, N _A I make the following voluntary statement - both oi whom have iden ifiee themse
Lto , H 1, lves _
as min; special »&j_~;-nt, of the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Ne threats
or promises have been made to induce me to make a statement. s
-;~'_' ,,_92'.;§'*7=5_..-;.»-;~;,~'_i__**':.__ 92 -"I was horn i -H. O8-me to the U. 5. Ln -
o_t have been a U. . so and presently reside atI started mining in about an éoined the U. H. V. at
that tine. started working for Uine B n a-out and joined tho F P £
at about that time. I have zcvar heldny office in any union.
started working at Eine 5 the union was getting along fine with
and the union office s seemed to be good men. I never attended
union meetings so I cannot give mucla irnorrnation as to 1-ihat the-"-hen I first
the company
:~.er.y of the
uni on was Z-,
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5O ' ~ ' _. '92.- it, ; "- - i . - -. * , __p_,._ - ;.:._... __
' M1- ' I »~ '.~-~ ->1-". :-- ' .4" v" ~.t.m-" - k ' 1 *1'- ' ,x'l'-.---,;;- ice '1--~ -';;;-. _{ ti -T ';;*i ; ., 1:1!it e . » a c , ~ '- - ". .,_,~,o-1 . 4* ... - . I "'1 , ,.,-,-.. £11.», .... -c' -- F._ _.. , _*r__i_,_ _ I J.- - - _ 5,:-E f*- o ~i~'» 1* f*__-ice. _~-'3" I=. w. V ii 4 92- 1 - V ~1- _:'»#i.", 92 - -. 1' -. , J5, *9 RE: Joel L. mas, sr at t _ . ;
InEav1':-zwwxm-H; Ihited cell that our contract az-
continued! pired in the spring of 1937 and I heard
.- that the company had told our mien that
when a contract was signediit would be with the idea of being retroactive to
April 1, 1937. I -do not know anything about the activities of the 12 men.
mentioned durini; that period. I had heard that about 3 or 4 days before V .
the Strike Some of the 12 men hadrefused to go to work and as I mderstand
it they practically fired themselves by acting that way. I do not know .
anything about any union meeting the nite before the strike and I do not
know exactly when the men were fired from the uhion. , e
to work in the ection and most of the men seemed to be in the pits.
{rt the time of rike I dich't hear any argument or discussion of wages.
I do recall that about 3 or 4 days before the strike ? En the iornini of the strike I wont to the nine as usual and went
was talking to :1 group of men and asked them why they wore going to Work.
He said he wanted to know what wages he would be getting ii he went to
work. I think that a lot of the non started loading the cars short on the
day of the strike and it was nv idea the men were loading the cars short
to get even with the company for not firing the men. I worked the whole
day until about 2:45 P. El. when we got word that our work was nall done.
We didn't know anything about a strike until we got on top and somebody
said a strike was on. Tie all went hone and stayed hone for several dayl
at least. I remember Signing a petition while I was at the mien hall and
nobody used any force to have me sign any petitions. I may have signed
another petition but I can 't reoall the details.
/
"In the summer of 193?, .tPuqn1e a Joe Alhanese cane to aw,
house and later not no in the street at which time the-y=§si'E¬éd that I Sign
a petition for the Lhitod. I rem-Jnber that t.hey' had about a doze names
on the petition. I remember that the last name on the petiton was- I also saw the names of Plotch & Austin. "-hey told mc to jo! up
W1 nited and they would get me a better job, that is that I could get
a better location down below. They didn't threaten no at all, even when I
told them 1 wouldn't sign their petition.
"In September of 193'? I went out to the nine as It heerrd the cine was
to ooen. I do not remember how we-were all notified, but do recall we were
all get, L0 work. I renember that we didn't start to work because Elshoft ,
woul<i1*t agree to reco;;ni,,_e Progressive as having the sole bargaing rights
I believe that a few of the United xfen started to work so our men set up e
picket line outside the nine. I stayed out on_the gicket line nost of * '
the time, but we all went home when we were served with an injunction. '
' I .
"I remember that a few days after the injunction was served, an atterap
was made to start the nine again at which time about 12 or ll» United nonNI fr
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I K ». II .~.--¢ -A:-£5 c __- .- .92.92-<1w»IN'IEBV1Ei 'sT.t1H #oemed to be on z1co;f.*"' continued! _ i I di¢1't go to the
election in December Gf '= -
that i92>ny"P1otch cane to my house in the Bummer time and a .
'3-i¬nt join"t?1e Ihited. He said I would got a better cm -
Ho wanted me to sign a membership card, but I told him I Q1
he left. ' .
II went back to in 1939 when the mine re opened. Vhen I first
tried to start work I I58 told they Ierert ready for :19, but I started work
about 2 or three weeks after the rest had started. Eben I went out to the
mine Oscar Falcetti told me mgr section had caved in and that I had no '
section to work in. I Btarted working in a different section when I wentback and dich't get back to my old section, for almost a year. I
didn't hear any remarks about any fires.
"When we went back to the lne Ie worked mder an "open shop" rule,
but in my opinion the nenet first thought the Progressives would win out.
I thin]; Elshoff & the company showed zfawortism toward United, but it is prett
hard for me to give any definite information about that. It was the 2'-unnr
that in order to et e ob at the mine it was no essa fo a ~ e -
at W51 "_ E J ¢ 17 T ....! *'to the united officials. It was the rumor that if a man saw t
Edmundson, Bohinnon or__eny other united official that a mun co - -
A lot of our men 1=e1t"that"1.,herc was some connection between Chitod and the
company, but none of us could prove anything.
q 92
-' "I have road the above statement consisting of seven pages and-declare
it to be true and correct. I have initialed the first 81.! pages and have _
signed this, the seventh and 1ast"pago." a». ' /=/ e"Witnessed: i""' '
H "'-1:"I.-5 i iy 1-=.::'I=':".'." "' ' *
Special Agents, I. B. I.,
U. S. Dept. of Justice
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. . -~ ~. ' I-. . we-,»= q-*Y-..,--I »-'-I 1. .' weRE: JOHN 1... LE-FIB, er n. ' or"; ,
-___ - 4 R0 <15, .- . __ iv. Iv-. ___ <v_1pw.,"*bb __ ,_ . _ . , ., .-;__ K
_ _ I i I - _ 92-_-_._
P was interviewed e sci:-.1 Lgents 7 H ~.92§}° , o 92 n o '. ~
P} 5 clear I-900 ac an 0 mg fl B. O 8.114! $911] hi-I
J .story well. It is believed that he would make s. satisfactory witness to '
testify tr those matters set out in the following statement which he signed!
- ' "August so, 194$ e - - u -'
' ' Springfield, Illinois *
. . - i= , 7';::;;'_f:§;**f:Ej'-T,._:j:%'!'.'__' - make the following voluntary statement to
92 H 'j - _ oth of whom have identified themselves as 130- i-
in; pecia gents of the eerel Bureau of Investigation. Ho threat! or '
prilises have been made to induce me to make s statement.
_ .'.. . born in humis and P"°$°"*1Y 11" °*I first started we . - - the mines when I was about-yeerso and oined the U.H..v'. ir. Q I ve never held en office inany union. I stortec. working for Kine in hand at that time I was I.
member of the FHA union. o
es for es I was cc ncerned, conditions at the plant were good up
until the time of the strike. I used to attend no st of the union meetings
end we were toli our contract was to expire in March and that E1.-SHOFF was
going to renew our contract. I was told by the union that between April 1,
1957 and Hey 12, 1937, ELSHOFF had refused to meet with our men and agree
to e new eontrnct. Prior to the time of the strike there were no picket -
lines at the mine that I know of, K
meeting the night re the strike err!
took that night, .r has read
all of these men 9. e In ne. I ind
heerd these men were supposed to be spies for the U.M.W. rind know that they
were expelled from the unionfor not being good Pm. union men. I think that
it was at a regular meeting about e week before the strike that the 12 men .
mentioned were ordered expelled from the union for 99 years. I recall that
one of our officers got up before the meeting 8: reed off acne charges to the
effect that these men had been carrying on activities for the U.IvI.'-'f. Some
of the spies were at the meeting; and didn't make my effort to deny the
Chfgs ' I"I did not attend a union
so I do not know of any action they
e list of 12 names tc me and I_kne-w
'1 Went twcrk on the mo-rninlg of the strike and took up my regularjob as e digger in '.Then I got to the mine I saw about 400 men stand-
ing around and I was o - that the FHA men did not want the men who had been
expelled from the union to go to work with than, I had heard that these men
had g'3ne_ to FALCETTI and he gave them their live check to go to work that
morning. It was my impression that none of the men wanted to work with thesv
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RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL . Id if Ias r24'! Q".
IN'IERVlE-T WITH I recall that some of the men started sending up short
loads, but I loaded all of my cars just as they T'B?G refr-
posed to be. I believe that most of the men were sore
at the company for letting the spies go to work. I also
think some of the men were sore at the company for not giving us a new eon-
tract and meeting with our officials. I think the men went on strike that
day due to the spies working and also because we couldn't agree as to wages.
"I quit work at the regular. time and when I got on top I was told
the mine was on strike. I remember that I signed e PMA petition at the
union hell. E-ohody forced me to sign the petition and I signed beoause I
wanted to go hock to work.
After the strike and in the summer of 1957, JQE & D94;
INIC P.r;S1._UALE came to my house and asked me to join the U.lE.A. They told-
ne thrjti if I didn't join United I would never work at Mine B again. DOIAINIC
did most of the talking and said he knew I would-n't work 11 I didn't Sign up-
I told him I was going to think it over. In that suzmner there were no other
attempts to get me to join the UE7. _
In September of 1937 I recall that there was a' notioe in the paper
that the zziine was to open, so ell the men went out to the mine. when we got"
out to the mine FALCETTI said the mine would only open up if U.!!.h'. hen
worked thefmine. He said he wanted 50 men to go into the mine and clezm up
so the rest of the men could go to work. 'IO!g#_D1'LLO'N, president of bur local
said he would furnish 50 men, but FALCETTI said, I'm just working here the
sane as you fellows. I'm Just under orders. I've got orders to hire only
United men. FALCETTI then said for the rest of us to stan<i'!Jy and let those
go to work that wanted to. About ten or 12 men went into the nine and all
of these men were the spies who had been working for United. I recall this
was at-out 6:30 e.m. do our men then left the mine and went to union headquar-
ters where we held a meeting. We decided to '50 to work the next day and
throw up s picket line so the united men couldn't go to work. About 4.-O0 01
us went out to the mine the next day and the men Who had worked the day be-
fore went into FALCE'lTI's office and didn't try to go to work. The sheriff
and some of his deputies were there to see that nobody was hurt. Our men
then started on a sit down strike at the mine and kept a picket line at the
mine until the picket line was broken up by the injunction in Dec. of 1937.
I was on picket duty off and on most of that time.
I I remember that within a week after the injunction 8-me of the
United men went to the mine and started to work. There E only about 10
or 12 men and they were the some ones who had been expelled from the union.'
I do not know oi any notice that was given to anyone to reportlfor work at
that time h I think it was just'nn idea of the united men heard about these
men working so our union lawyer , had an injunction issued stopping those
men from Working. _ .
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RE: JOHN L. LEirY.IS, E1 AL A 6 ,7 I T
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I I L. I recall there was an 81.3.3 election in December of 1931- h
' "In;~!i0vi::'.ubei'.-cf 11959 I received ziotice to report for work azxl so Istarted working again as _g-,_me_mber cfP.H-.A- started working in 1939
I was contacted many time! by;_?LOICH, §U_STIFeJ1 "Ether: B1145 they would lay,' . . " in _ y ' aand to the beet of my kncwledge everything went eleng '500di
I do not know of anyone being threatened or any strong er! _tactics ueecl by either Bide. - . -e '
'Ycu'd better get right rnd jolthe U 1:5-nu eceuse that: the we it going.
It was my impression that the company was only hiring united men
until the election in Feb. of 1941- It is my informetpn hat
was one of the men hired about that time. .I believe Ii
ié is new working at Hine B. It is my opinion t1*~..=t ... e }"¢¢":.Ila 5.01: at that time he first had to see the United man 8: ---- him -
and then go tell F;921.»CE'ITI he was e U1"-_ited men. I believe alsowas hired in that manner. - - l
2 m J hi v..=' 43- 15$?! iiéicq, k j;' ='la_ F -1. i w *2 en
t'~ _ - - _ »- ""' "'* ~ ,4.
"I have reed over this entire statement of seven pages, have initial
ed the first six, and hereby sign this page. This etetanent is true to the bx e
of my manor;/'.' 1-
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Re: .Rnn L. LEUIS, ET mi. ' T
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0I'rssm.: JI'I'i-I HAP ..,+...- an hv hm 1-.1 mt; IN _ ' 1 ___ -R - - 77; ~. I. __._ i__ _-r -_r_.C_1__ ..°,._._-,.. W ~ r =1 *_=;-jj--*;... a a . T1115 P1131885 18
a u cra spcec and olligence. s e that he would he
a favorable witness to testify to those matters set forth in the follow-
ing statement which he executed: . - -
' '5pI'i1'1[_;fi01Cl, 1111111115 '
A _ _ M=s- 29, 1943
,, 15118 f01iu':l'ing Vwalwlt-ELI? 5{'.atBI'!.?11t
ta £:f:?":':3f'--M-P I 1'1 both uf Whom have id0I1tifi8dther;s!ves to no to be Agents oi the Federal Bureau of _
Investigation. No throats or promises have been mde to me to in-
duce no to make this statement. _ '
Eggs? »r> v v, soul: resideat , s rted r.ini_ng at the nine inSprin§?§"e -H H . ' J t gem joined the 13.}-1.-I. union in that year.
I have never held any J&41cc in the year I went to work at Pine B
1'1". and joined the P.!!..I. union at that time. When I first
Startcd wirking for Kine B the working conditions were all right
and things seemed to be going alung'0K.
"ht the time oi strike in 193'? I was norlolng as a cliqger in
the South Nest part of the nine. I kr1c'-'4 that there was a mien
meeting just a day or two before the strike, but I never paid much;
attention to union activities. -ll-B far as-I know a.11'tho men were .
getting along all right with the company. Our union officers seemed
to be doing their job W611 and the c-_"»r:1pa.ny Seemed t0 like our union.
"I hoard talk after the strike that some of the P.}~!..1. nen were -
working for the U.!.f.A. I also heard that the strike was over these
men.
do not kntnv anything about any dispute between tho company
and the men over wages as I never paid much attention to what the _
union was dsing. I do not I-mow whether the rest of our mion was
doing anything about 1.-ages at that time."1
_ _ 92.
. "Cr: thclday of the strike in 1937 I went to work as usual and I
remember that s-me of um union officers were having a talk with
Falcetti in his office about some men who were supposed to be dis-
charged. Sons of these nen were 55m-F Joe .l1b-mese, John Sirto_92_1t_P
and maybe some others that I can't reneribé?-T"'6u7 1-ffi¬ei"s Ee out
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~ , .. -- - . ,1. f '7' -'= .'If' - 1Re: Lo , ET no é I - :4; 3'7 '
INTERVIEW WITH and told us to go back to work. Tie had all been talking I
about these men who were supposed to be spies for about
two weeks before the strike. ' ' -
"I know that in the morning on the day of the strike some of the, ,
men here loading cars short, but I don t knom anything else about it. ' 9
I think the men were loading the cars short to impress it on the company ,
to discharge the men the union wanted fired. I worked all that day as '
usual and didn't know there was a strike mtil I came to the top after
our work was done & somebody said we were on strike.
"I didn't go out to the mines the next day and about two weeks
after the strike -1 signed a 1 BEL petition to go back to work. I dcn't
know whether some one came to my house or whether I signed the petition at the
union hall. I ab not know anything about any new U.ll.r?. local being formed
in the Sumner of 1937 and was not approached to join it. As far as I -.-ras con-
cerned A wanted to go back to work in the suznner of 193'? but only under
the Progressive. I attended some mccti xga in the smmaer of 1937 and I think
that most of them-en favored PHA-
_ In the fall of 193? I went out to the mine quite a bit to do
picket duty and was out there when we were served with an injmction to
break up. our mien leaders asked us to go out to the mines to picket so
as to protect our jobs. There were no throats on violence on the part
of anyone. _
"When the injunction was served all of the men felt the company
had switched over to the U.H.'.'.-. and that Elshoff was against the p
Progressive. It was my idea that the company wouldnjt sign a contract .
and recognize the progressive mien so no felt the company was favor-
ing the U.L{,A, -
"I heard that some of the mun tried to go back to work in Dec.
of 1937 but I didn't go to the mine at that time. In Dee. of 193'? the
NLRB supervised en election at the armory and we all met at our hall and
then marched to the armory in groups of about 15 or 20. There was no
violence of any kind that 1 know of. ' '
"I know that I went back to work at mos-B sometime after the
mine opened up in November of l939. '1-Ihen I wont back to the nines
they nere operating on an open shop basis. as a rule I was one of thelast to start work every day so I didn't sea any .fi%hting or any
violence. I had heard that there wore fights, but di'.h't see any, '
When the company started hiring new non at this time it seemed as
tlwnghwi-he on new men hired were U.M.'lI. men. It was my impressionone of the v.n.... were friendly with Oscar Falcetti and it
Scene as _ en he took a_ new man into Falcetti to get a job, that
. 1 ..~.u~ ' .- '
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Reg JDPU L. LE-rIS, ET ILL» i '1' if "
. H 4| _ 'Lg i " _ " i
WE; 'nI'1"H man always got a job it always seemed to turn ot H
that he was a member oi the 13.15.-'1'. I know that Bohannm' .1-:"-.1 w was also a good friend of Ilhlcotti. '
"In my ppiniun all of our men felt that the new men being hired
were all UH" men and that the FHA was gradually being out numbered. We
could see that some of our older men were leaving and their places were
being taken by UMJ men. It is my opinion that a lot of money was spentbyUnited to beat the progressives out of }!ine B - I feel that the progressive
mion was Sold out by some one.
"I have rr.-ad the above statement and declare it to be true and correctto the best oi my mernory. _ "
I/s.»
itnessed:
. '- 1';-5 _/S / .. - - ~=.-2A.-";;;-;-.= - "
-{L __;' - _Ibwcia-1 AQETIT.-5, FuBoIn,
Uesa mpito Of
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.-_,I.Y -- .,.. ~ 4 t - F -' .1 1/--2.. 1:»; _. . if -1.-.'f,~{~" 5.5-~..~;-' _ - " -.11? -, . " .; TY-" "st r; -:...%».- .. -13,. _~ . r ' .~a..~"v- .~ ' ';»""*:a? 4.*.+.,-;"'~**tt' 3? ¬%'o_.;gl? b:*§.§$'§;§'§;»;-§:j;@--i§il@*3%*if= 92 - ~ .2- . - it-o.--Pt .i - , . W 50839J '4? . "<- - "-.,-" - @-- " 92 I 1
- - i -. t ;-1* »
_ J " ._ - '- .4" -... -
om Jew 1.. Leos, or AI. l l 4 ~ < ~ *'"ii_f-~=t-f':e:t. ' é '.>' . Q; _, e,"_._ -. --,_ _.. ' _ . ~ _-___;._,._ _ r _._} _-$.21;-;:' "--- .. - .~, t ;, '
. INTERVIEJ mm _'B1e following I .- l by SI-W151 an _.§
at Springfield, Illinois on Lugust 2'2, 9&3. I _. xii
__ 2 , Bgringfield, Illinois, Lg-onto interii. awed 1 _ _
4 _ _ . h ' esene 111' _ . . 6.119 W I
_ . 1 I K __ _. _F; G_A ;,_ 5' 1 1 , 9* , ,5 . =1 I -= 1:-* .-92 -- .'-11?:-T ';.r*=:.: ?f':»1%".'=j1'~=-;.1=~i@_"'1§.*1;-31 '*:"; -. ,.- ,... --; -92 .- _ -.1 - . , " ' -- . ° - ~- . - -~- ' >- ~ W. . W ----- . j .1---l _ -
It was noted that he was above average in intelligence axznn nine '
and a _ ,_ a fair mowioaéo of the affairs that occurred
and hemnared to _ _ r" coo rative and trut '1'? .it homeh.. would make a goo I A 7
He furnished the following three page 1J!"!-I..*iv'I1.t1.'J-1-1'! signed statement
to Agents: ' '
_ I _ 5, _ _. ,I;§,,:
_ tum.-.a~.-.¢ -v -.-'.-- . I
r Y e d I1 0|
. _ August 2'1, 191.3.
- i . '_ "I, S 1-in f18].¢l I11 an making -»-._=,_;.|__,._.'l___. ._ wry =_;;_k-;.=_.:k-_g-.~ 7 3 -this free and vo untary statement to an -
who are known to me to bu S_><.-ciel I-._;en s 0 e eera Bureau o vs igatior
U. S. Dept. of Justice, and no promises or throats have been node ms.
r .1 we W =1 =1 =_=o1=e»
o the Thitcd Stat ' 1 1' s "ed r.11ns " I Tij--j., when Ins
ears old. have been une lo 'ed since Hay 12 1 . -v n ver half ' 1' I up s , 9 B 0any union office. I worked a.;'Hine B in Springfield, _Il1. from about Q
to 1937. Around 1932 there was a split in the United 1*-ine Workers beca e '
of a cut in wages and I rtcall that there were 2 elections held mder U155 '
and that the ballots were stolen and as a result of this Progressive Miners ~
of ..norica local was formed. I don't know at that time whether or not Hr.
Carl Eiluff favored one union over the other. In 1932 T. was in favor of '
PH; because I felt they were more honest and square and I felt that John
L. Lewis was unfair to the men and that it was about time some new nan should
take over. 7
"From 1932 until 111;, 193'? I know of no tIouble.or difficulties that 92
the management of the Sine B had with Pd. and they all seemed to got along .
alright, as far as I can remember. Betweo l932_'a.nd JTIGH the strike began A .
the P11 officials and Pith miners all ;;ot aleaj fine and never had any .difficulties and the miners never suspe that ii; officials were crookod..
In regard to the Pit; there appeared to no leader or big shot running tho-
show but all the miners and the offioir.-ls worked *bug'L-U10! and operated the
. 4 _ , 2 . /d I, . , . , _ . _ I I
. 92 /v _1. I: __.. _: ..
"I589 "i__d._', '_~_"-'. _ ..- '1 *2 *i _'. . »_ V .' '., ,, t ' ;_, .~ : ,_ t _-~-n -- -' .;»92~'- - ..',- -l "5 .' L. ' Q 3'" i-_ ,--'T 'r'.~..f' -. -§'g_ '-*.-,l- '.- 1'" ,.' . ._- -1 -' -.~x- ..- . _.-- , P92 Q - ..>- ;=-'?~~ i 1 ,1 -- .-I-~'> 4 »- . 1,. .- -~,, 92- -',,;..:-- --.-5_w:92 :92_ -2-. - __'- --§,_-J, .-' = " --F , ._.-_-,_ F. _--~ .--- ,_:_- -,<-_- - =.~; ,- ._ .._ -.-3 *~.- . -v ~ .rr 92_ :_~ -v- I '92 ;_">_ ,1'__-' .,q__92_'__92 ~_j- __A_#__, I _ .:_,.~i -_ M __,3;; ~: .. L¥ :7-[41 ..-1.-_. .--1;: -1»->~-. -4__ , _ _ _,, _ -. .- an ,_ .-u-q- ......,....,.-..,..--e... A-.».----92--<-- »-re --
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.,1 Fr>1.-" '1,._., .,- V... {,1 ,. -J ---=1 1. 2;-.»§'.'_"i-Q-.;Jé=T'~§~;".__,=_*"f_¬-___;A" ' K 3- "_-:_-P-'-"', 4' ?"-"1? "" " »Z-,;-.w- , --' ; " ~= .' ' 1 ;*;"-Fri; --4- - t .44 -92- .,.92 ~ ~
as= JOHN L. Lsiis. Er..L / '. '55-7 ci Li ~ ' P 1 'f_5_.._.».1§1 :."'_" ,-'92_ _-F - g-__._».-:';;~,1"-. c f§~- :-__ . - 92..»_.'-' " "-.'.,--O - J7 E -i'7-";-'- if-* ' -1 E5 *3?-*I=;= if.
A ~ . _ ,4 _.,,, ._ _ _ . . _: ._ 13,. .9 _
_ . hail. Vt-Q '2» » -, ' In
INTERVIE. TIT.-. local var? nicely and more never wastw continued! ' K trouble over this Easttor. I favored the
for all of us.FILE; local as they were doting 9. lot of good
"Between 1932 and 193'? there were about ll, men working in tho
l."§'nr> R 1."-92r92 .Fl_"LJ tY'.' mi V92:"r92E H11-P f!92f£.1':rr92'lI'92"_ _";!'!192l5li §-A 92rI92nr'- 1|-Mal +1-slaw P1l'92~_192 __A_ -1._4-nu -' "AIL! I-pin. 4-4 I-ll-LA&Qi92I uuv U"Erld"92J&l92.r 5.4!:-.1J-GI-I vv l92.|l..l.92Jr» UJLBU UAIUJ I010 LB"
ceiviné money fro; IIEZT 13008115.; those men were 13-?.llCing to the PIE miners abou
_-,oin_. over to and these 14 men all scan;-ad to have a lot of extra money -
an-:1 some also ;ot ne cars encl other things. These IL _m:m never talked to
me snout s1:in_ in; back to U'n£'.'. I heard that UM." had sent out literature and
peraplulets but I never saw or received arw. - r
that the"In regard to the PH.-Q. members being convicted for the bombings
as the opinion of all
A Valus 1.-dners that tho Uni ted Nine Yorkers acre. bu-hind
D1,. 'r.92c927n r92r92v921"I'if92+;¢f HA 1-92n§F92{U92:. +r92 an Ia-+9292 4+ 5+ Q11 A-Q HAG-A Q92J1I'ol-I UWHI £51 l1U92J1Jpl° UV V "$911 Q Q am
"I recall that Andrei Sc_hr_el§-qrious, Dominig..2_asgu§a__le, Pete Carter,Frank Austin, Tony I-lotch, _Joi2n i C5t't0n*!_,1nar1i_§.s, John §irt-out, p_<;_q.;m& Mn
Emoz-y'"J:.ca-nay, Charles Bohannon and Janos Halo, were at Mine B and these are
some of 14 men I referred to sbov;.. W d ' *8
"I nr.-vor heard or kno-..» of any parties or social affairs bctrosn
B Kine officials and ULCT. _
, "The cause of the strike in 193'? was not csusod over wages but
was the result of
had boon ex_:ell<xiKine B not fir-in_, Pctc Carter and Frank Austin after the;-"
from FLU. and thor. 1.11 _I1t h£.V92..' been a fen more who were
expelled too. I did not attend the ;;92o.:ti.nQ when the Eon were C£}C_I~O11=.:d and
I don't recall if
strike started at
a strike. How;-v.;
the idza that the
GIj.>G11G1'l. But we
strike T:oulc'. be.it was a 1- -l_-ular or special mecting. In r'.-gard to when the
I-Zine B it was not known to us miners that there would be
r, on that 1..-ornint; we all went to work but W- did not like
;na.na_;c;.1ent of Nine B would not fire the-so men who were
;'_..; .-._..:_._. -_._.-.; 92._,__ ___..'| J3! ,..._.L v__._._. 492__.n. -WGFRQG éd 1. no uvc-xunug emu 1101.15; emu ulu HUD IUIUH MEL ll
I learned about the men being, expelled thru gossip st the
minc and I learned about it the next morning. '
"Tie miners did not feel that we could got nope or better benefits
b; ch.-*.n¢;'_.n; over to Ull. from PILL. There never were any coal cars beinin-_ IOBQL-.;. _
short until the dag of the strike r.l1c.n we 1?-_inEIS sax. Ca.rt-r and itustin go
do".-n into the nine after the 1-.ana_,c.nent should hav fired the-m. This did not
sot Yell with the miners and the;--" did not tak; an interest in their "work be-
cause they felt that the Mine B _<,8Dunt was favoring U'.~i.'. F.J.-CL"T'TI never
sai anything to es to how he felt about the 1-11. and U1-£5. If the "
mcnt 'T.>ulci have fired these expelled men there would not have been argr trouble
at 192-Zine B at all.
. . -.. r , -, .-ac * " ,
__ __ ' . - 0 - '1 I_ 92 .-_.~._;_r __ I K ,. ' -K , .- ..-.7. -1'5 .-1_.:"-' - L; . Q ' -- 3- a_ _. . _.- - 1- x '_ rs. ' 9;:- _ . '- ..- 1. cs " _ " - *1-= ' 92- -_ - . -1 ".--- _~» ,'~3"*.-., zoo?-s. J ¢_:- . .1¢§-:" e
1
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In
Trr_ - '_ . 4-" . _ Fr .; _* '-4'_, r-A . 41,-_,ar -Fin-x - 92 - . - . J2 .s- ix»; . ', ,_.- J._ i ..> .,.,_',_. ;,_ _ K _l__.~ Y- . . 3" - ..1u:= JOHN 1..1::.:s, rr it -- ~
. , ,» II1¢rinvu:.." 1.1: iushm-my after the mine closed 1 ram continued! " I _ - that Ixsigned a FHA petition which no -
gotten upby-L. Aalrecall it-I
signed this petition on the highway near ine_B but most signed up for PHL.
all of us signed this petition of our own free will and no force or pressure
was used by anyone to make us sign and we signed the petition beesuse is "
wanted Pit; to be our local there. I r _ ' k V
. . ,
I ver si -ned ttion Io the U11? at v time but wife no es =-'-my 2- - r - _ en. W -,V told mo than men TO;-TY rwrcs -__.92-othe man who might have beenI-isms Bonmou, came to bui 1'io7.1se at "$pringfie1d, Ill.I I b v ne ' ii wand iri?-1tXYf';>dIor Eu. and -lie e that t ir purpose en as to sec mi: about
joinin;-, over to UMI. Mg wife says that Plotch pointed some blue steel
weapons at her while he sat in his car at that time. '
--- -ii -1 - I I -c 92_1 Ir .| 1 _ 192 _.|.14..I_.
"1 recall that n snort time later .L signed some other petition
in the Mine B coal office, and 1 don't recall who circulated this petition
but I know I was for PE; at all times.
I _ .
' I never was asked to join a UK. local in summer of 1937. I
recall that in summer of 193'? I-L.PNE_I '..ILLL'.!§_, who lived _on Second St}, was
the engineer at Mine B 1ookinQ"§i?or the equipment even tho the mine was
closed. Iiilliams was i; I-;.VOI' of PM. always and he once told my wife and I
that UZL.-' men had once drawn guns at him at the mine and were not going to_ . _- . _ . .. -_.. .. -- . -- .- . -' 1-. as - -, '92let him work unless he was on the Um. side. 1-1.. tom us that ne iineiiy nad-
to quit. ,192TILL-Iii died this last nint-.-r in Springfield, I11. If I recall
right Tilliams told us that one of the hen was DOBIINIC E}LS£¢U..I-E and the
other was an Italian. .c-e-~----1- "'
I don't recall oi anything unusual that happened during summer
oi 1937 regarding this strike. - ' -
' "During the fell of 1937 I did not receive any notice I'MKine ,_,,_ was going to oven. Hefncver, Hm=zv"ui ' ILLLQ-1'5 andwho also worked at the mine;6¬1i~i¬'-'to,uZn home a.nd
I a - the ELSHOFF was Soing to reopen the mine the _£o1lowin;, morn-
ing with UT-LI m'<.7r'1_a.nd '.¬illie:.s said that inasmuch as P15. was in control that
all I-I-5.; men should be at Nine B the ;féo13r~wing morning. tlhe following morn-ing I rode out to B 1-=12. phonetic! and when 1 got thereall of us Pw. men sci-¢ "£he1-t snu"%.T.1_c1 old us that he wanted 25 um men '
to go dojvm into the nine to clean it up and some of those 14 men I mentioned
before including F?1J§; __§.US§gIN, wont dorm into the nine. The picketing . ~_ -
started then the next morning after 31-12. héid a meeting in tom. 1316 é
morning no one went down and we P15. fellows started to guard the property
and those 12 or 13 men who wont down the dag bcfore did not go down again-
4 _ ,
92 . ' . ' ' 'I - _ - -
.-18928$. if .
. - ; c . 1. _ I -,
If < .._~e4- ¥- V. .' ~ -. Q1,- " !ir':_ = ~ . -. 92.,- - .' - L.-I __92~'=., .?".-c,- -Y;;.._ -.:f ", "-.-J~ I xv *1 --'3 -. , _ . . _. __ . .5 _ ,- _ J _ . , _~. I ».._ _._.-1. '7 V. ,2 - -,_E 1, ;' 35' ji J, 1 -.'-.- <-" - -"'7. ~'.--"-3 -'~-;'n Q t - F" '~"- " Ii '-.>~;<..;'- aw» --~=92'i- -*- ' -:= -" "_ '_ ;92>'§1 V#; ',.,_,.._ "41-"W- -_ -'---'--*1"; P =i ~-i- "=1 ---a_7==.6_*E-e 4.--"*'!;"'!"":'!92~'-~=* vs #1 W . o *' -Hr '-'-""" " " ' ' " "» ' , . . 4 -7: £1,_ = . , -. ....r».§-"! Y !L "L 'l'l' H .'92"- . 2 :w--" . 92, _ _ _ _ . ,;_, 4:» . 4, oi? _ e . . »~:.,*. ',E*,,&?;, _ 3;;. _ _ ,_ , .__;. .. __¢I=.. ms. _ maggg'3 ' " .~-< Z - -it i.§;4i' "- '5"
._~ - . . . . k» » ~ T606398 -
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I 2 i s » 5-;:.. D8399 e
4 92 -=. _ E-. '5 -~-*5~"-5'-_:~ ._ »_ --1 _ - -".5, . -. - - - .' o '-~...~ '- - 1,-A-s."i='--._,..r- _ -, '.'_,*.'-.' -2RE: JO!-Hi 1.. 1:-:..1s, "er 1.1. Z, 15., -o ~ - ..1"e=~o;;'1;§_--r~"
. -~ - _ c..?;-pi; ". L,!%D _ ._._ 1;. 7
IN'IEHVIE'.T trrrn "3: spent quite e bit or aw time at the up . "
continued! 7 ' ' during this picketing and we were gus.rd- _ _ c
ing, the property as Ie were afraid th-a_t "
' U1; might cone in and damage the mine property. The strike there Ias very » .
orderly and it was just to protect the property. Ho outsiders were brot .
in by PL; at all as just the local PEI. miners were out there. Eo'ev'5'r_u
sheriff and his men were out there too. »
"Tie were doing this picket work just to protect
no one forced us to cketthe
and our
"I don't know anything shout a strike in Doc. 1937. In December,
1937 I heard about NLRB goili, to hold an election at tho n.1"DOI'§?' in Spring-
field and oltho I did not have to go and vote I nevertheless _
felt that Flt. 1-ms the best and several miners came out
T voted for I have shown to oeents
will and no
one uvfis go down and vote. Its a result of this election I heard -
that P1--L. ion by 434 to 25. This election was by secret ballot and _it was
. perfectly 1o.;o.1 and nothing crooked about it and I know that the other PIA
nen voted for PLL. because they bclicvod that was the be-st union. About two
months after the mine opened in Supt. 193? T first received nor refgistored
letter from Lfr. Elshoff offering me back W job. -
"I also voted at the second NLRB election
then and I voted again for PM... The election was held a r ~ t - t the reason
UH. non was because I had hoe-.rc1 thru gossip that many .5. men were going
erdound to the homes of Pit. and was telling them to vote for UM? and they
also were ;ivc.n liquor and other things. I believe that the same 14 men were -
the ones going around. In regard to this second NLRB election tho EL, men
had to go dam. to vote by certain streets. - .
"I have never joined the UHF. ' .
I I
. "This 3 page stat n-lent has been road to no and my wife by hgont
and it is true and correct I-no I have Signed it 01' 14y own free will. -
_ --1, to. ,o t» - --_;=.,,,..I - ""551;-'.-" A- ,,,-,5 '-o-"-1'.-I5-I-{1T§.'-_,.. " - _1 _ - - -- - '
_'-i'-rigging . ' _ .. o92 1
f Special .o_;;¢.-nt, FBI, St. Paul, llinn._ l -" - A - Special Agent, FBI, Iiilweukee, His. _- '
~ _» - -1:9-i
_ _ _ . - , ."_ ' 5» _,"._; 1-_' .3 . 1 ' ' Ir v H - , . __ _4. :1 v of I . ' _ 4;!" _1. _ 5. 92::;' .1 _4" 7 J 92_ 4' i, ._-, 7T._ 1,;
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' '- ._ --. -'_...44 .-._ __'-5'-,:¢'-1""; 1"--"___;*": V=~ ' _':..I - V@%¥F¥%%%¥yi," I '~:~t P ~e%?=.;;** *¥_':.?-':~>~"-$5 - I '' , "~ "--. .4 --23%,-,_'< l;.*'_t_;é1.-m.
..- 4 _ , rt» _3~s,¢=.sg~;~,;'¢-*:::,:;. . ' 3'? ;;:- .' F&'f§'_f??;Re: JOHN L. IJJIS, ET hL V . _ . I, >:4..;i-t.-;~:~.-,,,Ir it . _. _. . _ a ..._, ijqlé- . - . ' . _ st-' A -t §§§:;_.r._- 571s iip s"»>ffs$; DI!-ITERVI;'.T.'.' .I'I£I who resides in his wen hens I
linei, was 1.nteI'Vi;'.*#Bd at the
..1 ,
ci 1
was b*.=:"n
inf 2;-ants 1 nitness due t-'1 his above average intelli-»
5-once for 0. miner, ;_;0:>d wppeeranec, and pod ability tn express himself. ~
He is inclined to be verbose and state his c-nclusims as facts. BB .
gave ini-zrnatien as But I-arth in the fallzw-in; signed statement:
_ ; "Springfield, I11_
_ .'.921[:113I| 30, .--ant
. it = "E - name - u I nrakc the follmring statement to - ; and f_:_;;¢_ =<'~ 1.-11.» have identified themselves11' I - 1. ? e = 1 LE! .- ne cia ._tn s o t rcnu 11' Inv-sti" tien. Io
promises, thrmts, or c.nsiderati'>n of any kind l_-Q3 been rude to nc to
mks this statement. I an willing, if necessary, to fa to court an-1' repeat
any part of this statement. . _ . _
"I rst Jeined the U *7 ' fz: rat went
t ine B in .. 92 .» . -s
" 1: I u - to Ilinc _B. I J>ined_ths Prartrossive I-tine 92;;;I',C__1_'_'$ .2f .-ncricr; in 1932 whon'tTie "§{ine went over from tf§' 515.; :"Rt""
that ti::e"I"'hL-rrt aver, but did not particularly mnt te change unions.
I_ changecl because I wanted to 1'o1J.~1~.: the majsvrity. I was not satisfied
vnith the PL? -'921 .2 at that tine. The check offs were toe high. I also
thmght th-~t there ms no sense in having two uni >ns. I always felt
that my, and told 92.-hoover asked no ab-nut it exactly 92.hat I felt abvut
this matter. A cmplc of years bcfwre the strike in 1937 this situation
improved as fer as the-thuck eff: were cmoemed, but I still wanted to
HTVU enily Jnu Unian. In my opinion quite a few of the "nan at the nine
felt the same as I did. Before the strike there were several men who '
had signed up with the United ino Torkers. Hans of than ever twlked to
me, but I understcznzl tht at the time :1 the strike there was a majority
mi men Siffnod up v."1thtTra IIIIJ. I do not krwv: because I di'5"not sue the _ '
recwrds or t'11ced to the men , ~ - I ....__........- "'- 'I. - - _.z.>=---,. ..-.,. ._ -H, --»--t-1..-=_.---2 1; ~,_. I» ¢"-r>--"-,. _. ":1 ».:-we-3'. ' ._ '-='_=..~ ..1¢>--. ' j£.,-,' -;- <=;- »--,, E 92'-- -__¢ . .""';"" "l-if": - '-"§%.-';- ~"T5.:'*:- "-.¢-'-W' :'Y'::.. -3?;-T--== 1- z; " ' '=?":~' 1*? Ya ' '
92
, .
? ' " In 1932 when the P137 was ft-med, Elsh-eff seemed to favor tln .
PILT. His fav vritisn seemed to follow; for several years and then I -- . s
noticed that ha chmgod war to favoring the {£117. I do not recall any -
specific nets thvt -ccurred to favor the U15. men. There were not m-any
Q4 then in the nine, -me he could not do-ta: nmch; but it seemed as 11'
he was favoring then c.;;".in. . - " ,1 . 1 - ' i=-
92 . _ I I ' _ _ .
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92- .-fa "' - 1- -"i 2. ~..-.1 -en?= ow, .-. --.~.*..--'.' "-A"._' .
T 1." In "I was not at the Union meeting the night before the" ' f.=
election. I had seen men in groups through the nine . l.-__
gqontinued! in the days before the strike talking and arguing. They
seemed to be upsetover the wage scale and the contract tb
the P§..".'.' had, as not giving the men as much as the'I1'.' contract. That is
the retzson that I think that many of the men had signed up with tin I115.
before the strike. _I did not know th"t there was going to be a strike;
I thought that the strike was called by the PHI? officials in order to
keep the rest of the men [from signing up with the U113. I do not know
that this was the reason, because I never talked to an: one about it, but
that was my opinion at the time of the strike. I di not sign any petitions
after the strike. I knew that there --.:"s a U-J! local fe%d, but ne%}'
ever asked me to join this local. I was at tho mine part of the tim -
during the picket line. I did not g.tthere the day that it started._
"I voted at the election at the Armory in December 1937. £8
far as I 1-cnovr it 1-ms :1 fair e-Iection. iiobody tried to inuence my vote.
I voted exactly as I wanted to vote. I understand that in some of those
elections men have b:-en thxzatened, but I do not lino": that that happened
at this election because I never saw anyone threatened, and did not hear
anything about such a threat.
' "1 went back
I think that there was
in 1937'. -..hen I 11;.-nt back in the nine
Sh ft Number 5 was pretty badly filled
to get it hack into opemttion. -There
big oave ins at the nine, while it *..':92s
"During the tine that I have
has hen a pecial man checkin_gF_,_:}irto work a 'fo*.': dr=.;.'s after the nine reopened 1n_1939
only one time that they attempted to open the *'- '
mine during all the time that it was do'.':n. That was in Aur-ust I believe 0 J92.....'| 92..~..... ....:.|._ __ 3-.., 41,11-1-l'-11.-I IJUUH QULDG $1 LUM 1~n.l..|-IQ
up, and it took them a long time
had been no fires, and no other
closed, that I observed. .J-L.» -9..U113;-LU
worked at this nine Ihe-re never .,
the day tine. A man did that atnight after midnight. I ms-.= the mine after the nine .
-reopened. I do not know what he... . d to be doing, but I know
that I.s.-"m him with equi,r.nent that an air cheek nan nould M using. I--
do not know that activities were undertaken at the nine in or[*_'~.nizi.ng-
the United Hind Workers. I ::".1 a shot fire nan, and do not go doxm in
the nine u_ntil about 1:15 P.-I, and do_n-at cone up until after all tho _
ndn are gone. Bocwuse I 1-.--.;s out there at different tines I do not know
nueh about what ms happening at the mine, and since I did not go to -
Union meetings I do not know nuch about ":E*.~.t happened there an-ongthe _
non. As f' .I' as I lmov: there w::s_ no violoncent the nine. I heard that j
some of'th.;; non ~..=ere bent;-n, but I did not see any. The beatings and,
violence that I heard about aoourod after the strike. I did not hear
of my violence be-in; undertaken at Ffino B by !:12n'bors oi the Progressive
Kine .'.'-orkers of .-'u.1oric:1, >1" the United ne ..oo_rkers . .
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9-.Ra: JOHN L. LE-".715, ET AL H ' ' ~-"§i!§=¢*3'»'5- ' 92*_ | . 1 1-I
D-; ; "E" In
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"I was never approached by anyone in cerahecticn with -
_._{-aiming either union b-SC-.192J6 everyune knew my epipicn.
"I have read the r.'.13VO statement on this page and m'
V other pwges. It is true and accurate. V -
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4-_.{ _ IF w,&___: _ -I= _ On August 30, 1945, ' -I ,., Street, _~;1"ield| Agents we .5, / time ' v - rested t was note
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at which I
he advised that he had no er een ar .
t he was very ignorant and would make a very poor witneas. his con
reed the gtntement to him and he signed it by an "1",
- hen signed his name also to the statement, which in as Teon: '
eld, Ell"
kugust 30, 1943. _ ' ,
.11, . 1.151-1.1, 5,» ,,-nsthis free and v un a -~ ent tc -,_-1.3r-
who are known to me to bo Special Agents of the edernl Bureau -' ves
gation, U.S. Department of Justice. Ho threats or promises have been made
me. '
I waa born H Aw ,, '* and came to the United 3ta.telIA;-.§"l.':-""_-15:5 1:1 - _abou.-i ,_ lJ__ _ iggn ears ago I have not worked
I joined the ne inspringfield, I11. and I _
never held any union office. l
"I worked at Mine B in Springfield, I11. about Qyear! in all.
Before HM came in at Hine B UMP. got along alright with t management. KI
changed over to B-TA because all the others did and it did not make any
difference to me a I had to work to live and it didn't matter to me which
union I belonged to. No one forced me to join PEA than in 1932. I always
would join whatever union moat 01" the men belonged to. I dont know Elshoff
at all as I never saw him altho I worked for him and I don't know of any
trouble he may have had with- anyone and I don't loiow anything at all about
him or how he ran his mine. o
"I did not know of anything wrong with PMA union as they seemed to '
me to be same as U117. or other unions an it didn't matter to me which union
was in. ht the mine in 1937 we were told there was no work and we all wont
home. I don't know why there was no work and I don't know why there was I
strike. No work so everybody went hone. I never signed 33 paper for any-»
body when the mine closed in 1937. Nobody ever came to my home or saw me at
the mine about joining over to U1!-Ti from FHA. No one bothered me or threatened
me to join over. I never was at Nine B when they had gieketing or were hav-
ing the sit down strike. I never went back to Nine B at all till they opened
for good. I don't know about any UHE spies at the Mine B. Nobody ever
e bossed me there. I never voted at any National Labor Relations Board in the
Armory in Springfield, I11. I would go to BSA meetings once in a. while but
not all the times, an I never understood what was going on because I don't
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INTERVQEE ELIE understand English very well and I would go no they would -~ _
not fine mo. »-
I " - " i V "
The whistle blew when mine reopened and I went back to o
'work. Nobody wrote me nor told to go back. I went to work right amaqr as Q
room ~..'e.s alright and there was EYE felletheree I don't knee whet kins! Q!
wage scale they had when we returned to work. I was e coal digger there,
After mine B opened up I paid no dues to anyone and then latex some joined
UH?! so I joined with them hut no one forced me to join nor told ms to join.Ra: JOHN L. 125.18, RT LL '
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. iinen I went book the mine locked the same to me as it was Before
and I don't know if there were any cave-ins there or not. don't knot iauch
of what was going there as I just wanted to make a. living. I never vent to
school and don't understand things well It all lo don't know what it M15 111 t
about . ' ' V, ,.."'*
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I can not reed the English lnnguage so T have had my son read
this 1 page statement to me and it is true and right and as I can't write nq
name I have placed a cross for my name. .' ._,.u
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Fitnessea: .
".' ' Special Agent, FBI, St. Paul, llinn. t_ ' ' peoial Agent, FBI, Milwaukee, iia. 3"
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fr 5'/w ' V .77 -~
INTERVIEQ iii interviewed at he residence,. I . -
-¥
" " - "6 born in
ner sin citizen. He has been
5 presently employed at Panther Creek §inEH§$.$' to be a good potential w1cees3'h5L to en: t accent, a rather
dulled mentality, and an obnoxious appearance. as could oly recall events
which excited him..Heil
is not considered
_._.!§IE!!IlIIIIllEHIIIIIIIlll|
"Springfield, Ill. ' -
August 28, 1943.
*h~ o "sing is s signed statement * "
__mM gm [ n-so is -~§§§§i?F¥;£;H_ . I make the following statementtn
§§@§§i¥5?;§a?F-- ..nd.»$;F%?§e.e$3T3§~;, r- , who have identified themselvelri UL ' It "t Bea- me o -e Special Agents 0 the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Ho prmi
threats, or consideration of any kind has been made to me to get me to make
this stetement. I en willing, if neoessery to go to_eourt to repent this
statement.
I have been mining since - In Q52 I joined the Progressive
Kine iorkers of America. I was glad to be able to join_the Progressivesthen; I was not working at l§:1B§_B_ then, and did not go to liine E untili
I was e member of the Progressives all the time and liked that union. I am
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. -_ '7-3 -3 H;-" I:-gs};--,_§.'---':.I jjixf ' _,,- . . - a :-___,v-1 :;:¢_;!_u:_ .. '.92__;_: ,. ' " l =~r~-= '"5%I'» . "
_ . 1, Q ' ¢_§ - "ii-A,Re: Joan 1.. urszs, er 11.. A , 5'
4 10 I to :1' .. 1 _ " - _ N .., '.- 92
INTRV 1?, '1 u= or something else, but they did not work, and
' i went art
-. "1-d was named
supposed to go around minle checking
man to do that before the strihe-g ' _¢ ,b
After the strike I was asked many times to join the United line
Iorkers. I did and told the men that I would not. Joe '
with me about it in my room
and one day he hit me told me that he would kill me if I
did not quit saying things about him. Someone told me that I would have to
join the United Mine iorkers if I was going to stay and work at that mine.
I told them that I did not went to join the United Mine Yorkers, and if they
did not want me at liine B I would quit. I could have kept my job at Him Bif I had joined the United Kine 'u;orkers- promised me good
room if I would come back and join the Un e Y e o rs. '1 quit st liine
B because I did not want to jointhe United Mine iécrlcers, and wanted to-
stsy as a Progressive. _ ' '
'1 was never dissatisfied with the Progr;;s_s§:_ve_ll:ine Tiorkers. Hone
of the men in the PLUG of A treated me mean or -tlireatengd
voted in all the elections exactly es I vented to vote. _
Q
I have read the above ste..~rnent on this page and two other pages.
It. is all true and accurate and I am milling to go to court if necessary
and repeat any part of this statepents -I
92 0
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_--1&8 .__1 » ,._' V-asked me to join the United Mine Wm-1=8'Fi". fr,/V also asked me to join the United mm"
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_ ' , ' ,.. _" 'T_"" f'- . _. "" >_ 1_I?'i" ,_ V, _ _' ' H4 I! ' L? 1 "p?-:' ""' ° " "'3 131'-"5"p"u?*t*9'*9§*¥ w "'T: a -17 3'3-'-I:-» .:=,<~...=*.'t=*." < -*1.-Q . .- -1 ' .. ; '1' - - -1' 2-~-1 ~ __;;-.~.i¢.* 11 *i*-_»-;'v¬l;,;-'-"e"5L"-- . - . - . e P _~-'- -r."*-"'.- ' $4-2.-H I -" 1;». :.>:;.--."+-'-PI*~- ~ .>~. -n a . I It. ;,= f- 3?. e __'..- W . T» we "'a- H 2; _._ "'§"';;"": i -= - ' "- -* ' ?;-I . »-~;-:;-'-.'>*..1 '
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Re: JOHN L.- LE-TIS, 2': LL __' - 'A 7 "
"ITB was interviewed st doe 1lin0is-P <= A ts and - .- ugust ané___ 1943. tste e 1 not have e cr F-1-= record. v' _92vould not make e. good witness es he is uneducated end is very vegan _la ou the facts. - - ' '
K! The following statement was obtained fro b
. gm"
_ ' , ugus 31, 1943.
- I1l. mike the following voluntary statement I_ to hom I know to no Special Agents of the_ Fe =1-e u.r of nves go , no force, threats or promises have been
made in obtaining this statement and I know that that I may say may be used
in a. court cf law. _ ' '
n1 was "born if; emigrated to the U. S.in M o he -. . w c citizenship weis derived through
cone a mmbor of in _v-"hen I d 'e.=orki.. g _in e *.:='"92.._l §mine in __ Ill _ was ernolo ed at glue _'[B" in nboutg I am nor! "
92 ., err:-1'-fl 511;.-,:ii~?*-"*??I:-,.;1;_.fie<1» - _ -' " _
I have never held on office in any union.
'In 1932 I was a member of a local UMYF. The local U153", for some
unknown reason chemged to PLEA so I becime e. member of PlA.._ l
change from LTLLT looel to Pl-ii, Elshoii of I-Line '13
good relations with U!-.17."Prior to the
seemed to have been on
"Between Sept. 1952 and liey 12, 193? there were no strikes at i-
?-Zine "B" and the mine was not closed dam. l
Ho one ettom"-_~ted'to ch-tinge rue from U12? to P!-IA be:-ween Sept. 1932
" " "-;- Te '-o~: :"*..';f.""-.fj3"-,2';"?- .- ziitqgsa , - - .'."="-"'-_ og; """' I£*., _*J_If - ~.-?.: té, q'_< .1. '§;_ :_ _
Q ~' - - - - - ~ .- 1|? 7; . . .i. '5 t . e ; . 1 _.. us . A__~ if .. ",u!192; - ,_ -- 5. ~ ,_, giraf _ '~ K ; _ it_ ' ..- -J! Q L r .. .4.-_-gt; ;_f.'_T.;: §-'k- -_~»- .i ' _ :5;-tt n Vp - 44- ,1, =_-re; - g " vf L_..__ 1 ' ,lf-'92* r-1*' H WE. 1'. ' ._-_ '__.¬._.w>Ii:r; _ ; .~ __ i 5_ 1-if 4!' JJg I-.-. 2-: ,,, IN -. Tr. ¢-,..aI;_ ._ $2-{,;{:_J_ y3§l"/X1 t -r92 * E: 4. . - .-' ' -'-~~ .._~.. .~/._¢'; "' i .. - _ - 5 4. _;=..4, t.--q??;:..£e;- 9_ a '2' - -5 V--.2 -in '= . .. o " '~-Ty;-:3.l;§f.-.i-@¬§¬*i"::3f§_9:*»q$@ ..{Z2§%.,.,-. .RB: JOHN L. LE-T15, ET L é ' -'$;-m,j:_92 .92,.'.:_i;_':__,_§l;*-ew J '1 Q in 1 "';__""__i%: . s rss A ' . u . _~'. I- '15,. . "is;-» e- .. ' wt ».92. 1* YD . - . , F 92- . ' "1
Imnvx a '1 do .0; remember s mm" picket line at um. *3 seeded" ;.,;j.-' .13 Sept. use we Hay 12, 1931 nor an 1* . my literature "Z "~
Icbntinuedf being distributed at the mine. y __ -. ._. , .-_
' "F0 one attempted to contort from F11 to prior to lief 12} I -
J _ ' . ' _ - V '_ I "1. __é._';. J?
"I never sew any officials oi IN? associating with the llensgement H
of Mine "B". - I '
"'l.-'vuun.4|IIb - - ,
92 '* I
I never heard about a wage scale controversy in the Spring of 1957.I .
_ . . ,>-
"I did not attend a meeting of PMA on the night of Hay ll, 1987. _.
I do not romber if I received notice of such a. meeting or not. 1
"01-1 about ray 12, 1937 I went to work as usual, someone told me th0_
mine was on strike so I returned home. I do not know wliy the strike I!-I _
called as-no one told me. _ __
"I do not recall. signing any petitions in the summer of 1937.
~ "I know nothing of the formation of a mm local in the Sumner of
1937. -
i Sometime in Sept. 1937 FMA advised me that Mine YB 630 open.
On going to the mine I was toid by someone I could not work, but no reason
was given. I acted as s voluntary Phil picket from time to time from Sept."
1937 to sometime in Fov. 193'? when cm injunction was obtained to prevent the
picketing. All the pkcets were miners at Mine "3'._,_,_.-
"I do not know the attitude of the miners of Mine "B" concerning the
uni I
- r n-4injunct ion. ' 92
"Sometime in December 193'? I voted in the NLRB election for P}-13..
So for es I know the election was fair and no violence took place during tne"election. ' ' ' '
"I think I obtained s position at 3-iine 'A" in the lest pert of
1937 and dropped all interest in Fine "B". I cannot furnish any information
subsequent to the last part of 195'? concerning Ifine B'. During the tine '
I was employed at I-Fine "IL" it was not owned by Elahoffe . . ' '.
. ; 92 1 . _
"I am at the present a member of I!-{A and consider it s good union. -.
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= JOHHL LE'TIS,E'1'LL
_ 92 F A
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' 92
WITH I have had the four pages of this statement read to In '
and the statement is true and correct to the belt o.f_
my knowledge» _ _ --
t %<¥t*====~=> t L
"5i.tnened :- _ 6 _I 2S Special Agent - F.B.I. signed! 67
peoia1 Agent, F-B.I.I nign9d!
92;
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JOEII L. lens, er u.
m _ _ _ _ "~ .92' WIRPEEIVIHT WITH The follow tigation In conducted 5 ?
X Agent: and t I R Q Illinois on 511! e -Va .-__ _"'!a/#4-.-_ :*--,-~~- :7 ;.3r;-7!,7,|;~- er-.?-._-2-_,-_._92, m-.»..; V -..,: z. _:_ ___ _ I, I T d _ -i H - _ I3 ' ' ' ' "1:~ 1. 5* '92 ' " . -» ""' "¢' -~ 1 -IL,"--"" '..¢--" =."'- . Z; -r
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9292 After making nu-iouli _ - I . oeatedq F,-. _ Y not Qt hie residence, -A - Illino |, e . ."' 1 | 1 , ' ' - 1:9292;;92¬$ he a ea hae never been arre e _ ' 2 V
Q - It is felt that Enema make 1 res; witnen it eanee.
N Q _gave agents following eigned statement
I.
3: _:_. _
.1
l3.7T".e~ free and volunt <
who are known to me to be Specit '*
and, me.
l gation, U. S. Department of Justice. No force or premise: have been
made me t
'1 --"'T:9 .
er! *_o give this statement,
__:§__,__gt I wee burr. ;¢;_ and om to U. Se when about and boos-no a en r many years ago. Iworked -g" at I= e = in Springfield, Ill., for abou "years and uit there about_.0 in Jan.wand am now working at the in éllle
*1 first joined the um union in 111. when I was about
__ years
&!é'"-13$ Mine B I
meetings
_ Progress
g say they
trouble oti..,. .;_
92"-= ..'.-. ' ...92'92
rat: = re
-
<S "3''1: ;_._..'r.- 4._-*'-ed.. _. - -.a r _*' ..old and I never we held any union o oe. When I- - - - - 3had to join F111 again and it was around in _ and
I know Elehoff and U11? got along together. I never attendedstarted it
as fa as
their »
so don*t know much about it. In 1932 I wanted to go to the
ivee because I knew we would get better treatment and I still
are better than Ul. I was helping on e. farm when that '
ame so didn't know much about those matters. There never wan
any trouble between P115. and Carl Elehofi between 1932 and the time tin
etrike started that I know of. We PE!» miners felt that the PEA officials
were doing pretty good for ui miners. I only attended. a few meeting!
between 1932 and the tine the mine eloeeri down, and was not aotive in-
k , the FHA affairs. he far ea I know everything was alright at the
31- *5 Kine B prior to 195?. I don't know nothing about the PITA men being
convicted for the bombings. I think PI-1A officials were running the -union money affair; alright and I was well eatiefied. I never heard i .
r» of any gtckete or ayflng 43159 wrong between INF? and P11 prior to the H'. . time the mine p}Q§_e;!'. z §o:}'t know of am partial being given by
I1
-I ¥92._ "" -"- 5 - - ; I. , -: Eleho fee were told about the wage eon- tract except we 921ere$}§::2oeai:;o "g;e,t _Il£_!Z,1n_qre {or 13 daye but never got .~
it. I don't know argq§_B_in' a__bo*u§ ;c:;g11tr_a9jte, I attenderi 6111?about we meeting! m;;er;",j=;»eee~ee-*AAe'F,re;_r tee tr 5.31»? ell of M miner--.4 J A 1" ' r-~ " '_92 _ .,_ .. _, 1. I 1-,' F
, " ;._,i
.-Q
con!1nu!
3,.-,-J--Q-.»»» e
_, O
"H5413
RE: JOHN L. LEWIS, ET AL
/Q 7c:/ J4-71>
A .-* ?
except e few] hrs letiified with thePro;fn|ivea.
I don't recall of n eciplaint being made an pay
days over eui IagO§4__Iefore the ltrile I es contetted
in the mine leveral time! that I lhodld living over to
and that I would k ore wages er obnditiona would be better. ATheir n£=:r.es were both but I Outt recall their lebt names at 1111
They never_threetened mo a all. I heft? heard why lino 5 would notsign a contract with PEA I dont knew anything about the meetingithetwas held the t be ore the ltrike but I beliege it tel I a eciemeeting we told me about it but did not go in 1
w 'l' 0 n to Q Htrlk th r A I no and I ft did not kno 5" --= ~;. g 1 i ' e B 6 t i O
my tools and things all there; was told that the strike was bed be-cause the Mine B men would not fir? some expelled men and the ltrikl In!
not over any wage question. I don t know anything about the Carl being
loaded short. .INTERVIEW WITH
"At the mine 3 or 4 times I signed something but I just don't
know whet it was but I knew it was in favor of PIA that I ligned for
and I did not sign up them for UMH. I hover was contacted to join anyDIM local in 1937, and I don't know anything about it: I recall that Iwent out to ine 3 once or twice wheg they tried to reopen but I don t
recall whet happened or how I leerne about it. I stayed at line B n
few nights when they bed e sit down ltrik . I was not forced to butdid not bring in any outside miner! st all and just the local wet there
and the Sheriff and his men. I me helping on farms then too IO was _
not very active at all in tho! nnttef! and I never paid much ettention
to whet was going on. I voted twide for NLRB elections and I voted .
EMA both times. I signed over to WM? because I had to in order to M
my job and I still liked FHA and voted for them both times. As fer at i
I lcncm the elections themselves rs!-s lright and they were by secret 'ballot ab I recall. I did not go betk to "ins 3 When they tried to I
open it again after the NLRB eletlb the first time. I don't knowwhy Elshoff would not sign the PM? ips most of us were Pm. During
fell of 1939 I received e letter rom »_ne B end they told me
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