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Accession no.
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Form -3
W
Date received
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Form A Federal Writers' Project
Circumstances of Interview Works Progress Administration
OREGON FOLKLORE STUDIES
Name of worker Walker Winslow
Address 206? SF Park. Portland. Oran*
Subject Rut* pfe in the 1870's
Date Deeember 15. 2938
Name and address of informant
Miss Nettie foencer
2071 OW Park, Portland. Oregon
Date and time of interview Afternoon of December 14, 1938, and neat day.
Place of interview Kitchen 9f Miss Spencer's home.
Name iind address of person, if any, who put you in touch with informant
NY landlady
Name and address of person, if any, accompanying you
Description of room, house, surroundings, etc.
old, and someahat shabby building of the last century and its conversion into an
apartment house has done some straige things to the original design.. The part
occupied by Miss Spencer is on the third story and consists of two bed rooms, a
living room, kitchen, and a storeroom. There seems to be no particular design
to her housekeeping other than to have a myriad of mementos of her travels
always within reach. The kitchen, which serves as her living room nest of the
time, is stacked with clippings that have interested her, as well as books,
pictures, documents and all the twine, wrapping paper, etc. that a single woman
of her years can collect. This, however, does not mean that the lady is impover-
ished for such is not the case. 'Her surroundings are the ones that beat suit her
(Use as many additional sheets as necessary, each bearing the proper heading
and the number to which the material refers).
W 13912
Form A Gont'd. 2
busy life and keep her close to the parts of the past which she loves. Interior
decoration with her is a thing of the mdnd, and not the home, and the arrange-
ment of a clipping that recalls some event is more significant than that of a
ohair in contrast to a couch. The home is clean but not neat, in the ordinary
sense. She has another elderly lady to do her housework and cooking.
Form B Cont'd. 2
Elias Brawn died on the trip and left Miss Spencer's mother a widow with four
children, one of Alm, J. Henry Brown, became a historian of Oregon. The
family settled at Salem and Thomas Cox opened a store in the village of ten
houses. The mother earned a living by braiding strew hats for the men, and
making clothing. Late in 1849 she took up a claim south of Salem and in
1851 married Hiram Allen, who died in 1858 leaving her with a total of
eight children. In 1859 she married George Spencer and bore him one child,
the subject of this interview. Miss Spencer's mother, at the time of her
death in 1888, bad eight living children, 22 grandchildren and 10 great
grandchildren.
2. Miss Spencer was born on the land elide south of Salem, and she will not
give the date; it wasn't over a hundred or so years ago, she says. Fanny,
as oan be seen from above, is the thing that Miss Spencer has most of. She
is a spinster.
3. It would take two weeks to get the places and dates of residence from Miss
Spencer, for she has covered Europe and the Orient, as well as all of America,
X
and is blessed with an extraordinary memory for details.
4
5. Public Schools of Salon and Corvallis, and O.S.C.
6. Teacher.
7. Teacher, but Miss Spencer is adept at most of the arts, and is interested
in everything. At the time of this interview she was wondering how to rid
the world of Hitler.
8. Miss Spencer is something of a Joiner, but I do not gather that she attends
church with any frequency, and then has no particular choice. She is President
of the Woman's Press Club, a small group of free -lanes writers, and is inter-
ested in various other groups, Shakespear, etc. The W.C.T.U. finds a staunch
supporter in her, and she has written at length on temperance. Peace is also
a subject she finds of interest.
Form B
Conti& 3
9. Miss Spencer is a small woman with none of the dryness of appearance usually
seen in old maids, and although she must be well past seventy she wears her
years well and shows that she was something of a beauty in her day. She
does not go in for fine clothes and she says that her nieces and nephews
have despaired of her long ago as a well dressed woman. She dresses for
comfort, and as I interviewed her she had her feet in the oven and made no
pretense at any of the so-called social nioeties. She is a little hard of
hearing, but her ability to hear seems to increase with her interest in
what is being said, and so one can believe that the malady is something of
a convenience. It is in keeping with her character that it should be, for
she has, in her long life, held to the goal of the highest interest and
for that reason was never married, although she had opportunity. Looking
back she can't believe that she made a mistake. She wonted to educate
herself and travel; both of which she did. The men she could have married
all were respectable citizens who were hounded by bad luok, and as she has
looked over the wives that survive them she finds herself without regret.
10. Ries Spencer mould make a good biograpby for an interested person, and she
has her family at her finger tips. Among her scattered documents there
night be some things that are of interest to the Historical Records SurVyy.
Also she is a very good source of introduction to interesting people, and
a cooperative person. She has many photographs of the "early days".
Form C Federal Writers' Project
Text of Interview (Unedited) Works Progress Administration
OREGON FOLKLORE STUDIES
Name of worker
Address
Subject
Walker Winslow
2069 SW Park, Portland, Oregon
Rural Life in the 1870's
Datepecember 15, 1938
Name and address of informant Miss Nettie Spencer
Text:
2071 SW Park. Portland. Oregin
I was one of a large family, as you know from the biographical material
I gave you, and so I was pretty busy just keeping out of the way and going to
school. I can't remember anything special about the school but I do remember a
lot of things about home and our clothes. All of our shoes were made by a man
who °mac around every so often and took our foot measurements with broometramw,
which he broke off and tagged for the foot length of each member of the family.
The width didn't make any difference and you could wear either shoe on either
foot; for a long time, too, for the shoes wore well. Mother carded her own wool
and washed it with soap she made herself. She even made her awn lye from wood
ashes, and when she got the cloth finished she made her own dye. Black was
made from burnt logs and brawn from the hulls of black walnuts. I think she
got her green from copper, and peach leaves made the yellow. The red dye was
made from leaves she bought. The dresses were very full and lasted entirely
too long. Our styles weren't as bad as the men's though, for they took a
blanket, out a hole in the middle of it, stuck their necks through and had an
overcoat. They looked like ingeneous Indians. One of the things I remember
most as a little girl were the bundle peddlers who came around. They had bundles
made up and you bought them as they were for a set price. I remember that some
(Use as many additional sheets as necessary, each bearing the heading given
above).
Form 0. Contld. 2
sold for as high as $150. In these bundles were all sorts of wonderful things
that you didn't get in the country very often; fancy shawls and printed goods;
silks and such other luxuries. It MIA a great day when the family bought a
bundle.
Our food was pretty plain most of the time and we didn't have any
salads like they do now. The menu for a fine dinner would be: Chicken stew
with dumplings, mashed potatoes, peach preserves, biscuits, and hominy. We
raised carrots for the stook but we never thought of eating them. Grandfather
was eating peaches in St. Joe, Missouri, before he came West and forgot and put
a peach pit in his pocket and left it there all through the trip. It was a
variety that was later named after him and became famous. We had cobbler often.
It 1111.8 made by putting biscuit dough on stewed fruit and baking it. Dumplings
were another staple. They were dough, like the bisouits and made to go with
everything that had enough juice to boil them in. We didn't have any jars to put
up preserves in, like they do now, but we used earthen crocks instead. The
fruit to be preserved was boiled with brown sugar we never saw white sugar
and when we did we used it as candy and then put in the jars which were
covered with cloth that was then coated with beeswax. Another good cover was
a bog bladder they were the best. Sometimes -se had molasses pulls and once
in a great while we would have some real strips& candy. That was a treat%
Most of our medicine was homemade too aid I think I can remember some of
the old standbys. There was an awful lot of ague chills and fever and it
came, they said, from turning up new soil. Almost every pioneer immunity has
had it. For that we used patent medicine mostly, but the standard was goose
grease and turpentine. It was supposed to cure every thing. It was all you
could smell in a sohoolroon. Of course the old fashion mustard plaster was a
standard remedy, and then there were the teas. We had a tea for everything and
Form C. Cont'd.
3
most of the herbs could be picked on the place. Tansy tea was 0120 I saw a
tangy patch down the block yesterday and sullen tea was another that was
used for asthma and bronahial trouble. Sage tea was used for the measles.
Soft-soap or bread and milk poultices were used on boils. There MUA a lot of
scarlet fever because of the poor sanitary conditions, and a lot of children
died of what we *ailed Putrid sore throat --diphtheria. I never heard of a
dentist when I was a little girl and my grandfather had the only false teeth
in. the oountry side and was a ouriousity beoause of than. The plates were
made of gold. Mother had some plates made and didn't like than so had than
melted up into rings for the children. I had a ring until just recently and
I think that I let it go with a bunch of old gold I sold so as to get it out
of the way and into circulation. There wasn't much social life on the farm and I
didn't pay any attention to it until I was older and moved into Salem and
Corvallis. .The churches didn't have any young peoples rganisations and they
l')
were dead serious with everything. Sermons lasted for hours and you could
smell the hell fire in than. We never had church suppers or the like until
way past my time. The only social thing about the church was the camp meetings.
That was where most of the courting was done. When a boy would get old enough
for a wife the father would let him use the horse and buggy for a trip to the
camp meeting to get him a wife.
The Babtist Churoh, of the hardshell variety, in the far away country
places were typical of the period. In them they preached hell -fire, fore-
ordination and damnation once a month. The meetings were held in the country
school house. The Reverend Cranfield in speaking of foreordination set forth
the idea that unborn infants were condemned to hell. He propounded his solemn
belief that there were infants in hell not a span long.
The style of delivery was unique, high pitched, strained, almost a
shout with an ending of the words with Uhl. Good english was absent because
Form C. Conted. 4
of the lack of education. *Ah God, Ah well, Ah all evil doers, ah*, was the
vogue, There were no song books so the minister would recite the words of a
song two lines at a time; some doleful hymn such as 'Hark from the tomb a
doleful sound'. This was sung in the quavering sopranos of the musically
erring sisters; some of them singing in a double air roared above the bellow-
ing brethren. It was an assortment of inharmony.
During the vary long and lurid prayer the congregation knelt on the
dirty school room floor. The prayer IMA delivered with vehemence and in a
voice loud enough to reach the vault of Heaven. This warranted God's not
turning a deaf ear. Vehement were the 'Amens' from the over -wrought kneelers
until some excitable soul ended in *Glory, Glory*, with shouts and hand clapping.
This high state of joy, with repeated *Praise the Lord", was shouted while the
men chewed and spit in the sand -box under the stove, and the mothers rooked
their babies in their arms to keep then quiet.
Most of these people oamm to church on foot over the muddy roads.
The ones who come by wagon used a hay -rack, and mother and father sat in a
chair at the front while the children were churned about in the straw strewn
in the wagon bed.
Most of the women folks wore calieo and linsey-woolsey, the latter
still made in their hones in Oregon (1871), and the men often wore jeans. The
little girls in particular yore sun -bonnets and shakers. Old ladies wore lace
cape under their sun -bonnets; some of the better class were very prettily
frilled with lace and lavender ribbons it not in this country community
that I an describing.
After a long service *meting* WMA out, and neighbors had a grand
hand -shaking party, and than families often invited other families to dinner.
This crude church, located where Alfred Station now is on the Southern Pncifio
Railwiy, a few wiles north of Harrisburg, which then was a small village, was
Form C. Cont'd. 5
the only public gathering place, except perhaps on the Fourth of July, when
families went en mass, with shiny new shoes to Corvallis, to "the Celebration".
In Corvallis, about 1873, the Methodist Episcopal, the Southern
Methodist Episcopal, and the Presbyterian churches were very nice buildings,
with painted paws and better dressed people, and the ministers were educated.
The only libraries in vogue were the Sunday School books. Even the district
school did not have any. It was after this date that the Oregon State College
had a library.
The games played were: ante over, crack the whip, base, hide and
seek, tag, ring around the rosie.
In town it was different, but I MA something of a young lady when
I went there (Corvallis). We had lots of surprise parties and gave them on
any occasion, we could think of. At them we would play all of the old American
games and sing. Everyone sang in duets, sextets and quartets, and there were
singing schools every place. Some of the songs I remember were, Gypsies
Warning, Empty Chair, Brooklyn Theatre, Only a Pansy Blossom. Those singing
schools were pitch fightsof voices and there was a lot of jealousy. W• also
had Writing Schools for penmanship. Some of the writing they did then was
beautiful and there was a lot of competition in it. We had theatricals too,
for there weren't any traveling companies aid we had to take their place.
The big event of the year was the Fourth of July. Everyone in the
countryside got together on that day for the only time in the year. The new
babies were shown off, and the now brides who mould be exhibiting babies next
year. Everyone would load their wagons with all the food they could bawl and
come to town early in the morning. On our first big Fourth at Corvallis mother
made two hundred gooseberry pies. You can see what an event it was. There
would be floats in the morning end the one that got the girl's eye was the
Fora C. Cont'd. 6
Goddess of Liberty. She was supposed to be the most wholesale(' and prettiest girl
in the owmatryside if she wasn't she had friends who thought she was. But
the rest of us weren't always in agreement on that. She rode on a hay -rack and
wore a white gown. Sometimes the driver wore an Uncle UK hat and striped
pants. All along the sides of the hay -rack were little girls who represented
the states of the union. The smallest was always Rhode Island. till this
took place at Corvallis and the people from Albany used to come up river by
boat.) Following the float mould be the Oregon.Agricultural College cadets, and
somekind of a band. Sometimes there would be political effigies.
Just before lunch and we'd always hold lunch up for an hour some
Senator or lawyer would speak. These speeches always had one pattern. First
the speaker would challenge England to a fight and berate the King sad say that
he was a skunk. This WAA known as twisting the lion's tail. Then the next
theme was that any one -could find freedom and liberty on our shores. The
speaker would invite those who were heavy laden in other lands to come to us
and find peace. The speeches were pretty fiery and by that time the men who
drank got into fights and called each other Englishman. In the afternoon we
had what no called the 'plug ugliest funny floats and clowns who took off
on the political subjects of the day. There would be some music and than the
families would start gathering together to go home. There were cows waiting
to be milked and the stock to be fed and so there was no night life. The
Fourth was the day of the year that really counted then. Christmas wasn't much;
a Church tree or somethiric, but no one twisted the lion's tail.
There weren't any young womens clubs that I remember of. If we put
on a play or anything the organization was just for that and was spontaneous.
Young lawn in Oregon didn't play much of a role in oonmnnity life unless they
were being courted. Our favorite magazines were Godey's,Peterson's and the
Form C. Cont'd. 7
Bazaar. Later we had the Delineator. Years later I saw the covers of the old
Godey's magazine selling in Paris for a great price, and they tell me that
people in high-olass hones now use them as prints on the walls. All they
memat in those days was that Oregon stores were two years behind with the
styles. Speaking of prints! We used to get chromes with subscriptions to
papers, and we didn't have to work out an intelligence test as you do now.
Some of them were pretty but I have seen farm houses where they covered one
whole side of the room with them solid. Recently I saw a picture in the paper
of a well known pioneer woman holding up a little statue of Dickens her grand-
father was supposed to have brought across the plains. If he did he must have
sent west for it, for I bought one of a peddler when I was a girl. That was
our art then. The head got knocked off the statue I have but it is around
someplace.
After I had gone to the Agricultural College for two years I went
out and taught at a summer school in the country, for three months for eighty
dollars. It was enough to pay my tuition the rest of the way through. I
boarded with the parents of the children and it was pretty rough board some-
times. After I graduated I taught in Portland and roomed at the home of Judge
C. B. Bellinger. I got fifty dollars a month to start, and then was raised to
sixty. I think I INUA getting seventy-five when the depression of ninetywthree
hit, and they out us 20 twice. It was a bad depression, but everyone had their
A
own gardens and didn't go hungry.
I left Oregon soon after this and went to Europe, where I taught school
for several years.
Mother was an uneducated momuuLtut she was bitterly opposed to super-
stition. When she was a girl she lived in Illinois, where the Irish were build..
4
ing the canal, and they were so superstitious that she never forgot them. For
Form C. Cont'd. 8
that reason she didn't encourage any talk about superstition around the house.
I remember I was horrified when the neighbor boys said that witches had been
riding our horses because there was electricity in the air and the horse's manes
were curly. Theme same ohildran also said that any one who had their hair burnt
across the front was in league with witches even a girl who had bangs.
One thing mother used to say that has stuck with me, and she didn't
believe it and I don't either, is that we children would have good luck if by
accident we put some of our clothes on backwards. To this der I have a hard
time bringing myself to change anything I have put on baokwards and I can't
recall that I here ever had any great luok as a result. It is just one of
those things from childhood that clings in spite of anything. None of our
family had any time for superstition.
There were a great many sayings in those days, but I can't recall
any now but the ones we all knew mid they aren't important. Professor Berchtold,
a grand old man, once spoke to me about a book of sayings he was oollecting.
Be had been collecting them for years. I think you could get in touch with him
through the Oregon State College, although he is retired now. I remember that
he said that America was too young to have many sayings of its awn. You could
mrite him if you vented to and I would give you an introduction.
Form D Federal Writers' Project
Extra Comment Works Progress Administration
OREGON FOLKLORE STUDIES
Name of worker Walker Winslow ,Date December 15,. 1938
Address 2069 SW Park._ Portland, Oregon
Subject Rural Life in the 1870's.
Name and address of informant Miss Nettie Spencer
2071 SW Parks Portland, Oregon
Comment:A careful study of Miss Spencer's anoestry, their pioneering instincts
and forceful traits, is furthered by the knomledge that in her these qualities
are not lost. AA a girl she decided against marriage and in favor of travel
and independence. She got thee just as she planned and did what would have
balked Emmy a stronger appearing person. She told me something of her experi-
ences in India, and they were such that one can marvel at the woman who went
through them, and who now laughs at them. Too, Mist Spencer is no mean artist
and *bile in India she painted in natural oolor all of the native flowers.
Her main reason for doing this was because a camera could not catch the
reality of the bloom. The paintings, which she has preserved, show a fine
capability. AA a character study it might be worth, while to interview her
further. However, she has little more to contribute along folk lines. She
will be on the lookout for further subjeot for this interviewer, or others.
It MAA through her that I got in touch with Mr. Hmapton (see Hampton interview).
(Use as many additional sheets as necessary, each bearing the heading given
above).