UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

Page 1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA CASE NO.: 08-CIV-80119-MARRA/JOHNSON JANE DOE NO. 2, Plaintiff, -vs- JEFFREY EPSTEIN, Defendant. Related cases: 08-80232, 08-08380, 08-80381, 08-80994, 08-80993, 08-80811, 08-80893, 09-80469, 09-80591, 09-80656, 09-80802, 09-81092 VIDEOTAPED COMPULSORY MEDICAL EVALUATION OF JANE DOE NO. 6 Monday, November 23,,2009 9:18 - 5:29 p.m. 250 Australian Avenue Suite 1500 West Palm Beach, Florida 33401 Reported By: Cynthia Hopkins, RPR, FPR Notary Public, State of Florida Prose Court Reporting Services Becton PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. ns (601461-976-2534) b5cb7 EFTA00723681 EFTA00723682 Pace .- 1 APPEARANCES: 2 On behalf of the Plaintiff: , 3 JESSICA D. ARBOLR, ESQUIRE MERMELSTEIN & HOROWITZ, P.A. 4 18205 Biscayne Boulevard Suite 2218 5 Miami, Florida 33160 Phone: 305.931.2200 E mail: [email protected] 6 7 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ALSO PRESENT: Dr. Ryan Hall, M.D. Sascha Quimby, Videographer Visual Evidence, Incorporated 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 right? A. Uh-huh. Q. Okay. This is not an endurance competition. And I know your lawyer has mentioned this to you too, ifs going to be a long day, but at any tine if you need to take a break, smoke a cigarette, get some water, use the restroom, not a problem. We usually break at around noon-ish, one-ish to get some lunch and then well come back. We'll be doing some testing throughout the day too. We may break that up in between kind of the talking. All right. Any questions, comments, concerns before we start? A. (Witness shakes head.) Q. No. Okay. In general, I will kind of start with your background and go forward. Sometimes I will ask for dates that may be hard to remember the exact date. A. Yeah. Q. Feel free to ballpark. Just kind of let me know, around, I think, roughly. If I need anything more specific, we'll try and narrow it down. A. Okay. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 '25 Page 3 EXAMINATION THE VIDEOORAPHER: You're all set, Doctor. DR. HALL: All right. Thank you. BY DR. HALL: Q. Okay. And you're going to be filling this stuff out yourself, so — I think they just started the camera, so again I will introduce myself. My name is Dr. Hall. I have been asked to see you in regards to a lawsuit. So this is what we call a forensic independent medical evaluation. Anything you tell me may end up in my report. And I think a copy goes to your lawyer, the lawyers who retained me which are representing Mr. Epstein, the judge may or may not read it, I don't know exactly how all that works But just so you're aware whatever you tell me could end up in the report Usually when we see a doctor, there is the expectation of confidentiality. It doesn't apply to this situation. All right. Also, 1 am not going to be taking on treatment responsibilities for you. So, I am not going to be treating you, making recommendations, seeing you in the future. All Page 5 1 Q. So, for example I ask about how old your 2 parents are, I have been getting a lot of, well, I 3 think they're in their early 50s. That's good 4 enough. 5 A. Parents do not talk about their age very much 6 and you forget after a while. • 7 Q. After a while, yeah. This is being 8 recorded as you know so I would ask that you speak 9 10 A. Okay. 11 Q. So the transcriptionist can hear you. 12 A. I am a little nervous so. 13 Q. I tatderstand, and we'll just kind of take 14 our time and go slow and see how things go. 15 A. All right. 16 Q. Before I start, your name again is? 17 A. Jane Doe No. 6. 18 Q. Doe. Okay, just making sure I am seeing 19 who I thought I was. When were you born? 20 A. Vineland, New Jersey. 21 Q. Violent, New Jersey? 22 A. V-i-n-el-a-n-d. 23 Q. Vineland, New Jersey. Okay. What is your 24 date of birth? 25 A. 9/3/90. I2 (Pages 2 to 5) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC... Electronically signed by cynthls hopkIns (601.0614764934) blkb74313-claea-4bc1-a5eb46350b265754 EFTA00723683 Page 6 1 Q. Okay. All right. Were there any problems 2 with your birth? Were you born early, born late, 3 premature, did you need to stay in the hospital 4 after you were born? 5 A. I don't think so. I think I was jaundiced, 6 but that's it. 7 Q. No time in the what we would call the 8 pediatric intensive care unit — 9 A. No. 10 Q. — or neonatal? Born in a hospital? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Okay. Did you meet your normal kind of 13 developmental milestones such as like walking and 14 talking and — 15 A. (Witness nods head.) 16 Q. Any significant childhood illnesses? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Can you tell me about your parents? 19 A. My dad is from Cuba. My mom was born here, 20 but was raised in Puerto Rico. 21 Q. Okay. 22 A. She moved to New Jersey when she was an early 23 teen. My dad moved — came when he was like ten, came 24 to New Jersey, and my parents met when they were like 25 20. 1 that and we don't ask. 2 Q. Was there ever any instances of domes! is 3 violence between your mother and your father? 4 A. (Witness shakes head.) 5 Q. And again to the best of your knowledge 6 was there ever any concern that one of them may have 7 been having an affair or being inappropriate? 8 A. No. When they split up, they, you know, I 9 guess, curiosity, they went their separate ways and you 10 'mow but — 11 Q. But while they were living together — 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. — and once they've been back together, 14 there's been no issues of that? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Okay. 17 A. During their separation is when they -- 18 Q. May have dated others? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Okay. And you think the separation was. 21 has only been for two or three months? 22 A. I'm not sure — 23 Q. That's the ballpark area. 24 A. I'm not really sure because their divorce 25 like, you know, strung out for a long time. Page 7 1 Q. Okay. 2 A. I want to say around there. 3 Q. What ethnic background do you consider 4 yourself? 5 A. Pm Puerto Rican and Cuban. 6 Q. Okay. 7 A So Spanish, Hispanic 1 guess. 8 Q. Okay. Did your parents marry? 9 A. Yeah. 10 Q. Okay. How long have they been married, or 11 any divorces or it's hard to tell nowadays. 12 A. Well, they got divorced in '96 or in '97 13 something. But they are still together. They are going 14 on 25 years I think. 15 Q. Okay. 16 A. Because my brother is 23, and they waited a 17 couple of years to have a child so — 18 Q. Okay. And how old are you? 19 A. I'm 19. 20 Q. Nineteen. Okay. So, they are divorced 21 but still living in the same house? 22 A. Yes. They, they only separated for a couple 23 of months but moved back in together after the divorce. 24 Q. Do you know why they separated? 05====== ikti vara ey don't usually tell kids stuff Mee Page 1 Q. Okay. 2 A. Like a year or something but — 3 Q. Okay. 4 A. They were in and out of each other's lives I 5 guess. 6 Q. Okay. Were you living with therm at the 7 time? . 8 A. Yeah. I was living with my mom and I would go 9 see my dad on weekends. 10 Q. Okay. How old were you when this 11 happened? 12 A. Like six, seven, around that area. 13 Q. Was this hard on you or... 14 A. I still sec both my parents. It was hard on 15 my dad, but that's why they got back together. He 16 wanted to see us more. 17 Q. How old is mom? 18 A. My mom is 45. 19 Q. Okay. And how old is dad? 20 A. My dad's 45 and he will be 46 in January. 21 Q. Mom in good physical health? 22 A. (Witness nods head.) 23 Q. Any history or any problems of psychiatric 24 issues or see a therapist, counselor? 2 5 A. No, I don't think so. 3 (Pages 6 to 9) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Ebotronically signed by cynthis bobbins (6014614764934) b5cb743b-doe6.4bc1-a5eb-16350b255754 EFTA00723684 Page 10 1 Q. What's mom do for a living? 2 A. My mom was an insurance agent, but since 3 everything, you know, slowed down, she lost her job. 4 Q. Sorry to hear that. 5 A. Since the economy has slowed down and stuff, 6 she lost her job, you know. 7 Q. Right Sony. No. I said I am sorry to hear she lost her job. 9 A. Oh, I thought you couldn't hear me, sorry. 10 Q. That's all right. 11 A. Yeah. 12 Q. Okay. How is she doing with being 13 unemployed? 14 A. She's started filling out job applications and 15 stuff, but unemployment gave her an extension so she's 16 trying. 17 Q. Okay. So, she's looking for work? 18 A. Yeah. 19 Q. What's dad do? 20 A. My dad is a construction worker. He works a 21 loader. 22 Q. Okay. Is that stable employment or has he 23 also been affected by the downturn? 24 A. Yeah. He's on and off. They, the most recent 25 work he had to leave to North Carolina. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 12 Q. You mentioned a brother, how many siblings do you have? A. I have one brother. He's 23. Q. Okay. All right. And what's he up to? A. Lost I guess you could say. He is still living at my mom's house so"— Q. Okay. A. You know, brothers and sisters don't really get along so we don't really talk. He does his own thing and — Q. How is his physical health right now? A. He's fine. Just doesn't want to go to school or is finding himself. Q. And any psychiatric problems? A. No. Q. The extended family aunts, uncles. cousins, things like that, grandparents, any with any significant medical history? A. What do you mean as medical history as in like mental history — Q. Usually I ask the mental separate but cancers? A. Okay. Q. Heart failure? A. Yeah. My, my grandma, my dad's mom she died Page 11 Q. Okay. A. And there is no work down here but since he came back, he's been back for like two weeks now and he hasn't had no work. 5 Q. Okay. Is he in good health? A. I don't know. My dad is like, the last time 7 he's been to the doctor was like the 80's. You know, he 8 doesn't believe in somebody sicking him with a needle or 9 something, so he doesn't go to doctors. 10 Q. Okay. 11 A. But he won't get sick a lot or, youlasow, I 12 have -- so I would say looking at him, you know. 13 Q. So, you're not aware of any health 14 problems - 15 A. Yeah, no. 16 Q. -- like high blood pressure — 17 A. No, no? 18 Q. or diabetes or cancer — 19 A. Yeah, no. 20 Q. or anything like that? Has he had any 21 history of any psychiatric problems? 22 A. No. 23 Q. And never saw a therapist, counselor, or 24 been on medicines? 25 A. (Witness shakes head.) -.-1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 13 of breast cancer. So the girls in my family have on my dad's side a risk of getting breast cancer. My grandfather or my, my mom's dad, he had diabetes and yeah, he died last year. No, actually this might have been early this year. But he was in a nursing home for a while. They knew, you know that, you know, he had a problem, that it wasn't, it was getting to be his end. But my grandma had high blood pressure and she died from a heart attack. Q. Is that morn's dad with the breast cancer? A. My mom's -- Q. Mom's mother? A. No. My, my dad's mom has had breast cancer. Q. Okay. A. And then my mom's parents are deceased. Q. Okay. A. And that's her dad had diabetes and my, her room had high blood pressure. Q. Okay. And passed away from a heart attack? A. Yes. Q. Okay. A. And my uncle has now - he is still living. He has sorosis of the liver, but it's from a bad blood transfusion in the early Ws or something. 4 (Pages 10 to 13) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Electronically signed by cynthia hopkIns (601-0514064934) bleb74 ae6-4bc t-a5ob 16350b255Y54 EFTA00723685 Page 14 3. Q. Okay. And again, if you know, that's 2 tune, if you don't know that's okay too. I am 3 guessing Hepatitis C though? 4 A. Yeah. 5 Q. Okay. And then the next question, anybody 6 in the family have any history of any mental health 7 problems? 8 A. I don't think so. My cousin tried to, I 9 guess, eat a bottle of aspirin or something one time 10 but — 11 Q. Okay. 12 A. — you know, she's just a distant cousin 13 but — 14 Q. And just to make sure I understand this, 15 she wasn't like three at the time and just got into 16 it? 17 A. No. 18 Q. This was — 19 A. She was 19, I think. 20 Q. Okay. 21 A. About, that's all because my aunt and uncles 22 are very Christian and, you know, so... 23 Q. Okay. 24 A. I don't think so. My mom gets headaches but 25 she's get a prescription from that. She works at a Page 16 1 you know. I know that because my dad comes over a lot. 2 But I mean, he has, he does drink every other day, that 3 you know, not every day but, you blow, more than usual. 4 Q. Okay. And how much would he drink at a 5 time? 6 A. Maybe like a six pack. 7 Q. And what does the six pack do to him? 8 A. He's a happy drunk. He don't even, you 9 know -- he might fall asleep on my couch or something, 10 but other than that he don't argue. He don't fight. He 11 usually keeps to himself outside. You /mow, he likes to 12 play with my dog and be outside by the fire and stuff 13 so, he -- 14 Q. What type of dog do you have? 15 A. I have a blue-nose pit. 16 Q. I am not familiar with that one, a 17 blue-nose what? 18 A. A blue-nose pit-bull. 19 Q. Okay. 20 A. She's a, her coat is -- well, her mother's 21 coat is gray with kind of like, you could say a blue 22 tint to it. So, she's black with a blue tint to her. 23 Q. How are pit-bulls as a pet? I mean you 24 hear about them in the news and stuff. 25 A. They are good dogs, if you train them -- I Page 15 1 doctor's office, but I don't really ask questions like 2 that, so I don't know what that is from. 3 Q. Fair enough. Okay. So, there was one 1 distant cousin who may have tried suicide? A. Yeah. 6 Q. Any history of substance use or alcohol 7 problems in the family? 8 A. My dad drinks. 9 Q. Okay. 10 A. My mom not too much, like you know, occasional 11 beer on the weekend or something, you know. 12 Q. Okay. 13 A. When my parents were younger, they 14 experimented, you would say. 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q. Okay. A. When my mom got pregnant with my brother she stopped completely experimenting or anything. My dad, a couple years back might have smoked some weed. Q. Okay. A. But he recently had been to get, you know, a job since it's so hard, they were Eking people. They have been really keeping up on the drug testing stuff. So as far as I know he's not doing nothing. But I mean, you know, a little, you know, he's not like hard core like going to get cocaine off the street or something, Page 17 1 mean, they arc protective, they — you know, to bark and 2 she's never bitten anyone, you know. I've had — she's 3 seven months old now. I've had her since she was 4 almost, you know, two months old or whatever and she's 5 never bit nobody. 6 I have a bad cat problem. This cat keeps 7 coming in my garden and stuff. And my cat, or my 8 dog doesn't chase her or nothing. She just looks at 9 her and tries to smell her, but she's a good dog. 10 My son doesn't like animals whatsoever. 11 Q. Okay. 12 A. So, you know, so -- but she's been around 13 other kids, you know, but my son, he won't go near no 14 kinds of animals. I don't know why, but he's scared of 15 them. 16 Q. And how old is your son? 17 A. He's two. Well, he will be two in March so 18 Re 20 months. 19 Q. Twenty months. And how's he doing? 20 A. He's good. 21 Q. And any significant health problems with 22 him or complications or... 23 A. No. 24 Q. And he is walking and talking and doing 25 all the things --iNtean.124.4Astatiantfi-Sear.4.4.41..t ,1 5 (Pages 14 to 17) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Ebtatronleally signed by eyr4his hopkins (8014514764034) blkb743b. al36-4111-a5e1PIA.157 EFTA00723686 Page 1 1 A. Yeah. 2 Q. that a two year old should be doing? 3 A. Yeah. 4 Q. I think you kind of already answered this 5 but I will just ask it again to make sure it's 6 clear. AS far as you know, no exposure to anything 7 while you're MOM was pregnant with you? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Okay. And dad's never struck you — 10 A. No. 11 Q. Mom had problems when he was drinking 12 where he lost his job? 13 A. No, no. 14 Q. DU1's, anything like that? 15 A. No. 16 Q. How long has he been doing about a six 17 pack every other day? 18 A. Man, ifs been a while. Maybe since I was 19 like 16. 20 Q. Sixteen? 21 A. Fifteen. You know, my mom and my parents 22 don't even sleep in the same bed together no more. i 23 guess they just — they still talk. They don't, you 24 know, fight, but I guess they don't want to be next — 25 he passes out and he sweats beer and, you know, she just 1 2 3 4 S 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 20 are religious, were you raised going to church? A. No. They tried. My, my dad is a Jehovah .Witness. Q. okay. A. And my mom's side was Christian or Catholic. So, yeah, they clash with how they were going to raise is I guess, so we didn't go to church. Q. Okay. A. My dad doesn't — before he was drinking, he, you know, was going to church a little bit but it faded. Q. Do you go to church now or... A. No. Q. Okay. How were you disciplined as a child growing up? A. I was grounded. Q. Okay. A. TV privileges taken, in my room with nothing. Q. And what would you get grounded for? What type of things? A. Out past my curfew. They said be in before the streetlights came on. My mom would tell me not to use my bike or something, and I would take it. Tell her I wanted to go somewhere when she told me no, and I would tell her yes, and you know kids stuff. Q. How was your family dynamic growing up? I Page 19 1 doesn't want him in her bed I guess. So, they dealt 2 sleep in the same bed. But i guess he drinks, so he 3 don't have to be around her. I mean 25 years of 4 marriage how, you know. They're not even married but -- 5 25 years together, I guess get sick of a person after a 6 while. 7 Q. It's -- they're doing better than the 8 national average. 9 A. They're trying. 10 Q. How was your childhood growing up? 11 A. It was all right. 12 Q. What did you lilce to do as a child? 13 A. I used to ride my bike a lot. I don't know, 14 play games with kids. I lived in this neighborhood. 15 There is a park in the neighborhood. And next door I 16 used to go there a lot and ride my bike and skate and 17 stuff. I used to do a lot of outdoor stuff. 18 Q. Skate as in roller skates or skateboard? 19 A. No. I used to have the four wheel skates, the 20 old ones. 21 Q. Not the inline? 22 A. No, no. 23 Q. Did you have a lot of friends growing up? 24 A. Yeah. 25 Q. I know you mentioned your aunts and uncles Page 21 1 mean good family, bad family, did you get along with 2 your parents? 3 A. Yeah, I guess. My, me and my mom got along. 4 When I was a little, little kid, I was attached to my 5 dad. i was more It a tomboy. But as i started 6 becoming a teenager, I was more, you know, my mom, 7 shopping and cooking and stuff. Q. And i was just noticing your jacket. Do 9 you like hunting and things like that or... 10 A. Ifs my dad's. 11 Q. Okay. I apologize. I am a little bit of 12 a slow writer, so I sometimes stop. 13 A. It's all right. 14. Q. Okay. And I know we're here due to 15 Epstein, so I am aware °tannic bit of what 16 happened there. But outside of that incident, have 17 you ever been physically, sexually, or emotionally 18 abused? 19 A. No. 20 Q. Okay. How was school for you? 21 A. All right. When I got In middle school I 22 started to get in fights and back talking teachers and, 23 yeah, dress node, and I guess you know teenage stuff, 24 rebelling. 25 Q. How old were you when you started middle I 6 (Pages 18 to 21) PROSE COURT REPORTING. AGENCY, INC. c ron ca y worm y cyn ta °plans (601-051.976.2934) bSeb743b-dao6-4bc1-aSeb-16350b255764 EFTA00723687 Page Gr Page 24 1 school? 2 A. Twelve or 13, around there, because I didn't 3 start school until I was Lice six. 4 Q. Okay. 5 A. Something like that. I was a late. 6 Q. Okay. So, were, you were kind of one of 7 the oldest kids in the class usually? 8 A. Yeah. 9 Q. Were you in any special education classes? 10 A. My fourth and fifth grade year, speech. I 11 have a bad problem with my S's. 12 Q. Okay. 13 A. I still do. 14 Q. Was this a speech therapy type thing? 15 A. Yeah. And I did it in sixth grade but... 16 Q. Were you ever diagnosed with, I hate the 17 word disorder, but a learning disorder? 18 A. No. 19 Q. A like dyslexia or 20 A. No. 21 Q. — not being able to add or anything like 22 that? 23 A. No, no. 24 Q. And you could learn to read okay? 25 A. Yeah. I mean, I would forget about, you know, 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 little kid stuff. Q. I mean, what were they saying? A. I don't really remember. I mean, lace, oh, she liked her boyfriend or you like him or I like him, or. Q. Okay. A. I mean like. Q. So, it would be over guys usually? A. Yeah. Lilco, you know, girl stuff. Q. Yeah. I may not be aware of what girl stuff is, so I am not trying to be funny here. So again, if -- and again different people have different things they argue with and stuff, so but what your experience is is what I am interested in. Did you ever need to go to a hospital due to a fight you were in? A. No. Q. Did anybody you fought with ever need to go to a hospital or got medical attention? A. I don't know. They might have been bleeding. I don't know if they - Q. Okay. A. -- got medical attention, because once I was pulled off of them or we broke each other up, I went one way and the other person went to another office, you 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 a 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 I don't know. I mean, he said, she said, you know, Page 23 like I could read a page and like not remember, you know, what I just read sometimes and have to go back and reread it, so... Q. Okay. A. Maybe I might have, but I, you know, I never found it -- Q. Okay. A. It was a problem. Q. And when you would write, you'd never reversed letters or -- A. No, definitely not. Q. Were you ever suspend or expelled from school? A. Yeah, I was suspended -- Q. What for? A. a lot. Fighting. Q. Okay. A. I wouldn't go to detention and detention leads to Saturday, Saturday school. Saturday school, if you don't go, it's three days in-school suspension. If you get thrown out of there, there is suspension. So, yeah, I had a lot of those. Q. Okay. Who would you fight? A. Random, like, girls that I had problems with. Page 25 1 know. 2 Q. Okay. 3 A. So — 4 Q. And do you remember how old you were when 5 that fight occurred? 6 A. I had a lot of fights. My first year in sixth 7 grade, more fights then because I was in sixth grade 8 twice so — 9 Q. Okay. Why did you repeat sixth grade? 10 A. The fighting. And I was always in the — they 11 had a, it was a grade office, so 1 was in the sixth 12 grade office and not in class where I was supposed to 13 be. So, I would get zero's or, you know, stuff like 14 that so I failed. 15 Q. And the time you had to be pulled off 16 someone, was that your first time in sixth grade or 17 your second time in sixth grade? 18 A. It was my first time. 19 Q. Did you ever use a weapon or take a weapon 20 to school? 21 A. Unit-tmh. 22 Q. Did you ever get knocked out in any of 23 these fights? 24 A. Yeah. I have gotten, my, I got my own couple 25 of times, you know. A handful of times. I could say ,CIFW1•1• 1“.6,...Vidi}e40.4.0•••2 7 (Pages 22 to 25) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Electronically signed by cynthle hopkIns (801481478.2934) bee0743trdae6-4bel-a5ob46350b 6575 EFTA00723688 1 2 3. 4 5 6 7 8 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 26 the same amount that, you know, half of than fights I didn't win, you know. Q. Okay. So, I mean these sound like serious fights. This wasn't just — A. I mean — Q. slapping a little bit and pushing into a locker? A. I mean, no. I mean, like I might have been in like three, throe fights that there was actually like bleeding. Q. Okay. A. But I mean like, one of them the girl came up to me and like was in my face and pushed me. And I was lice, you know. For some reason a lot of girls, like when I was going to school, like to wear rings and jewelry and like really, you know, now that I think about it, you know, kids are really brutal but, you know. I was one of those, you know, kids that — I would have -- I mean, it's only a couple of times but... Q. Okay. A. I guess I didn't want to be the one that didn't, you know, have rings on her fingers that, you know, had my face, you know, all messed up because I have had those times that, you know — Q. Where people would hit you and they 1 2 3 4 5 6 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page A. There was, a lot of kids would go to either Wendy's because it's right down the block or between pavilions. They are never inside the school, you know, like, by lockers or where teachers could get, you know — Q. Involved? A. Yeah. Q. Okay. I mean, was this like how they showed in the movies where somebody would pass you a note and say be at Wendy's at 3:30 or else or... A. No. They would tell somebody else and somebody else would, you know — Q. Set up the time? A. Yeah. Q. So, you would go knowing that a fight was going to happen? A. Yeah. Q. Okay. And did you ever initiate one of these like meetings or — A. I don't really think so. I don't know. I mean, most of the fights that I started wore outside the school because my mom would always pick me up at Wendy's Q. Yeah. Did you ever tell any teachers Page 27 1 would -- 2 A. Yeah. 3 Q. — have ring and you would get cut? 4 A. Yeah. I have a couple knots or scars on my 5 forehead from them. 6 Q. Okay. 7 A. And then like down here and stuff, you know. 8 I have my own scars from, you know, and I guess you 9 could say I learned from whatever fight that I had 10 previous to that and... 11 Q. Okay. And you -- when I say ;mocked out, 12 I moan like down on the ground cold, not moving. 13 don't remember what happened, unconscious. 14 A. No, l mean — 15 Q. Is that what you mean by knocked out or 16 what, what's your? 17 A. — like I was, there is times that I was on. 18 the floor and somebody was on top of me just punching me 19 in my face, or you know, it was the other way around or 20 you know. I mean, I have never passed out during a 21 fight or had somebody else passed out during a fight. I 22 got knocked down and was like get in my face almost into 23 the concrete, you know, kind of... 24 Q. Okay. Would these fights occur like in 25 the hallways or would this be after-school stuff 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 29 about this? A. Teachers started getting smart to it because they got their own little golf cart and started riding the sidewalk, or there was some, some woods with the trail next to the school and they used to go in there and by to beat the kids to Wendy's before, you know, the rest of, before the whole group got there and, you know, a fight broke out. Q. Okay. But you never, like, told the teacher or security officer anything that was going on or that you were worried there was going to be a fight or anything like that? A. I wasn't the only person that, you know, was starting these fights, these fights that were in the woods. Q. Okay. Sounds Ince it was a rough middle school? A. Yeah. I mean it's not as bad as it is now. There's kids that bring guns to school and stuff but -- Q. Okay. Were you ever fearful for your life while you lived there? A. No. Q. No one ever made like death threats against you or anything like that? A. No. We would fight but not like kids now like 8 Pa es 26 to 29 PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Electronically signed by cynthla hopkIns (601461.976.2934) b5tb743b-dac6-4bc1-a5o 6350b25 7 EFTA00723689 Page 30 1 when they shoot-up the cam or somebody's house, because 2 like a girl that they like, little kid stuff. It's not, 3 it wasn't like that growing up. 4 Q. Did you have any problems with truancy or 5 just not going to school? 6 A. I had, one time they picked me up, but it was 7 bogus. It wasn't even like the real truancy because .8 they kicked me out of school. They told me to leave, '9 that I was disruptive. 10 Q. Okay. 11 A. Yeah. 12 Q. How were you disruptive? 13 A. Talking, you know, passing notes. I mean, 14 girl stuff. 15 Q. Okay. !mean — 16 A. That couldn't waft. 17 Q. Okay. If it was getting to the point 18 where you were getting kicked out, that may go 19 beyond normal kind of girl stuff. So that's why Pm 20 asking. 21 A. You know, I didn't stop and say, you know, 22 they take the note away, obviously, I wanted to say what 23 I just said, so I would write it back and do it again or 24 just keep talking while they are trying to teach and -- 25 Q. Okay. Page 32 1 skipping and not going to school and stuff. So, 2 they had me go to this, it's Excel or something. 3 It's an alternative school on South Shore. I don't 4 remember what it was called, but ifs like a 5 Roosevelt Full Service that they have down here. 6 Q. I'm not familiar with Roosevelt Full 7 Service. 8 A. They, they take dropouts and like, you know, 9 disruptive kids that are on Tamarind and I think like 10 6th or 2nd or something. 11 Q. And what was the name of that school 12 again? 13 A. Roosevelt Full Service. 14 Q. Okay. 15 A. And I don't, I don't even think 1 went one 16 day. The school was in a bad, bad neighborhood. They 17 were hike, like I was going through the airport, you 18 know, metal detector my legs, make me take off my shoes. 19 I could, I could only bring a folder. And I can't,I 20 have to bring a certain kind of pencil, you know, 21 because they thought people were going to stab each 22 other with them. So, yeah, definitely did not go to 23 that school, no. So, I was around 16 or 15 around 24 there, and I just stopped going to school. 25 Q. So, just to make sure I got this straight Page 31 1 A. Just not-- 2 Q. And I apologize, I may have asked this 3 already, but did you ever get into a fight with a teacher or authority figure? A. No. I mean, they, they snatched my, like, my a pictures or my books or like have notebooks or stuff, 7 they would take it from my desk. But I have never a physically touched them to get it back or like I tell 9 them to give it back to me, but never works that way. 10 Q. Okay. So, you may gotten into verbal 11 arguments with the teachers •- 12 A. Yeah. 13 Q. -- but never struck them? 14 A. No, no. 15 Q. Okay. How far did you go in school? 16 A- Eighth grade. I did a year in Okeeheelee 17 Middle. That's a school on Pinehurst and Forest Hill. 18 It's by my house. And that's the, when I got into all 19 the fights at, so my parents switched me to Jefferson 20 Davis which is on Forest Hill and Kirk which is farther 21 from my house. They had to change addresses to, for me 22 to go to that school and stuff. So, I went there for my 23 second year of sixth grade and seventh grade. 24 And then in the middle of seventh grade 25 they sent me to an alternative school because I was Paae 33 1 you went to, was it Oakville? 2 A. No. I went to three different schools, 3 Okeeheelee. 4 Q. How do you spell that? 5 A. O-k-e-e-h-e-e-1-e-e. 6 g Okeeheelee. Okay. And you did that for 7 your sixth grade year? 8 A. Yeah. My first sixth grade year. 9 Q. And that was a rough school where you got 10 into a lot of fights? 11 A. Uh-huh, yes. 12 Q. And then your parents kind of changed 13 their address and moved a bit and then you went to 14 Jefferson Davis? 15 A. Yeah. 16 Q. And you did sixth and seventh there? 17 A. Yeah, and I — 18 Q. And you had problems going to school? 19 A. Yeah. L 20 Q. Attending classes. 21 A. In the first nine weeks I was, you know, goi 22 to school, or I was doing good. I was getting A's, 23 and es, whatever. But I started meeting people becaus 24 this school, when 1 switched to that school, 1 didn' 25 know nobody because that wasn't my neighborhoo 9 (Pages 30 to 33) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Electronically signed by cynthia hopkIna (101-061471,2934) becb74315-clae6-4bc1-55.5b 6 5 b 5 5 EFTA00723690 Page 34 1 wasn't, you know, where I lived. !just, you know, and 2 I started meeting new people and then that's where I 3 learned how to skip school. 4 Q. Okay. 5 A. And once I started skipping school, it was 6 like, why go if I can leave, you know. 7 Q. And were you getting into any fights at 8 Jefferson Davis? 9 A. No. I don't think so. I don't, I might have 10 got like, you know, like three or four referrals there. 11 But I mean like compared to where I ns before, I would 12 have got like that in like a week, you know, like a 13 couple times, I didn't, you know. 14 Q. Okay. 15 A. But I was never there. That's the point. You 16 know, like they would see me in the morning but not see 17 me in class. 18 Q. Gotcha. And who were you hanging out with 19 at Jefferson Davis? 20 A. A lot of people. A girl Nicole. 21 Q. Did you know Nicole's last name? 22 A. Danielle. No. I don't. I was in sixth, 23 seventh grade. 24 Q. Okay. Do you know Danielle's last name? 25 A. No. Page 36 1 Q. Didn't do eighth grade there? 2 A. No. I was, I started eighth, I was supposed 3 to start eighth grade in Roosevelt but... 4 Q. Okay. But you never went to Roosevelt? 5 A. No. I never -- I might have, like, signed in 6 fora day maybe but that's it. 7 Q. Okay. So, the last grade you completed 8 was — 9 A. Seventh. 10 Q. the seventh grade. Okay. All right. 11 Have you tried to go back and get a G.E.D. or 12 anything like that? 13 A. Yeah. I went and took the equivalency test 14 My reading and math are at a ninth grade level, but my 15 language is at a third grade level like my grarrunar 16 and — 17 Q Okay. Just to make sure I understand, so 18 you didn't pass the equivalency test when you took 19 it? 20 A. No. I wasn't at the grade level that- 21 Q. At the grade level that you needed to be? 22 A. Yeah, I was supposed to be in. I needed to 23 take, do a lot of extra work in the grammar part, like 24 punctuation and stuff, and I've never really finished. 25 Q. Okay. Have you tried to go to any, like, Page 35 1 Q. Okay. So, Nicole, Danielle 2 A. That wasn't even, like they weren't even in my 3 grade because like I said, I failed and then I was older 4 than I was supposed to. So all the kids that I was 5 friends with, weren't in my class. 6 Q. So, by this time you were about two years 7 older — 8 A. Yeah. 9 Q. -- than you were supposed to be. 10 A. So, I wasn't, you know, in the -- I wasn't 11 hanging out with those kind, those kids in my class. 12 Q. Okay. So, Nicole, Danielle, anyone else 13 you hung out with? 14 A. Jilissa. 15 Q. How do you spell that one? 16 A. J-i-l-s-s-a. There might be an I after the L. 17 Q. J-i-l-i-s-s-a? 18 A. Yeah. 19 Q. Okay. 20 A. I think that's how — she had a brother named 21 Walter. Those were, you know, like -- those were like 22 the main girls you could say but... 23 Q. So, were you at Jefferson Davis for sixth 24 and seventh grade? 25 A. Yeah. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 37 trade schools or anything like that, like cosmetology or -- A. I was looking at culinary school, but I need a, they want a GED or a high school diploma. And the grants are kind of it's — you know. They're kind of expensive. Q. Yeah. Okay. What type of jobs have you had? A. I worked with my mom when I was pregnant with my son. A. Okay. Where was that at? A. She works at -- she used to work at an insurance agency. Q. Okay. Which one? A. It's called A-Affonlable Auto Insurance. Q. Okay. A. They're an agency. They are not a — they sell policies, you know, they are not like Progressive Q. So, they are not GEICO but they would sell a GEICO policy? A. Yeah. Q. Okay. How long did you work there for? A. Well, my pregnancy until so, so I left February for — so February of '08 is when I left. And .10 10 (Pages 34 to 37) PROSE COURT REPORTING Electronically signed by ey opkIns (801.051-978.2934) AGENCY, INC. bscbusts-dase-4bct Asseb-teasotessis4 EFTA00723691 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 Page 38 1 I got pregnant, but I was in jail September, October, 2 October to February. 3 Q. Did you like working there? 4 A. Yeah. 5 Q. Okay. And anywhere else you worked? 6 A. I trained for a week at Little Caesar's Pizza 7 but they didn't, I guess didntt have a job forme. They 8 hired somebody else. I was too short to work the 9 register is what they told me. I had to wait for an 10 opening on the line to make pizza. So, they told me to 11 keep calling. 12 Q. Okay. 13 A. And I stopped calling. 14 Q. All right. are you on disability or 15 welfare or anything like that? 16 A. Unh-tath. 17 Q. With your son were you a part of a WIC 18 program or... 19 A. When he was first born but not anymore. 20 Q. Okay. And what were you doing when you 21 were working at the insurance agency? 22 A. Filing and copying and sending out checks or 23 whatever. I didn't answer the phone or write any 24 policies or nothing. I was on house arrest so they were 25 just giving me, you know, apiece out, and let me make Page 40 1 things to different people. So somebody might 2 say — 3 A. That's why — 4 Q. - well the first guy I kissed I was with 5 for only like three weeks, but it was the first time 6 and so it was significant to me. Other people would 7 say, no, ifs gotta he six months or longer. 8 A. That's why I asked. 9 Q. Yeah. So, whatever you feel is 10 significant or was an important part for you. 11 A. No, the first time was not. It was awkward 12 and weird and — 13 Q. Okay. So, who were your significant 14 relationships? 15 A. My husband, my boyfriend now or fiancee, 16 Aaron. 17 Q. So, what's Aaron's last name? 18 A. K-e-t-e-1-a-a-r. 19 Q. Okay. What age did you meet Aaron at? 20 A. I was 16 going on l7. 21 Q. Okay. Were you still in school at this 22 time or had you — 23 A. No. 24 Q. Okay. Where did the two of you meet? 25 A. Whore my work, my morn works, there's a Page 3 1 some money so I can help take care of my son. 2 Q. Okay. How did you get along with the 3 other people at the office? 4 A. Ifs only my mom and her boss, the guy that 5 owns the place, so I have known him since I was like six 6 or seven. So, he is great. He is, he is very well — be loves my son very much. He's great. Q. Okay. A. He is really good. Q. That's good to hear. Have you ever been in the military? A. (Witness shakes head.) Q. Fs going to take some time and talk to you about dating and things like that. When did you start dating? A. Like 13. Q. Okay. How many significant relationships have you had? A. Two. Q. Okay. A. Like you mean relationships that actually like were something? Q. Yeah. A. Okay. Yeah. 'Iwo. 25 Q. And again significant means different 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21. 22 23 24 25 Page 41 neighborhood next door. And since I went to Jefferson Davis it was close to that. And a lot of the kids in those, in that neighborhood were kids that I went to school with. So, I've seen, I'd seen him one time, you know, Ithe, his name is Macho, I don't even know, lace, his redraw, I don't even know why they call him that. But I seen him one time and Ike we were talking and whatever, and he was with Aaron. And me and Aaron started talking and, you know, that's how I started. Q. Okay. How old was Aaron when you first started dating him? A. Aaron was 18, 19. I think he was 19. Q. So, he was two to three years older? A. Huh? Yeah. Q. Was he in school at the time? A. No. Q. Was he working at the time? A. Yeah. Q. What does he do for a living? A. He works construction. He's, works on a grade crew. Q. Okay. For like roads? A. Yeah. Q. Okay. A He just started that grade crew job though, I 11 (Pages 38 to 41) PROSE COURT Beetrenleally signed by eynthla honking; (301-051476-2934) REPORTING AGENCY, INC. b5cti743bilae6-48c1 aSeb-16350b255754 EFTA00723692 Page 42 Page 44 1 because before he was a — he hung drywall. 2 Q. Okay. ' 3 A. That's how, when I met him he was hanging 4 drywall but now he's on a grade crew. 5 Q. Okay. Again with the downturn in the 6 economy, working on roads is probably a little more 7 stable. 8 A. Yeah. That Chinese drywall didn't go too 9 well. 10 Q. Was he putting up the Chinese stuff or was 11 he? 12 A. Huh? Yeah. He was in Palm Beach working on 13 the island, and you know, Boca and stuff. So he —1 14 don't think he got any infection or anything from it 15 but, you know, I think it was only a couple of houses 16 they did, not too many. 17 Q. All right. And I think you said he was 18 your fiancee or something. So are you still seeing 19 Aaron? 20 A. Yeah. He is the father of my son. 21 Q. Okay. So, how long have the two of you 22 been going out? 23 A. Since January of 2007. So, it will be three 24 years that I've been with him 25 Q. January 2007? 1 going to get married or just kind of a perpetual 2 engagement? 3 A. No. We don't have a date planned. I am still 4 trying to work on getting a stable, you know, car, and 5 place to live and you know, because we just barely moved 6 in like a couple of months ago. So, I am still waiting 7 on the ring. 8 Q. Understand. Has Aaron ever had any 9 nm-in's with the law or any problems? 10 A. Yeah. He got arrested in 2006 or 2005 or 11 something. He was, spent a year In jail for burglary 12 and he was put on probation after that, violated his 13 probation and in March of 2007 and got out of jail June 14 of 2007 and has not been back since or has any tickets 15 or nothing. I was kinds surprised he got his license 16 last year, no tickets or nothing so... 17 Q. What do you mean tickets like — 18 A. 'affle violations. 19 Q. Spading, seat belt? 20 A. Yeah, anything. Not, haven't had no problems. 21 Q. Does he have any tattoos? 22 A. Yeah. 23 Q. What's he got? 24 A. He has Palm Beach on his back. 25 Q. Okay. Page 43 1. A. Yes. 2 Q. Okay. And is it a good relationship? 3 A. Yeah. 4 Q. Any issues with domestic violence or 5 dating violence? 6 A. No. 7 Q. He's never hit you; you've never hit him? 8 A. No. 9 Q. All right. How does he get along with 10 your family? 11 A. Good. My mom's kind of a — she buys stuff 12 that's unnecessary. So like, she buys extra stuff, 13 like, you know, women do, if it's on sale they buy it 14 buy two or three or six of them. And Aaron is more like 15 a clean and neat person. So, you know, when we go over 16 there, because she lives right next to door to me. 17 So — 18 Q. Okay. 19 A. When we go over there, bring the baby over, 20 whatever, he complains about the clutter, about you 21 know, the mess. She's like leave my stuff alone. You 22 don't live hem. You know, I mean, they butt heads like 23 any in-laws do I guess with their daughter's boyfriend, 24 but they have learned to, I guess, love him. 25 Q. Do you guys have a date on when you're Page 45 1 A. With the area code. Oh, my God. That's so 2 finny. I don't know why he did that. I mean, to brand 3 yourself, I guess. I don't have no tattoos. 4 Q. Okay. He's got the area code? 5 A. Yeah. It says Palm Beach and then 561. 6 Q. Okay. And as far as you know that tattoo 7 has no significance or no meaning? 8 A. Oh, well, he was born in Palm Beach and he was 9 born in Lake Worth. And i guess that's what it means to 10 him. 11 Q. Okay. 12 A. I think it's ninny. 13 Q. Because a lot of times gangs will? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Tattoos, area codes, and things like 16 that — 17 A. No. He is not — 18 Q. He is not part of a gang? 19 A. No, no. 20 Q. Because that's like an identification 21 thing? 22 A. No. 2 3 Q. So if you're in the same gang, you know 24 what area you're from or if you're in a different 2 5 gang, you know which turf. 12 (Pages 42 to 45) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, INC. Electronically signed by cyrithis bodkins (601-0514714934) bkb743b-dae6-41x1-a5ob f6350b255764 EFTA00723693 Page 46 Page 48 1 A. No. 2 Q. No. 3 A. The only other tattoos are like his mother's 4 name and his dad's name and his, his brother died when 5 he was six months old. So that's the only other 6 tattoos. The only tattoo that is other than, you know, 7 family, is that one on his back. So, you could say that 8 was the one, he — oh, and he has a spider web right 9 here. But, so, you know, a spider web. He got those 10 tattoos before we met so... 11 Q. Okay. Did he get any while he was in jail 12 for the year? 13 A. Huh? 14 Q. Did he get any tattoos while he was in 15 jail? 16 A. Those were the tattoos. But we didn't meet 17 when his first when he did that year in jail. 18 Q So — 19 A. We met after wards. 20 Q. — the spider web he got in jail? 21 A. Yeah. All those tattoos. 22 Q. And palm Beach? 23 A. All those tattoos. I think that's one of the 24 reasons why he got them. 25 Q. All right. And you said you have no 1 Q. Does Aaron use any drugs or -- 2 A. No. 3 Q. Okay: Has he in the past? 4 A. Yeah. When he was doing that whole burglary 5 thing, I guess that's what, why he was burglarizing 6 people was — he had a problem. 7 Q. Do you know what he was using? 8 A. Cocaine. 9 Q. Did he go to a treatment caner or -- 10 A. Yeah. He went to the Drug Farm in, at the 11 stockade. 12 Q. Okay. And you said you had two 13 significant relationships. Who was the other one 14 since Aaron? 15 A. His name was James. lie passed away December 16 of 2006. 17 Q. What happened? 18 A. He shot himself. 19 Q. Pm sorry to hear that. 20 A. Yeah. 21 Q. What was James last name? 22 A. Sullivan. 23 Q. So, you met Aaron after lames? 24 A. Huh? 25 Q. You met Aaron after lames? Page 47 1. tattoos? 2 A. No. I have a piercing and it's because I can 3 take it out, and you know, when I don't -- because I've 1 had my tongue pierced and my belly but I've tooken (sic) them out and I got tired of them. So this is the only 6 thing. My ears pierced. 7 Q. Now, why a lip piercing? 8 A. I don't know. (teat of the moment I guess. I 9 didn't want to do my nose or, you know, my eyebrow. 10 That's the only, and I won't get a tattoo because I'm, 11 you know, I don't — I was thinking about getting my 12 son's name on my back, but I even put off on that 13 because I don't like needles. And to do that your body 14 is, you know, should really mean something, you know, if 15 you're going to brand your body like that, it's going to 16 sag to your butt when you turn 80, you know, so — 17 Q. Fair enough. 18 A. Yeah, so, you should be really, you know, like 19 don't put Micky Mouse on you, and you know, you're a 40 20 years old and you got Micky Mouse on you. I mean, it 21 doesn't, it doesn't look hot. It doesn't look good, you 22 'mow, so — 23 Q. I understand. 24 A. I actually put off on tattoos and stuff like 25 that. 1 2 3 4' 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Page 49 A. Yeah. I don't know what happened. It wasn't like I was looking or anything. We just met and just clicked and — Q. How old were you when you met him? A. Who, James? Q. Uh-huh? A. I was 16. It was like we were together for like six months or something. It wasn't really, you know, long, but it was like, you know, it stuck with me because, you know, it was a situation that, that happened. And like, you know, I did really like him, but I mean, we didn't end our relationship because of — we broke up because he died so... Q. Okay. So, where did you two meet, through school or... A. Throw)) friends. My aunt lives in his neighborhood. Q. Okay. A. I met him, yeah, where my aunt lives. Well, she used to live there. She don't live there no more. She just moved recently. Q. And I apologize. I know you said he passed away in 2006.. What happened there? A. He -- I don't know if he did it on purpose or It Wet an accident or whatever. a gunhad and 13 (Pages 46 to 49) PROSE COURT REPORTING AGENCY, .INC. Electronically signed by cynthia hopkins (601.061 478-2934) b6cb7430-clae6-4bc1-a5eb.16350b255754 EFTA00723694 Page 50 1 the next thing I know I seen him in the middle of the 2 road with blood coming out of his head. So, i don't 3 know if that was like intentional. 4 We got into a fight the night before„ and 5 he went out with some guy friends or whatever. You 6 know, how guys do when they get mad and you know, 7 just mown be away. And he left and he came back. 8 He was drunk or whatever. And I don't know. Just 9 went outside, and I don't know if he was like, you 10 know, playing with it or because he was messed up, 11. or i don't know. But, yeah, he, he shot himself or 12 it was back here so i don't know if he like, you 13 know, some people do it like, do it up here or like 14 in their mouth, or you know, when they commit 15 suicide -- 16 Q. Yeah. He held it 17 A. Yeah. That's why I don't know if it was like 18 intentional or like accidental. Like he might have been 19 like swinging it around because he was drunk, or I don't 20 know. it was back her